When they say "4GB-Vram" they mean total V-ram not just GPU dedicated V-ram

[MooP]

UPDATE: Looks like the support guy is wrong!

http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1508448-the-evil-within-releases-next-week-things-to-know/

My email to Bethesda Support

"Hello,
After your announcement for the Evil Within system requirements for PC I have a quick question regarding the amount of V-ram you are asking. I have a GTX 670 with 2GB of "Dedicated Memory" and from the .jpg ( http://i.imgur.com/9GrhYko.jpg ) I have attached in this question it shows I have a total of 4 gigs "Total Available Graphic Memory". Is your 4GB V-ram requirement meant for just dedicated V-ram (ram only on the video card) or total shared V-ram? (As in total video memory) . Thanks for reading my question and I hope to have a reply to it."

-Their reply-

"The 4GB V-ram requirement should mean total shared V-ram on your computer. So from looking at your computer properties, you should be fine for when The Evil Within comes out."

This is what Bethesda support told me when I emailed them this question. I posted a .jpg ( http://i.imgur.com/CyHfSOv.jpg?1 ) of this email if you dont believe me.

Rest of my PC specs are on my steam profile, but i know the main concern people had was the V-ram needed to play this game.

A person on steam named "TESler [RUS]" said this on another forum and I doubted him about the V-ram making me email Bethesda support if this reply correct then he was right, This is how you can check if you have the correct amount of total V-ram needed to play The Evil within on recommended settings.

-TESler [RUS]-
"No. I have GTX 760 with 2 GB of RAM and 4096 mb of VRAM. You can check your VRAM:
Right-click on the Desktop and click Personalize.
Click Display in the bottom left corner of the Window.
Click the Change display settings on the left column.
Click the Advanced settings link to view a windows similar to the example below."
-Quote from "TESler [RUS]-"

This should be on the front page of the forums so if you can people just post a reply "+1" to keep this on the main page or post your comments long as people say something on this thread it will keep it in the front pages.

[Dr.Metroid]

We shouldnt even have to talk about this ♥♥♥♥.
Release the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ minimum specs. The face that they are not makes me think it is some horribly optimised game.

[MooP]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Martin:

I don't trust this one bit, i know very little about how all this works but i have never heard of "Shared ram" being used for games. I mean my system says it has almost 12gb shared "graphics memory" but only 3gb Video memory (780ti). I thought games only used the dedicated Vram on your graphics card or the shared if you run integrated.

Its because of "nextgen" consoles, They use unified memory now and if this is a real port they prolly use the same idea PC wise. PS4 and Xbone have 8 gigs of ram total but not all is used for the games about 4 gigs or more/less is for the system or "console OS" then the other half is for the games its shared memory for "Ram/GPU V-ram" console wise. If the engine was built to work this way then it will use shared ram PC wise also.

[Martin]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από «(MooP)»™:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Martin:

I don't trust this one bit, i know very little about how all this works but i have never heard of "Shared ram" being used for games. I mean my system says it has almost 12gb shared "graphics memory" but only 3gb Video memory (780ti). I thought games only used the dedicated Vram on your graphics card or the shared if you run integrated.

Its because of "nextgen" consoles, They use unified memory now and if this is a real port they prolly use the same idea PC wise. PS4 and Xbone have 8 gigs of ram total but not all is used for the games about 4 gigs or more is for the system or OS then the other half is for the games its shared memory for "Ram/GPU V-ram" console wise. If the engine was built to work this way then it will use shared ram PC wise also.

Yeah i get that but ps\c's don't work that way unless you are using an itegrated chip. When you use a dedicated gpu only the Vram on the card is used.....Unless devs have gone to great lengths to program it otherwise, you really think they will have done that? It's more than likely a straight port, not done well.

Everyone i know says its either or, not both. Sounds to me like a case of crossed wires here and wishfull thinking.

just gotta wait and see i guess.

Note: all my info is coming from guys who build pc's lol, so don't flame me, i'm just as curious as everyone else.

[MooP]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Martin:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από «(MooP)»™:

Its because of "nextgen" consoles, They use unified memory now and if this is a real port they prolly use the same idea PC wise. PS4 and Xbone have 8 gigs of ram total but not all is used for the games about 4 gigs or more is for the system or OS then the other half is for the games its shared memory for "Ram/GPU V-ram" console wise. If the engine was built to work this way then it will use shared ram PC wise also.

Yeah i get that but ps\c's don't work that way unless you are using an itegrated chip. When you use a dedicated gpu only the Vram on the card is used.....Unless devs have gone to great lengths to program it otherwise, you really think they will have done that? It's more than likely a straight port, not done well.

Everyone i know says its either or, not both. Sounds to me like a case of crossed wires here and wishfull thinking.

just gotta wait and see i guess.

Software over the years has shown that you can tweak and change how hardware works tho yes i agree i dont believe that the devs went that far to tweak the game for PC, but we wont know till release date...

[Duke]

This Vram situtation is not because the game looks so great... actualy it looks mediocre

The next gen consoles have 8GB shared ram and for the pc version they are to lazy to code around so they just pump it in the GPU Memory.

And when there are 8GB gpus out you will see how the recommendet specs will rise further

[Omelette Du Fromage]

I do not know what the fuss is about. I read and followed the steps above and discovered I have exactly 4096MB or 4GB or Total Video memory on my GTX670Ti, a year old or so card. People post here with MUCH better cards and complain, probably because of this weird misunderstanding of VRAM Bethesda is referring to.

Only the huge HDD requirement is what I'm worried about because of limited download allowance here in Australia. I agree, the graphics really doesn't reflect the somewhat huge requirements but I'm still keen on grabbing this game when it's closer to launch.

[OJ191]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από «(MooP)»™:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Martin:

I don't trust this one bit, i know very little about how all this works but i have never heard of "Shared ram" being used for games. I mean my system says it has almost 12gb shared "graphics memory" but only 3gb Video memory (780ti). I thought games only used the dedicated Vram on your graphics card or the shared if you run integrated.

Its because of "nextgen" consoles, They use unified memory now and if this is a real port they prolly use the same idea PC wise. PS4 and Xbone have 8 gigs of ram total but not all is used for the games about 4 gigs or more/less is for the system or "console OS" then the other half is for the games its shared memory for "Ram/GPU V-ram" console wise. If the engine was built to work this way then it will use shared ram PC wise also.

Actually the PS4 only uses 3.5GB for the OS not 4 and the developers can also use up to another 1 GB of that if necessary, though I have heard that can be difficult to use allegedly. Really I don't know exactly how it works so only 4.5gb is 100% guaranteed to be usable.

and ALL 8GB of it is high bandwidth GDDR5 so you can probably get away with using less RAM total since you can stream stuff in and out faster (though exactly how much of a difference it makes I have no idea).

I have no idea about details for the XB1.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Omelette Du Fromage:

Only the huge HDD requirement is what I'm worried about because of limited download allowance here in Australia. I agree, the graphics really doesn't reflect the somewhat huge requirements but I'm still keen on grabbing this game when it's closer to launch.

This is why it's a PS4 purchase for me, even heavily compressed I doubt it could go below 25gb and that is 1/8 of our download cap which we also need for work and studies and such.

[Glurk]

This thing will cause so much butthurt at the launch, it would be quite a show.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Dr.Metroid:

]

. Plus, did you ever try a mod requiring 4GB of vram on Skyrim ? It doesn't work very well even with the extra shared memory because it's a lot slower to use the "general" RAM than vram (you have micro-freeze or normal freeze and stuff like that


Yeah, Because skyrim mods actually do need 4gb of dedicated VRAM.
Hopefully the rep is right and they actually ment shared instead of dedicated.

Except no one ever asked for a minimum "shared video memory" in system requirements, that would be a first. For me, "4GB of VRAM" is clear : 4GB of dedicated video memory.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από «(MooP)»™:

Its because of "nextgen" consoles, They use unified memory now and if this is a real port they prolly use the same idea PC wise. PS4 and Xbone have 8 gigs of ram total but not all is used for the games about 4 gigs or more/less is for the system or "console OS" then the other half is for the games its shared memory for "Ram/GPU V-ram" console wise. If the engine was built to work this way then it will use shared ram PC wise also.

They are just lazy, the engine was not built to only work on console, it's supposed to be multiplatform. Look at Ryse, it's ten time superior technically but the 4GB VRAM is only required to play in 4K.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Omelette Du Fromage:

I do not know what the fuss is about. I read and followed the steps above and discovered I have exactly 4096MB or 4GB or Total Video memory on my GTX670Ti, a year old or so card. People post here with MUCH better cards and complain, probably because of this weird misunderstanding of VRAM Bethesda is referring to.

Only the huge HDD requirement is what I'm worried about because of limited download allowance here in Australia. I agree, the graphics really doesn't reflect the somewhat huge requirements but I'm still keen on grabbing this game when it's closer to launch.

It's an arbitrary value, if you have 8GB RAM, the "total video memory" will always be 4GB no matter the videocard you have (even the lowest crap). But no game use that extra memory because it's too slow for games, it may be used for other tasks I guess (video rendering or stuff like that).

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από OJ191:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Omelette Du Fromage:

Only the huge HDD requirement is what I'm worried about because of limited download allowance here in Australia. I agree, the graphics really doesn't reflect the somewhat huge requirements but I'm still keen on grabbing this game when it's closer to launch.

This is why it's a PS4 purchase for me, even heavily compressed I doubt it could go below 25gb and that is 1/8 of our download cap which we also need for work and studies and such.

Boxed PC version is also possible.

[Pupper for a lifetime]

So i have 3.8, does it mean im pretty much ♥♥♥♥♥♥?

[SyberWolf™]

its better to not use the shared vram that means your video card will start using your system ram (and its MUCH slower than vram) to compensate for the lack of vram and that will result in loss of performance. so if your card has 2GB than u should try to not exeed 2 GB despite it saying 4 GB. but yes u could use the shared ram but it wont be optimal.

[R0bb0b]

Interesting read about how the ps4 is able to use GDDR5 for system ram efficiently:

"Just as an example…when the CPU and GPU exchange information in a generic PC, the CPU inputs information, and the GPU needs to read the information and clear the cache, initially. When returning the results, the GPU needs to clear the cache, then return the result to the CPU. We’ve created a cache bypass. The GPU can return the result using this bypass directly. By using this design, we can send data directly from the main memory to the GPU shader core. Essentially, we can bypass the GPU L1 and L2 cache. Of course, this isn’t just for data read, but also for write. Because of this, we have an extremely high bandwidth of 10GB/sec.

Also, we’ve also added a little tag to the L2 cache. We call this the VOLATILE tag. We are able to control data in the cache based on whether the data is marked with VOLATILE or not. If this tag is used, this data can be written directly to the memory. As a result, the entirety of the cache can be used efficiently for graphics processing.

This function allows for harmonization of graphics processing and computing, and allows for efficient function of both. Essentially “Harmony” in Japanese. We’re trying to replicate the SPU Runtime System (SPURS) of the PS3 by heavily customizing the cache and bus. SPURS is designed to virtualize and independently manage SPU resources. For the PS4 hardware, the GPU can also be used in an analogous manner as x86-64 to use resources at various levels. This idea has 8 pipes and each pipe(?) has 8 computation queues. Each queue can execute things such as physics computation middle ware, and other prioprietarily designed workflows. This, while simultaneously handling graphics processing.

This type of functionality isn’t used widely in the launch titles. However, I expect this to be used widely in many games throughout the life of the console and see this becoming an extremely important feature."

Mark Cerny - http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=532077


Of course this also means that in order to upgrade, the entire system might as well be replaced, but since it is a console it doesn't really matter. Unfortunately, or fortunately for most folks, this is probably also the future of the PC because it is more efficient and all around cheaper. The trade off is the lack of upgradability, but PC gamers don't really drive the market anyway.

[Glurk]

I think Mantle and DX12 use that too, the CPU and GPU directly read the data at the same place (VRAM or RAM) and the whole process saves time (more performance) by not copying and flushing data every time the GPU wants to "tell" something to the CPU and vice versa.

I don't think PC will become monolithic and closed like consoles, there are still ways to improve performance without doing that.

[Jpux]

No matter what happens, they will be patching this ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ so people can actually play their game.


Im ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ tired of developers

[Charade]

there is no "not dedicated" v-ram

2gb is what you have.

[Martin]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από OJ191:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από «(MooP)»™:

Its because of "nextgen" consoles, They use unified memory now and if this is a real port they prolly use the same idea PC wise. PS4 and Xbone have 8 gigs of ram total but not all is used for the games about 4 gigs or more/less is for the system or "console OS" then the other half is for the games its shared memory for "Ram/GPU V-ram" console wise. If the engine was built to work this way then it will use shared ram PC wise also.

Actually the PS4 only uses 3.5GB for the OS not 4 and the developers can also use up to another 1 GB of that if necessary, though I have heard that can be difficult to use allegedly. Really I don't know exactly how it works so only 4.5gb is 100% guaranteed to be usable.

and ALL 8GB of it is high bandwidth GDDR5 so you can probably get away with using less RAM total since you can stream stuff in and out faster (though exactly how much of a difference it makes I have no idea).

I have no idea about details for the XB1.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Omelette Du Fromage:

Only the huge HDD requirement is what I'm worried about because of limited download allowance here in Australia. I agree, the graphics really doesn't reflect the somewhat huge requirements but I'm still keen on grabbing this game when it's closer to launch.

This is why it's a PS4 purchase for me, even heavily compressed I doubt it could go below 25gb and that is 1/8 of our download cap which we also need for work and studies and such.

i call this pr bull, why then does ps4 struggle to run most games at 1080p 60fps anywhere near the level a mid range pc with nowhere near 4gb Vram. Look at any multiplat out there right now.

It's just like the cell rubbish with PS3, they claimed all this back then yet the ps3 never matched PC. Let us wait and se just how the PC version runs 1st.