20% prot vs 20% max hp, which trinket is better and why.

[BonesNo3]

Is it always the max hp because of bleeds and blights?

If im not mistaken dmg taken rounds down eg 2 damage taken and 10% prot will reduce damage to 1
but what about max hp, if a hero has 11 hp and a 10% max hp trinket, will he end up with +1 (12 hp, rounded down) or with +2 (13 hp, rounded up)?

[unkn0wnx]

Did some testing. Not only it rounds down, it seem to be minus 1? I have a 40hp hero with +25% trinket and get 49 instead of 50. I'll probably go with 20% prot. More hp means you got to heal more, but more prot can mean taking less damage unless it's dot. They are both good. Also it depend on class. For MAA definitely pro, but more hp might be better for Flagellant.

[BonesNo3]

Originally posted by unkn0wnx:

Strange, max hp seems to round up in the case of -10% from a quirk
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2627818999

[unkn0wnx]

Maybe the hero has 39.1. But the game rounds it up to 40. But when he wears a 25% trinket, 39.1x1.25=48.875. Rounds up to 49. But does it matter? it's a game and not a math course.

[GreatPalm]

it rounds up after all your modifiers are applied, not after every modifier.
It first summs all of your +-max hp then multiplies your base hp by that and rounds up.

on low hp chars max hp is nice, because less oneshots is nice. On high hp chars i would take prot, more efficient damage taken/damage healed ratio.

[No One]

Of course if you want a good trinket instead of a decoration, use damage, accuracy, or speed.

[Ozzey_Lee]

Originally posted by No One:

Of course if you want a good trinket instead of a decoration, use damage, accuracy, or speed.

It is a nice boost during the early stages but I would prefer damage and heal boosting over all else.

[BonesNo3]

perhaps some good points to choose prot over max hp boost are:
1. enemy stress group attacks usually deal low damage like 1 or 2, even with 1% prot the 1 dmg will become 0 and will not trigger a death door's check
2. with prot your heals mean more, a 10 hp heal from vestal will absorb more than 10 damage if the hero has prot

Originally posted by unkn0wnx:

Maybe the hero has 39.1. But the game rounds it up to 40. But when he wears a 25% trinket, 39.1x1.25=48.875. Rounds up to 49.

nice, that makes sense

[RopeDrink]

In general, stacking stats that help prevent damage saves more than stacking stats which simply help you to take more punishment when it happens. After all, if you lashed two HP or PROT trinkets on a hero, that isn't going towards killing the enemy -- merely taking more punishment if they're not dead/stopped-- and even just using one of them comes at the expense of aggressive stats you ideally want to stack, especially later on when dealing with very fast and very dodge-happy enemies.

Outside of that, PROT is a nice flat reduction to overall intake regardless of how much health the character has, so I tend to favour that more than raw HP in some cases, as health would still need to be restored, whereas a flat raw damage reduction requires no maintenance for a similar benefit.

As such, I'm generally happy when I see something like a PROT quirk on, say, something like Vestal, as the raw reduction goes well with her lashing out self-healing judgements, keeping her topped without replacing aggression for raw healing.

But again, compared to aggressive stats, they're less of a priority and more of a luxury. During the early-game, the goal is no different. You want to quell the RNG as much as possible with the usual SPD/ACC rather than try to beef up and weather continued RNG with Health or PROT trinkets.

[Butt Goblin]

In theory, PROT is usually better because PROT indirectly improves the efficiency of your healing. DoTs are usually not a major source of HP damage outside of certain endgame missions, and they almost always come attached to considerable regular damage anyway.

In practice, HP trinkets are better because PROT trinkets usually have awful downsides and the high-end HP trinkets have additional benefits beyond HP. And most heroes don't want to bother with increasing their defense stats in the first place--only the absolute squishiest heroes are considering buffing their bulk, and even then only in certain parties where your preventative defenses are lacking and you're concerned about them getting burst down. Otherwise you should go for more proactive bonuses.

[unkn0wnx]

There are some instance where you want a lot of prot. For example Prophet and Vvulf. I like having a MAA with prot perk and at least one prot trinket when fighting Vvulf. You can't really dodge his bombs, but with high prot the explosions does around 7 damage. Someone with less prot would be at death door.

[RopeDrink]

Originally posted by unkn0wnx:

For example Prophet and Vvulf

Vvulf is cheesed outright by an MAA (who stacks Prot when Guarding anyway) -- and in the Prophet's case, you can just spam him with damage-down debuffs and forget about Prot entirely, which will do a little damage to him in the process. He can also be semi-cheesed with an MAA as well. There's no real instance in Darkest Dungeon where I think - "Man, I really wish I could stack PROT", which isn't saying it can't be helpful, just that it's completely unnecessary.

[unkn0wnx]

I have not tried a OCC MAA Leper combo on Prophet. Going to be so easy. Weakening curse, Intimidation plus bellow.

[RopeDrink]

I generally just use one of them and have the other three pump damage. Highwayman is particularly useful here because he can Riposte all Fulminates and either poke R4 or bust Pews in between if you want more gold. The fact he can smash Pews while passively damaging the boss is quite nice.

You can do it just fine with one debuffer so long as you're prepared to eat at least one meaty brick breakfast, which is easy to work around. By the time he gets another off, it'll be doing mild to moderate damage at most and it's just a matter of quickly finishing the job.

You can also use Guard if you like, but only HM can hit R4 in between using it. MAA can Riposte Fulminates, but his pales compared to HWM, and he'll only be able to move or slap Pews, so there's not a lot for him to do until one of them is destroyed so he can at least Crush the Prophet now and then.

Honestly, I never bother with Guard/Prot for the Prophet. The only time I make a conscious effort to take Guard with me is Brigand Assault (Vvulf bombs) and just have an MAA cover bomb-targets while everyone else dunks the adds/boss. Seeing as he'll be dedicated to that one particular role for most of the fight, it is the one and only time I might consider just slapping him with PROT trinkets, even though they're not really necessary.

[No One]

Whereas I always take MAA to the prophet because the debuff method is too easy.

[NamenotLoading]

If I had no other Trinket and there were no other downsides/upsides tied to any of those Trinkets, I'd take the PROT.

How you usually die in Darkest Dungeon is by either getting crit and bleeding out or your Healer not being able to heal. Max HP isn't usually great to have (except Flag bc he can just heal for bigger numbers). People like Leper who already have a big HP Pool usually have enough HP to survive long enough and people who have low Max HP get less HP from those Trinkets.

Prot works on Deaths Door. Deaths Door checks don't happen if you take 0 dmg, so if you have 20% Prot any attack that would deal 1 dmg doesn't check Deathblow. This is helpful if you hit Deaths Door while some Stressdealer like the Cultist witch is still alive. They usually outspeed your healer but the Prot might save your Hero. Max HP just doesn't do a lot to prevent Death. Yeah, you can maybe take 1 extra Hit before hitting Deaths Door, but unless you are able to fullheal after every fight Max HP becomes dead weight after the first fight. (At that point you usually don't need a defensive Trinket)

Regarding DoT's, them dealing dmg to your heroes isn't usually that big a problem. Anything that isn't a 8 Point DoT usually won't take your heroes down to Deaths Door without any help. You usually eat a crit with a DoT attached to it and go to Deaths Door, then the Hero takes his Turn and dies to the DoT. The danger of DoT is usually their Deathblow potential and not the dmg they deal.

In Terms of defensive stats I recommend DoT resists over both Prot and HP almost always. Resists are very consistent and help you deal with the biggest threat of Death, DoT's. They don't seem good but make your Heroes die a lot less.

Aside from Resists I like to bring -Stress and Dodge depending on the Hero and the Party comp. -Stress isn't good if you have a Crusader or a Jester who can just Heal your Stress and Dodge is best on people with high base Dodge. Both work well towards helping you not die. -Stress helps delay/prevent Afflcitions and Heart attacks. Dodge can save you from a potential DoT, crit or Deathblow.

Prot is the next best, since it doesn't help you deal with the big threats like DoT and Stress, but still helps you maybe survive a Deathblow dealt by someone who deals very low dmg. It also shaves off 1 or 2 dmg on every attack, which can stack up pretty high.

Max HP is the worst defensive stat imo, since it usually doesn't gives as much effective HP as Prot does and doesn't help you on Deaths Door in any way. Prot can net you 20 effective HP every Dungeon if you get hit enough, while Max HP just sits there giving HP to people who don't usually die to HP dmg or giving 3 HP to people who die to HP dmg.
(Flag is an exception bc he has Heals that heal % so higher Max HP allows for bigger heals)

Deathblow resist exists. This stat does nothing until you hit Deaths Door and even then it isn't very consistent. Take any other stat over Deathblow pls.

Virtue chance is always too low to take. Unless you get some insane amount like the Highwayman gives yeet Virtue and take -Stress.