Turn order.

[Jorex]

How the ♥♥♥♥ does turn order work? It seems to be just random. Which is just retarded, this game needs less RNG, not more.
Ive had enemies going twice in a row, despide having lower speed than all of my characters.

How the ♥♥♥♥ does turn order work?

[Lorfar]

It is based on speed, if two have the same speed, it is random (I think).
Suprise or no suprise have influence on the first round.
Are you sure you had more speed? Speed gets affected by a lot of things.

[Superfluous J]

The game rolls a D8 for every character, and adds their SPD value. Then they go in the order that was defined by that until the next turn, when a new D8 is rolled for each character.

The only exception to this is if you surprise the monsters. They still go in order relative to each other but your team gets to go first.

So, if your SPD is 10 and theirs is 1, you'll always go first. If yours is 5 and theirs is 4, you'll only go first a little more than half the time.

And many of us like the amount of RNG in this game. :)

[Jorex]

Yes, my character with 7 speed went after the enemy with 5 speed.

And yes, this was after a full turn, the enemy with 5 speed went twice in a row, surprise or no surprise, this should be impossible if i have a character with much higher speed.
One of my characters died because of that ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

Don't get me started on the 0-14 heals, where a majority of my game time, they have healed 0-2, getting a 6 (which is an average) is almost like getting a crit.

This game is starting to piss me off, in an RNG game like this, all, and i mean, ALL information should be present so that i am able to make the best decicion.
Hiding and not explaining turn order is a massive mistake.
I've played 10 hours, and i have still not been able to work out how this ♥♥♥♥ works, it sure as ♥♥♥♥ does not work off speed.

[Jorex]

Originally posted by 5thHorseman:

The game rolls a D8 for every character, and adds their SPD value. Then they go in the order that was defined by that until the next turn, when a new D8 is rolled for each character.

The only exception to this is if you surprise the monsters. They still go in order relative to each other but your team gets to go first.

So, if your SPD is 10 and theirs is 1, you'll always go first. If yours is 5 and theirs is 4, you'll only go first a little more than half the time.

And many of us like the amount of RNG in this game. :)

I have no problem with RNG, as long as it's presented as such in the game.
This game does nothing to explain how turn order works or that there is even dice rolls are involved.
Not explaining that turn order is more or less random and then having things happen is just confusing and extremely frustrating.
Having completely hidden, unexplained dice rolls is not only bad game desing, it's confusing for the player.

[LaserGuy]

Originally posted by Jorex:

Yes, my character with 7 speed went after the enemy with 5 speed.

And yes, this was after a full turn, the enemy with 5 speed went twice in a row, surprise or no surprise, this should be impossible if i have a character with much higher speed.

Yes, this is unsurprising. Your speed is only marginally faster than theirs, so with a +2 speed advantage, you can expect them to go before you about 1/4 of the time.

Don't get me started on the 0-14 heals, where a majority of my game time, they have healed 0-2, getting a 6 (which is an average) is almost like getting a crit.

This might just be bad luck. I've found the Occultist heals to be reliable enough to be very useful. Better to heal before people get into emergency situations, just in case, though.

[Jorex]

Originally posted by aaron.m.barlow:

Yes, this is unsurprising.

No, it is surprising, since the game never tells you that RNG is involved.

Since iv'e noticed it's random, i could have guessed as much, but since i don't know what dice is being rolled, it might as well be the wheel of fortune and i can barely derive a strategy from that.

From this thread, i know that a D8 is being rolled, but i shouldn't have to ask the forum to find this out.

[Micolash Cage]

5thHorseman said everything you need to know. And it's not rare to go after somebody that has only two speed less than you. You could have 11 speed and go after someone that has 5( that's the most extreme case of bad luck)

[Jorex]

Thanks for your awswers guys.

I just hoped the game could answer these questions instead of forcing me having to go to the forums

I can't be the first one complaning about some RNG not being shown/explained in-game?
Since the game is a strategy game with perma-death.
How was this not addressed in the early access?
Just seems like a massive oversight, since at least I don't want to read a wiki to play the game.

[Tipz]

As it was previously said, some of us (not to say the majority) like the RNG.
If you are asking for reliability then maybe you bought the wrong game

[Jorex]

Originally posted by Tipz:

As it was previously said, some of us (not to say the majority) like the RNG.
If you are asking for reliability then maybe you bought the wrong game

Like i said before, i like RNG as well.
However, i don't like RNG when it's a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ mystery to what it is.
The game never explains that turn order is RNG it just throws in the speed stat, never explaining it.
The rest you have to find out on a wiki or forum, which is just lazy game desing.

[itssirtou]

How does it work with multiturn characters?

[Muscarine]

7 speed against 5 speed is not much higher speed.
Both are average.
FYI by end game one of my GR was at 14 speed (quirks, trinkets, base speed) + on guard (18 speed first round).

Originally posted by itssirtou:

How does it work with multiturn characters?

They roll a dice for each turn, hence why they don't throw both attacks at the same time.

[Salt]

Originally posted by itssirtou:

How does it work with multiturn characters?

Check out Heroes of Dires, it's a turn based RPG too, different play style but they executed the turn based mechanism VERY WELL. Even when there is RNG involved between turns as in, who goes first and after. It's always clearly stated so you can plan ahead your turns and strategies.

I find it extremely annoying too when sometimes i expect my characters to go but instead it was three enemy in a row just killing one of my heroes while my other ones are at full health waiting around. Thing is i could have done something if i had known it wouldn't be my turn again after those 3 enemies, if this game encourages planning then turn order should really be presented.

Thing is every other stats were presented crystal clear, and speed stat is ALSO included within items and heroes so why shouldn't it also be explained? If it's mostly rng then just hide it from us. I am only about about 40 hours into the game so I wouldn't say too much.

Again if you like everything explained very clearly go try out Heroes of Dire, they literally show you every dice roll and the equations/formulas for every attack/dodge (action). And that's what I call a well designed game. RNG isn't bad like host said but if theres a stat for an ability but its going to be random anyway what's the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ point.

[MagnusGrey]

FYI a lot of stuff is at least partially explained in the game glossery. For example, it tells you that speed affects initiative, and that it is rerolled each round.

[THANKS OBAMA]

I honestly don't mind the way speed works, but really, a d4 would have been better to separate the differences. D8 just blows way past far too randomly, but either way it's still all good to me.