Too many bonesharks?

[Sephiroth]

OK, is it just my bad luck or are there WAY too many bonesharks? I wanted tot ry my hand at using thermal power to run a base so I started searching for thermal vents. I found one in the north of the shallows, one int he south of the shallows, and then a bunch of them at ground level (~500m) beneath the floating islands. The problem however, is that there is a boneshark roughly every six feet. I cannot shock them fast enough with the seamoth to keep them at bay.

This seems to be a thing everywhere with the latest patch. I go anywhere else and it's either bonesharks or those electric eels. It seems like the only place possible to build is the shallows or the Lost River. Nothing in-between, unless you want to run one of the reactors which requires constant babying. I'd like to have a base deeper, outside of leviathon reach, but I cannot find a location where there is a way to power it without spending my time filling a reactor.

I believe the real issues here are simple though. Why are there like seven thermal vents in one spot and nowhere else? On top of that the electrical draw of some components is so high you cannot afford to power the base any way but thermal or solar unless you enjoy feeding reactors. Power needs a major overhaul!

As an example my current base is in the shallows at exactly 10m. Three MP rooms, each with four solar panels, for a total of twelve panels. I had a single filtration machine and the panels powered it with ease as well as adding multiple power units per second. I add a single battery charger, no batteries yet, and the power starts dropping. Currently the base has a moonpool with modification station, two battery chargers, a powercell charger, and the filtration machine. It is powered by twelve panels, a bioreactor, and three thermal reactors. Power fluctuates constantly and never gets maxed. That's kind of crazy.

I guess the third issue would be that the ONE place they added thermal vents they added about a million bonesharks. Are we meant to build anywhere but the starting zone and end zone?

[tzeneth]

Thanks Squeal. Just means we have to wait until the next update for less Boneshark soup. Hopefully that'll help but I'm kind of curious if that's enough but I'm probably just thinking 40% of a metric #### ton is still a lot.

[or0b0ur0s]

Originally posted by tzeneth:

Thanks Squeal. Just means we have to wait until the next update for less Boneshark soup. Hopefully that'll help but I'm kind of curious if that's enough but I'm probably just thinking 40% of a metric #### ton is still a lot.

The way I read that is "new spawn rate is 60% of the old one". Meaning, everyplace we are currently seeing 3 Bonesharks, we'll see 2 going forward, roughly.

I applaud the change, but I also question whether it will be enough, especially without change to the creatures' "DROP EVERYTHING TO ATTACK PLAYER AT EXTREME RANGE AT ALL TIMES" behavioral AI.

Honestly, the Boneshark population in the Mushroom Forests, Bulb Zone, and Crag Fields went up proportionately to the Islands. It's just that the Islands were already much more heavily populated to begin with, and so went from "bad" to "intolerable", whereas the other areas went from "tolerable" to "pretty bad". There's no mention of adjusting any area but the Islands, unfortunately. The levels were pretty good pre-Ghost Update. And the Islands sharks were concentrated at the edge, not camping the wreck in swarms like they are now.

Although I must admit that, as someone above put it and I forgot to second, the Ampeels in the Bulb Zone are a much bigger problem now, almost reaching Crabsnake population levels. In some places in the Bulb zone (places you want to get to, like Lifepod 12), there isn't room to drive a Seamoth between them, literally (I tried). There ARE more Bonesharks now than before, but they're still drowned out by all that zapping everywhere...

[Sephiroth]

Originally posted by Squeal Like a Pig:

Boneshark spawn rates have been reduced in underwater islands, but only fairly recently in the experimental version.

[Edit - specifically the change was a reduction to 60% of the previous amount, and was checked in on the 5th of September]

Awesome! I love it when the devs chime in, even if we're being silly about an issue, such as "boneshark soup". I start a fresh game at each update so I'll be anxious to check that area out. I also note a LOT of bonesharks south of the shallows before the grand reef, but not as many as the floating islands.

I do like the bonesharks. They look awesome and remind me of a sturgeon (dad was a wildlife fish biologist before retiring) but on a larger, more agressive scale. I just don't like my seamoth and prawn getting obliterated because they come in packs of a dozen or so!

[Mazian]

Too many bonesharks, agree-- but there are solutions. Grab anything with the Propulsion Rifle, and throw it at a Boneshark. If fauna (even aggressive fauna) takes damage it will run away (at least outside of Leviathans and I haven't done any specific testing with them.)

When you get to PRAWN, you can use the regular PRAWN arm as an attack to scare away fauna.

When you get the PRAWN Propulsion arm, you can grab large things and even some hostile fauna.

There is also a Seamoth & Cyclops upgrade (each) that discourages hostile fauna from attacking you-- and you can outrun all fauna in a Seamoth if you just book it straight away.

Ampeels didn't give me much trouble. I never saw a Crabsnake once I managed to get a vehicle. They only wandered around while I was fleshy and tasty.


My first real interaction with the Bonesharks was over towards the Jelly Cove area (near the 2nd Degrasi, under-water base.) I should have gone exploring their a lot sooner but until I got a PRAWN I wasn't all that keen to do that kind of exploration. And once I had the PRAWN, it was way overkill for the hostiles.

If you take 15-25% damage, you clear out the area (scare it away with a few love taps) hop out and repair your PRAWN with your hand-held repair gun and back in to explore more.


The problem is that prior to getting all of those ships and upgrade modules, Bonesharks and other things are super dangerous to your character with only a seaglide and 135 oxygen tank. It's not well balanced. A slight reduction would go well towards proper balancing.

[ImHelping]

Originally posted by Mazian:

Too many bonesharks, agree-- but there are solutions. Grab anything with the Propulsion Rifle, and throw it at a Boneshark. If fauna (even aggressive fauna) takes damage it will run away (at least outside of Leviathans and I haven't done any specific testing with them.)

Did you even see the OP image?

Originally posted by Sephiroth:

. The problem however, is that there is a boneshark roughly every six feet. I cannot shock them fast enough with the seamoth to keep them at bay.

"Just throw salt at it with your propulsion gun!" being some kind of fallback mantra is really, really stretched thin these days.

And a 60% reduction of... That, is only a first baby step to sorting an issue that's long cropped up in the development. If certainly at one of it's more outlandish extremes the past few months.

A "Slight reduction" being needed is a drastic Understatement.

I expect it to at least be sorted before launch, but what a ride until then.

[Squeal Like a Pig]

Originally posted by or0b0ur0s:

Honestly, the Boneshark population in the Mushroom Forests, Bulb Zone, and Crag Fields went up proportionately to the Islands. It's just that the Islands were already much more heavily populated to begin with, and so went from "bad" to "intolerable", whereas the other areas went from "tolerable" to "pretty bad". There's no mention of adjusting any area but the Islands, unfortunately. The levels were pretty good pre-Ghost Update. And the Islands sharks were concentrated at the edge, not camping the wreck in swarms like they are now.

There were absolutely no adjustments made to bone shark spawn rates for the Ghost update.

[Zemecon]

There is a boneshark camping out around a wreck scatter in the Safe Shallows in my current saved game but that seems to have more to do with leashing than the spawn rate. I guess we will see if the spawning decrease in the underwater islands will help lighten things up elsewhere. If there is any lightening up to be had.

[RokuroCarisu]

I have not seen Bonesharks in the Shallows in my game so far, but two have moved into a Kelp Forest near it. O_o

[or0b0ur0s]

Originally posted by Squeal Like a Pig:

Originally posted by or0b0ur0s:

Honestly, the Boneshark population in the Mushroom Forests, Bulb Zone, and Crag Fields went up proportionately to the Islands. It's just that the Islands were already much more heavily populated to begin with, and so went from "bad" to "intolerable", whereas the other areas went from "tolerable" to "pretty bad". There's no mention of adjusting any area but the Islands, unfortunately. The levels were pretty good pre-Ghost Update. And the Islands sharks were concentrated at the edge, not camping the wreck in swarms like they are now.

There were absolutely no adjustments made to bone shark spawn rates for the Ghost update.

I hear you, (and thank you), and I wouldn't DARE contradict someone with actual access to the logs, etc.

But that's exactly what was said about the tripling and quadrupling effect sometimes seen in Sandsharks last year that occasionally made Plateaus and the Shallows utterly unlivable for a while about a year ago. I'd even be willing to bet you didn't make any adjustments to Crabsnake spawns this year, yet there are now more Crabsnakes than Jellyshrooms for them to hide in. I think a lot of people will back me up in saying that was not originally the case.

If you lot aren't making these changes, as you've consistently been saying, then where do they come from? Some kind of duplication bug? Are the Bonesharks supposed to be spawning 1 at a time instead of clusters of 3 and 5 like I've seen?

Whether you changed anything or not, there are suddenly vast amounts more of them than there were. And you can see I"m not exaggerating (thanks OP) or that I'm not the only one seeing this. Presumably your own professional playtesters also saw something or you wouldn't be making the adjustment you mentioned. So why do critter populations spike like this from update to update if it's not a change by UWE?

[Raven]

cant u just breed a few amp eels, and release them near your base? :)

[RokuroCarisu]

Originally posted by MasterDk78:

cant u just breed a few amp eels, and release them near your base? :)

Guess what those would do to you.

[🦊 Hermit]

Originally posted by Squeal Like a Pig:

There were absolutely no adjustments made to bone shark spawn rates for the Ghost update.

As or0 said, I'd have to ask what did change then to make this situation? In the past I have driven prawn suits and seamoths into the islands biome with little issue - the occasional bone shark attack, easily delt with by the drill arm or the perimeter defense, and not much else. Yes I've had to be wary and keep an eye open, which is a good thing, but I wasn't met with insurmountable odds.

But as I said in a post earlier in this topic, since the ghost update I took my prawn past the mountains biome on my way from the GUN to the safe shallows, and within 20 seconds of entering the biome my suit went from 100% health to 20%. An absolute swarm of the things were coming at me relentlessly, and hitting me one after the other, so much so that if I hadn't jumped out and begun to repair whie they were still attacking I would have lost my suit in 20 seconds flat. This did not happen before the update, somethintg definitely changed...if not the population of the sharks then their aggression or agro range maybe?

Btw as a side note, thanks very much for your responses here Pig, always good to see devs interacting with their fanbase and taking their feedback into consideration^^ Big props to you and UW for that.

[Damnion]

Im thinking the sharks speed, chase distance, or sight range was buffed. If you take the seamoth and spin around real quick you can see a long line of sharks chasing you, then when you slow down they catch you all at once and don't always go back to where they started from.

[ImHelping]

I want to imagine a whimsical situation where late at night, gremlins break into their office and make all the code changes that result in things like bizarre predator spam.

Unintended consequences or things just going wrong is common in gamedev, plenty of games I love run into those issues.

But that's boring, compared to "We didn't increase their spawns. We're waiting to hear back from the wizard we hired to remove the ancient curse from our data server."

[Sephiroth]

I try not to hurt things. The AI is coded so when ANYTHING runs away, it heads straight for 0, 0, 0 which is the shallows. Specifically directly above my scanner room. Try it. Shoot something at a boneshark. It heads closer to 0, 0, 0 every time it flees. I have managed to get every gasopod in the entire game crowded at 0, 0, 0 bydoing loops around the shallows with a seamoth and shocking them each time. I do NOT want to hurt anything due to this.