Playing with undeads or demons is useless

[AgeOfBacon]

As the title says, they're so much weaker than the horde that it's pretty unfunny to play with them. You get ♥♥♥♥♥♥ at the first wave of enemies because none of your early units can stand more than 3 hits and do almost no damage. And since there is a delay to make more of them, each time a unit appear, it's immediatly killed by the enemies already here, who then go back to destroying your dungeon.
As if you wanted us to play the horde only, since the other 2 factions aren't interesting unless you're in multiplayer and no one attacks you before 10 minutes. The AI doesn't wait. Factions are unbalanced. It's not that the horde is overpowered (as i've seen in another discussion) but the others who are too weak. Hell, even the undead magic sucks.

[Gummiel]

While I agree that undead seem weak (with having no healers and all that), demons by no means are weak, though yes quite tricky in early game, but get past that and into lategame units and demons are super strong. But orcs sure are by far the easiest to play with

[AgeOfBacon]

Originally posted by Enso Gummiel:

While I agree that undead seem weak (with having no healers and all that), demons by no means are weak, though yes quite tricky in early game, but get past that and into lategame units and demons are super strong

Problem is that in solo, AI doesn't wait for you to get powerful units, the first wave come after a couple minutes and they kick your ass really hard.

[Gummiel]

I beat the ai consistenly with demons

[uni790]

Originally posted by Enso Gummiel:

I beat the ai consistenly with demons

Share some tips then, as I would love to play as something different, lol

[Meat Kirby with a Knife]

A couple tips for playing with Demons: find the mana crystal and start mining ASAP! Expand your population immediately (First non-building or unit gold expense, you need 100 mana). While 4-5 troops don't stand a chance against the early adventurer's bumrush, 6 or 7 military units is good. Also, rush a hall of admiration, so you can heal and be productive (It's sort of a hospital bed and brewery rolled into one). Keep expanding your population, and try to get 1 demon gathering each resource. Don't try to dig the whole dungeon out right away, instead just focus on the essential resources you need to get going. Once you get your resources fixed and the torture chambers built, it's smooth sailing. It's totally fine to have 10-14 servants early on, because once you start upgrading troops, you have to sacrifice one each time.

[BlueKando]

You have to build/buy the "tank" units as fast as you can and support them with your dps units for does races.
Very simple

What do i mean by that?

With the Undead there tier 1 "tank" unit are the zombies and you need to build a ?forge? room and at least one of the "forge" buildings (3x3 space) before you can even start to recruit them.

With the demon i totaly forgot the name ?firedemon? maybe? Its the unit you can start to hire when you build at least one demonforge with building. (be careful its the least tanky one)

To narrow it down even more if some people dont understand already which room i mean, its the room where you do your unit upgrades, like for example faster digging speed.

Horde has 1 major advantage, there basic unit is tanky and still does a good amount of damage (Orcs), in mobas you would call him a bruiser.
But even they will die realtivly fast in comparison to there real tank unit (troll) if you dont support them with healers.

Thats THE MAJOR reason why horde feels so much tankier/easy.

But just because horde early is easier does in no way mean the other factions are useless.
Infact, by design a tier 3 army (or better a mix of tier 2 and 3) of undead/demons are slightly stronger then a horde one.


Tips for defending a early dungeon.

Basic
Build your forge room so that it is the first an invading army has to go through that means tanks are the first in combat and can do there job and tank.

Advanced
Do the same like in the basics BUT build at least a 2x2 guardroom in front of the forge room the enemys have to walk over, guard rooms have a expensive 2x2 "building" alarm call/horn. That means when enemys walk over the guard room the alarm will sound and all your units will rush to the guard room to defend your dungeon.
Bonus point for if you build a strong door between the guard room and the forge room.

You can even right click/slap the alarm horn to call all your units there without needing for enemys to walk over the room first.

UNDEAD SPECIFIC

BUILD A PERFECT GRAVEYARD! As fast as you can afford it.

Perfect means a room is surrounded by walls and as soon as you can 1 or more doors depending on how many exits you want/need to have.
Undead can not heal so a dead unit needs to resurrect at the graveyard. And the time before they are available again without a perfect room is way to long.
Its because rooms have a efficiency bar and they are more effective when it is closer to a "perfect" room.

General Tip

Of course the are also traps. And with the right setup. Or with the abuse of mechanics and your economy you can even make your dungeon safe from bards, with traps alone.

Yes you are at a slight disadvantage as demons/undead compared to horde but with your tier 2-3 upgraded units this will change dramaticaly so try to rush for does upgrades if you can.
I know, it sounds easier then it is but its worth it.

[Synavix]

I'm new to the game and have just been playing through the campaign and just did the demon levels, so I appreciate the tips as well.

I think I have a much better understanding of the demons now, but I'm not sure if their traps are supposed to feel so useless. With orcs you could throw down a couple goo or spike floors under one of the spin traps, and maybe a chest to "lure" them and invaders will get destroyed...either by the chest itself or by the spin trap while they're trying to walk through the area/kill the door. But all the traps I tried with demons either got ignored or disabled.

[uni790]

Originally posted by Synavix:

I'm new to the game and have just been playing through the campaign and just did the demon levels, so I appreciate the tips as well.

I think I have a much better understanding of the demons now, but I'm not sure if their traps are supposed to feel so useless. With orcs you could throw down a couple goo or spike floors under one of the spin traps, and maybe a chest to "lure" them and invaders will get destroyed...either by the chest itself or by the spin trap while they're trying to walk through the area/kill the door. But all the traps I tried with demons either got ignored or disabled.

Honestly the only traps with the orcs I even bothered to use, were the boulders, and the chests, everything else that little bard guy just disabled, lol with the demons I haven't bothered with their traps at all, at least to the second teir, as they're like the orc's initial traps, useless.

[lordanthrax]

Another tip is to use your spells to buff your units. With the Horde, casting For The Horde! before engaging will rev them up and get them to hammering the enemy. The more units you have, the better.

With Demons, make sure to take advantage of their shielding spell on your main tank unit as you drop it in to buy even more time for pounding the enemy flat.

Also, keep in mind ranged units tear hard into the massive units like Trolls/Zombies/Ember Demons, and try to knock them down quick so the others can just ping off them and get dead from your massed squad.

[Synavix]

Yeah I was using the shielding spell a lot, it seemed great. Thanks for the tips all.

[Sire]

I find the Horde's traps to be all right. I like spamming Spike Traps and the "Tesla Coil" (The "Axe Blades" also work), but one simply needs to get rid of those accursed Bards before they disable your traps. Your basic offensive spell, Thunder or Fireball, will work here if you have an ample mana supply. If set up properly, the traps can fend off attack waves on their own as long as one dispatches the Bard with a spell.

As for the Demons, the Spider Nest is pretty powerful Tier 1 trap, but it is useless against armored units (like the Dwarves). The Spiders will tear apart farmers and simple militia, and they can be used as simple meatshields for your main forces if fighting with them.

* * * * *

Overall, the Horde is far easier to play than Demons because Orcs are good at soaking up damage and dishing them out. However, late-game, I feel like Demons have the advantage due to better spells and more deadly T3 units. Early game Demon sucks because nothing can really take hits.

For me, with a pop limit of 15 when playing Demon, I try and go for...

1-2 Shadow (Mines Mana, want to expand population ASAP.)
1 Infested (Builds Spider Eggs, used for traps and structure upgrades.)
2-3 Mistresses (I say "core T1" unit, but later on the T3 Fire Demons will become your mainstay tanks. These girls are glass cannons.)
4-6 Servants (Mining Gold, digging rooms, and so on.)

If you can survive the early game and get out some Spider Egg traps, then one should be fine. It took me a skirmish game to understand how Demons work properly, so feel free to try them out in a Skirmish on one of the "easy maps" (Dam, Old Mines) to figure out what they do. // I got wrecked in Hard difficulty on the Dam map, but reducing it down to Normal and changing my tactics made it far more managable.

= = = = =

In case if you were wondering about my thoughts on the Undead, I do not own that DLC. I simply picked this up from the Humble Bundle for free and sunk in a good 20 hours. It's an okay "Dungeon Management" game and is far closer to Dungeon Keeper than the original Dungeons (which was somewhat entertaining). If one if looking for a pure "Dungeon Keeper" experience, I would reccomend War for the Overworld. Otherwise, I find Dungeons 2 to be enjoyable, and the RTS Overworld mechanic somewhat cool as well.

[neuertrolljawoll]

Undeads are weak in attack and defense strength, true. But they are not weak as a race. You just have to actustom that they die copnstantly. But with the right upgrades they revive much quicker than the other races.
I had fights in my dungeon where I revived the same unit 3 times while fighting.

Also they may not have healers, but there is many times no need for as vampires and ghouls get life steal when researched.

[Gummiel]

Are you an undead yourself? Cause that is one hell of a necro man... thread is 6 years old