The Ancestor's Name

[Barrelmaker]

As far as we know, he does not have a name, correct? Not even a fan name? Well, as an author, I've thought the matter over and come up with one, one in line with the motifs of the game.
The two starting heroes are Reynauld and Dismas.
From what I've read, this is symbolic because Reynauld is referencing a real-life crusader who met a grisly end at the hands of Saladin, and Dismas is referencing the Penitent Thief, who died crucified and from the earthly perspective did not escape his crimes. A rather pessimistic way to predict what will happen to them, and one I try to subvert every time I play.
Now see here, the Ancestor is dead. His trinkets are scattered and in the intro we almost certainly hear him shooting himself... and yet he remains, narrating your every action and guiding your adventure. I've come up with an explanation for this.
The player, the Heir/Heiress, guides the adventuring parties in much the same way, via a Palantír-type of device. This explains how you are able to strategise and call all the shots, and why Paranoid heroes say they sense your evil intentions (commands).
However, the Ancestor does not use a Palantír, for he is dead. He must be alongside you all of the time, as a ghost, just like the phantom in the opening cutscene, helping you along. There is a suitable name that fits all of his qualities: Ambrosius. The name is derived from Ambrosios, which is the Greek form of Ambrose, which means "immortal."
Reynauld the Crusader is named after a Crusader that met a grim demise. Dismas the Highwayman is named after the Penitent Thief who was crucified for his crimes. Ambrosius the Ancestor is named for the Roman war leader Ambrosius Aurelianus, who according to Wikipedia was transformed in legend into King Arthur's (hero again) uncle (ancestor), and the brother of Arthur's father Uther Pendragon (is the Caretaker a relative?), and predeceases them both.

[MaddKossack115]

Escrito originalmente por Blastocyst:

Escrito originalmente por dezimator1337:

Oh, and no new developments so far with the Viscount and Baron. I haven't thought on the others yet.

Just wanted to say that I jokingly referred to the baron as 'Tick-nardier' (a Les Miserables reference) and the viscount as 'The Great Gnats-by' (a Great Gatsby reference), but aside from their comedic value I don't think they are very fitting names...

Whilst I get these are puns, I think using the original names both are derived from can actually work pretty well (especially from the thematic standpoint of names doubling as references to other works, in this case characters whose worst aspects are greed and vice, like the rest of the Courtyard nobles), i.e. The Baron is/was Baron Thénardier, while The Viscount is/was Viscount Gatsby. The Countess meanwhile can use the suggestions from dezimator1337, being either Countess Lilith, Countess Báthory, or even Countess Lilith Báthory.

[MaddKossack115]

Escrito originalmente por sasiji:

(Only to people who killed main boss otherwise is a lore spoiler) Ancestor and you are defacto the same person. In short cut: you will gain letter from your ancestor, You kill Ancestor, circle repeat, You become "new" ancestor, you wrote letter etc...

Except... well, Spoiler for anybody who hasn't seen the ending/read the previous comment: Your Player Character and Heir are NOT the same person, as the First Heir comes back in the New Game+ mode as a ghost: this is shown by the ending highlighting the ghost whilst The Ancestor says you take up a "Nugatory Vigil", and also having said ghost being around in New Game+ Mode while giving comments alluding to how History Repeats. There are ways in which The First Heir is LIKE The Ancestor, such as killing themselves after finding the true horror of The Heart Of The World, summoning a Heir of their own to take up their duty in holding this evil at bay, and potentially getting a LOT of people killed whilst trying to fulfill their ambitions (albeit to different ends, with The Ancestor doing it out of hedonistic whims/a mad desire to know things mankind was NEVER meant to know/filling his pockets to finance the former two reasons, whilst The First Heir does it to basically clean up the absolute mess The Ancestor left behind in the process), but they are not LITERALLY the same character. This also works if you imagine the Heir as your OC, or even LITERALLY yourself, as them coming back as a gender-ambiguous ghost is much easier than literally turning into the old, bearded, Wayne June-voiced Ancestor.

As for some other names for The Ancestor (going by the thematic standpoints established by Reynauld and Dismas):

* Claudius: A reference to Hamlet, as the current King who had the original king murdered, and whose son Hamlet now seeks to take revenge on in kind (with the original king appearing to Hamlet as a ghost). Whilst it may technically be more accurate to use Hamlet, this is to avoid confusion with, er, The Hamlet, and also assuming The Ancestor had become The Herald of The Heart Of The World, who only sent you on this crusade as a trick to sacrifice the blood of heroes to fuel The Heart's awakening, making him The Big Bad/The Dragon all the way through the game instead of remotely seeking atonement.

* Wayne: Alright, this is more of a Casting Gag due to the voice actor Wayne June, and also a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ Batman reference, but considering some other default Hero names are also shoutouts to more modern fiction instead of historical names/Shakespeare references (such as the Abomination being Bigby for Fables' Bigby Wolf, and the Occultist being Alhazred, i.e. Abdul "The Mad Arab" Alhazred from The Cthulhu Mythos), this can work (potentially as either a first OR last name, i.e. either as "Crazy Uncle Wayne" if it's a first name, or Wayne Manor, "so falls The House Of Wayne", etc. if it's a last name)

* Whateley: A reference to the main antagonist of "The Dunwich Horror", Old Man Whateley, who was responsible for creating the titular Dunwich Horror as a plan for his Outer God master Yog-Sothoth (much like how The Ancestor is responsible for literally every boss in-game for one reason or another, along with several of the mid-bosses, all because of his efforts to unearth The Heart Of The World) and like The Dunwich Horror, this game ends with the heroes vanquishing the unspeakable Eldritch Abomination in open combat, albeit only temporarily in The Heart's case. This can also lead to The Heir(s) being named either Lavinia and Wilbur (not to be confused with The Swine King's Wilbur, incidentally being a reference to "Charlotte's Web") as references to Old Man Whateley's daughter and grandson, respectively.

* Usher or Prospero: Both are references to works by Edgar Allen Poe (specifically "The Fall of the House of Usher" and "The Masque of the Red Death", respectively), as both involve the owners of fancy mansions that fall into ruin. "Roderick" can also work as a first name for The Ancestor, based on Roderick Usher (along with his twin sister Madeline) summoning the narrator for help after falling ill with disease, the way The Ancestor summons The Heir via letter at the start of the game.

[Barrelmaker]

I sense a fellow troper...

Ah, this thread is still alive, is it? Well, unfortunately, I'm done making mods for Darkest Dungeon because of how poorly optimised the Steam Workshop is. I can't for the life of me figure out how to upload here, so I would put anything else on Nexus Mods. If ye still want it, I can get back to thinking about this and coalesce these loose thoughts into a list. Then I or someone else can make that mod that replaces the names

[MaddKossack115]

Escrito originalmente por dezimator1337:

I sense a fellow troper...

Ah, this thread is still alive, is it? Well, unfortunately, I'm done making mods for Darkest Dungeon because of how poorly optimised the Steam Workshop is. I can't for the life of me figure out how to upload here, so I would put anything else on Nexus Mods. If ye still want it, I can get back to thinking about this and coalesce these loose thoughts into a list. Then I or someone else can make that mod that replaces the names

Only just gotten involved by a recommendation from a friend (and especially since he's the type to wire me a free copy to my Steam Library), and while I had put it off for a bit, I have been hooked to the art style since I started playing. Don't have the faintest clue about Moddinig for ANY game though, and certainly not Darkest Dungeon.

Closest advice I can give is to ask all the modders who are getting away with reskins and new characters, to see what they know (renaming an enemy so that "Ancestor" is renamed "Ambrosius" or whatever name you see fit shouldn't be much harder than drafting a sub-boss from scratch, so I'm sure those who know how to use the system can give some pointers in regards to that).

In the meantime, I suppose I can spitball a few other ideas for "Fanon" names for other NPCs and bosses/sub-bosses.

EDIT: This is for bosses/sub-bosses that were "formerly human" (or still are, in The Fanatic's case), as the fully non-human bosses can probably be best left unnamed:

* The Prophet
- Percy: This one I got from a book called "The Poetical Works of Percy Bysshe Shelley", which had this quote: "That your eyes ne'er had lied love in my face! That, like some maniac monk, I had torn out" (Side-note: do NOT look up "Monk who tore out his own eyes" expecting a more historical/literary answer, as it results in several recent stories of people mutilating their eyes for various reasons that I won't get into here)

* The Hag
- Hecate: Shows up in Shakespeare's "Macbeth" as the queen of the witches, to chastise the three unnamed witches that gave the famous "Double, Double, Toil and Trouble" scene.

* The Siren
- Sapphire/Sapphy: This one is a bit more obscure, as I looked it up on TV Tropes' "Our Mermaids Our Different" section to find mermaids that are not Disney Princesses, but also not, well, Sirens. While the Mer from the young adult novel "Ingo" (the source of this name: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingo_(novel) ) aren't as monstrous or, well, rapey as Pelagics, the transformation of human to Mer is a one-way street (much like what happened to the poor waif who became The Siren), and the Mer don't really like humans all that much (although again, not to the "either kill on sight, or drag underwater to make our breeding slaves" extent of the Pelagics)

Incidentally, if a mod comes out where a "Shadow Over Innsmouth" Deep One-style boss is revealed to have orchestrated the waif's forced transformation into The Siren (so that our heroes get some deep-fried revenge on that fish-faced incel on the waif's behalf), their name should either include Marsh (as a reference to Barnabas and Obed Marsh, the Deep Ones who respectively founded and currently run Inssmouth) or "Dagon" (as reference to the deity the Deep Ones of Innsmouth worship - the later won't be the first cameo, as both The Witcher an A Song of Ice and Fire both referenced Dagon, the Deep Ones, and other Innsmouth-style shenanigans in some fashion), with a Wilbur-like "side-boss" with the rank of Sergeant (as a reference to Joe Sargent, the bus driver who's implied to be a Deep One who can't find good shoes for his webbed feet).

* The Drowned Crew (specifically their Captain)
- Captain Adam Blackton: This is a merging of two names from voice actors of Monkey Island's LeChuck ( https://monkeyisland.fandom.com/wiki/LeChuck ), in what I figured was "the most pirate-sounding" combination possible.

* The Fanatic:
* Abraham Anderson: A merging of two names, the first of these as reference to Alucard's nemesis from Hellsing (based on The Fanatic being a half-insane vampire hunter with a Slasher Smile: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6VYuqv_NR4&feature=youtu.be&t=13 ), and the second to Abraham Van Helsing, the OG Vampire Hunter.

* The Miller:
- Nahum: This is based on the character Nahum Gardner, whose property was impacted by the meteorite bringing "The Colour Out of Space" (which The Comet/The Sleeper is a half-reference to, the other half being Command And Conquer's Tiberium. And speaking of Tiberium...). Said name also doubles as a reference to a minor Old Testament prophet writing about the downfall of the Assyrian Empire and Nineveh, which the usual "every day is doomsday!" types have extrapolated means a prophecy of the end of our world at God's hand (where it can get in line with all the others - if our world's ending, it's because it melts at our hands).

-Tiberias/Tiberius/Tibor/Tiberiu/Tiburcio: All variants (at least, I assume) of Tiberinus Silvius, the Roman emperor which named the Tiber River, where Tiberium itslef got its namesake.

[MaddKossack115]

Escrito originalmente por dezimator1337:

I sense a fellow troper...

Ah, this thread is still alive, is it? Well, unfortunately, I'm done making mods for Darkest Dungeon because of how poorly optimised the Steam Workshop is. I can't for the life of me figure out how to upload here, so I would put anything else on Nexus Mods. If ye still want it, I can get back to thinking about this and coalesce these loose thoughts into a list. Then I or someone else can make that mod that replaces the names

Just buzzing you here in case you didn't get any notice of my edits to my "Names for Human/formerly Human bosses" list.

[vitez_vaddiszno]

[Endgame spoilers, in reference of other endgame spoilers in comments above]

For the most part, this whole thread is just one big r/iamverysmart.

You make everything so complicated. The characters being nameless, along with their eyes shown as black shadows, is there to depersonify them and it adds to the gloomy atmosphere.

With that said, there are references to people such as Reynauld and Dismas, and also the Countess who is such an obvious reference to Báthory Erzsébet (the correct, Hungarian spelling of her name) that it's not even funny. By the way, Báthory is the family name and Erzsébet (or in English; Elizabeth) is the given name, so she should be Erzsébet first, as anyone in her bloodline (pun intended) is also called Báthory. Well, that is if bloodsuckers get their mothers' surname, which is likely as it looks like a matriarchal society, with the Countess being the boss and broodmother of all.

Anyone is free to theorize about the names of characters such as the Ancestor, but don't kid yourself in thinking the developers were thinking the same. For all I've read, your only reason behind Ambrosius is that it means "immortal" and in some myth, he was the uncle of someone. Well, everyone who has kids is the ancestor of someone, and also in this vein, we can take 800 different words for "immortal" in 800 different languages and they wouldn't be any more baseless than Ambrosius.

If I were to pull a name out of air, he could be called Methuselah, for him being an ancestral figure in the Bible and also being almost immortal (lived for 969 years in jewish legend).

But if I were to go along with the game with a serious mind, the name that is most fitting is Kurtz, from the novel Heart of Darkness. The identity of the final boss, the dark atmosphere of both the book and the game, Kurtz's character in the books, and the narrator saying "The horror..." all point in this direction. Not mentioning DD itself was directly influenced by the book.

Also, it's not still not clear if the Heir accompanies the heroes in their quests or not. But he probably does.
1. Trampled Journal from the game indicates a former heir went to battle alongside the heroes.
2. Caretaker takes care of the day-today affairs so he's not bound by mundane tasks.
3. Darkest Dungeon (end dungeon) missions traumatize heroes, that is why they do not go back for a second time, and the Heir commits suicide after Mission 4, so he was also visiting the Darkest Dungeon.

In DD lore, planets are space monsters in their eggs. We are small ants on the eggshell. If the egg cracks, the space monsters wakes up and we die. Our goal is to keep the monster sleeping. The timeline is not a strict loop. It's true that a heir is called, puts the monster back to sleep, kills himself and sends a letter for a new heir. BUT that is where the loop ends - Ancestor did his swine experiments and necromancy, which the first heir cleaned up. The second heir won't have to clean it up again because the first heir already did. The second heir will probably solve other things, like bandit crime on the rise for all the highwaymen that the first heir employed, or disease out breaks from all the graves that the first heir dug up. ET CETERA.

But the Ancestor is not the same person as the first heir, because the Area bosses were already put down and they can't be magically re-created by the very person (first heir) that killed them in the first place. Once you start a new game, you just face the same bosses because the developers would have had to create a whole new game otherwise, with all new bosses that the first heir unknowingly let loose.

Going by this, most things that don't make sense are probably there for segregation of story and gameplay, such as heroes not being able to equip 3 rings at the same time, or Vestal not being able to use her healing spells outside of battle. Or who is stopping 50 heroes from storming the dungeons at the same time? It's only limited at 4 for gameplay experience. So don't think too much into character barks, or really anything, unless they are supposed to refer to exact and clear things. Else you get epileptic trees, if we talk tropes.

The Fanatic one is probably close to the truth, as he was definitely inspired by Van Helsing (as he is the original vampire hunter in fiction) and is crazy as Anderson, though that's because Anderson himself was inspired by Van Helsing, so it's more like they have a common ancestor (pun intended again). Also, Hellsing is an overly camp and edgy series designed to appeal to 15 year old kids in their hardcore phase, with all the faux psycho smiles and overacting every scene. Darkest Dungeon's horror is more mature and sublime than the clown show that is Hellsing.

I almost forgot, the Ancestor's final fate is still unknown, which makes crafting theories like OP does even foggier.
Possibility #1: Ancestor did terrible things, dug too deep, faced the monsterr, decided to be a part of it and baited you with lies to come to the estate to help wake it up.
Possibility #2: Ancestor did terrible things, dug too deep, faced the monster, fleed and regretted everything, and called you to stop it. Then the monster masqueraded as your ancestor to break your spirits and confuse you.

Neither of them is more true than the other because we do not know when the Ancestor lies and when he doesn't, and when the final boss lies and when he doesn't.

Well, this is my 2 cents, and I think it hits the mark in most places. Also OP, we get it, you're an author, no need to mention it in every sentence.

[Kosher Pork ✞ Jesus Saves ✞]

I like to headcanon that his name is Anne Cester.