The Baron - How Even...

[Ataraxis]

Is it me, or is that map just too hard? I get I've not been playing this long with the DLC but christ it just feels too hard. I sent in a bunch of lvl4s to do it and they only made it a few rooms, everything just hits like a truck, and the poison/bleed is high enough to wreck everyone's HP in a turn or two.
I got that event that removed level restrictions, and sent in a bunch of lvl5/6s to help, and I punched through a fair few more rooms, but only got as far as the Crocodilian, and lost two guys killing it...

How was I even supposed to do that with lvl3/4s? I get that it's meant to be longer and harder than regular dungeons, but the numbers feel so ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ high, I'm spending most of my time on the backfoot/recovering from constant 15+ damage hits and 6bleed/3 turns.

Any advice? T.T

[DeathRow]

I just used vestal/bountyhunter/flaggelant/ crusader to get through, took me 4-5 runs, and I dont think the comp is very optimised at all, but it wasnt really that hard. bring plenty of food and bandages I guess

[Glioburd]

Take a bleed team and it won't be hard. Just long.

[SergeTroy]

My preferred team (prior to the re-"balancing" patch) was a Vestal, Jester, Man-at-Arms, and a Flagellant / Hellion. The Vestal was pure healer, though with the Hippocratic Quirk I'd have probably added something like that Sniper's Ring (+15 ACC, +4% Crit, -2 Spd in Rank4) and made better use of Judgement. The Jester was basically all about traps and stress healing, chipping in with buffs and the occasional Slice Off as needed (recommend Ancestor's Map + Bright Tambourine). MaA defended the Vestal and Jester as needed, and the Hellion hit every rank like a truck. I don't remember how many trips I personally took to clear out the labyrinth, as it was huge and I made a point of ransacking the whole place, but you can clear it out in one go if you don't care about loot, it's perfectly doable. Nighttime Ambushes will occur if you don't keep eyes out but I personally just loaded everyone down with the MaA's suite (Tactics, Weapon's Practice, and his personal buff (forget name)). +10 Dodge, +5 - 13% Crit, and +10% weapon damage on everyone is a mean greeting for any collection of bloodsuckers stupid enough to try jumping you.

[sasiji]

My favorite team for CY are Plauge Doctor/ Jester or Grave Robber/ Bounty Hunter/ Flagellant
Plauge Doctor with stun and blight items: Stun 34, stun corpse clean/bligth 1 pos, cure, blight 34
Jester: stress heal, buff, bleed attack
Grave robber: Trow knive (bonus damage vs bligth and mark), pickaxe (armor piercing), lunge, stealth (bonus damage+stealth, come back)
Bounty Hunter: attacks with damage vs stun and mark, pulling attack.
Flagellant: attack bleed 12, bleed to @34, heal and attack, transfer or regeneration.

[LV-04 "Leelee"]

Honestly I think the biggest problem of Crimson Court dungeons is that the tools to best handle the Croc, pushing or pulling him out of rows two and three, borders on worthless for every other enemy in the Court, While the Croc has relatively high resistance to stuns, bleeding, and especially debuffs, which are all useful for dealing with other Bloodsuckers. Meaning you could need an entirely different team just for this boss.

[Lujo]

Kill the eggs one by one, have guys who can hit all positions, have blood curse on your guys for silly good speed and damage buffs. I walked in with a Vestal (who got all her skills but the stun disabled) and did it on the first try. My team was, I think, Ves - Jest - HM - Hellion simply because bleeds are good for the courtyard anyway.

[RopeDrink]

...I think the biggest problem of Crimson Court dungeons is that the tools to best handle the Croc, pushing or pulling him out of rows two and three, borders on worthless...

Movement skills in general are not held in high regard - and the Croc is no exception. Honestly, putting any emphasis on Move, even for the Croc, is a poor investment. Stuns and DoTs (or even raw burst) are order of the day. The only move skill I'd consider is Uppercut because it pushes Croc to the backline and has a chance to stun it as well. I would never pull it towards the team as that is where it does most of its damage (teeth rake), which is far nastier than swarming corruption (light stress AoE). The trick is to prevent Apex Predator as much as possible as well as prevent your team from being shuffled. Pulls help him do this.

Wasting turns to move it makes no sense to me unless backwards. If you have to pull it towards you to hit it, then I'd question your comp all day. Move is definitely NOT one of the 'best tools to handle croc'. It is rarely the best tool to handle anything at all outside of niche scenarios.

-----

As for the OP/map, the Court is a battle of attrition. You have to understand that it wasn't exactly designed to be done from A to B in one go, even though you can. You can leave whenever you like and return whenever you like for the simple cost of one invitation, so if you absolutely want to play it mega-safe, you could grind to the crocs, leave, bring a healthy croc-killing team, proceed to the last boss, leave, return with a boss-killing team.

I always aim to clear it in one fell swoop every time, but I never initially go to the Court until infestation is so high that I can barely do a normal dungeon without walking through 20 million invitation-heralds - that way, if I get in the mode and want it done, but something goes wrong, I can just re-enter without delay. It's not uncommon for me to end the Court DLC with 30 or more in my bag, just because there is no reason to rush it unless you have a fully infected roster gobbling up your blood reserves, thus you need to kill a boss ASAP for a roster-cleanse.

Regarding Baron, you cannot heal while eggs are in play, but you also don't need to heal while he's hiding, so you dunk them one by one and use the remaining turns to kill what appears. If you reveal him early before clearing the eggs, you have a choice between forcing him into the next phase by bursting him down (if your team are healthy enough to endure AoE), or you can clear the other eggs (preferably with a bleeder pumping the boss with DoTs so he's also moving towards the next phase).

It's not all that difficult - he just hits frequently for moderate numbers the longer it takes you to force the next phase. If you don't have a Vestal (which is good for topping people up throughout), then you better have lots of burst. Attacks for all ranks are a given - but this applies to almost every boss except a few.

[MagnusGrey]

You want either a PD or a Hellion with high speed to clear the courtyard map, double stunning before the enemy goes will take your incoming dps down a lot.

[RopeDrink]

I rarely take either. You won't be stunning the gatherers, which form 60% of the population. They're good for the rest and double-stuns are still strong, but let's not pretend like it's a requirement for a smooth court run.

[MagnusGrey]

Originally posted by RopeDrink:

I rarely take either. You won't be stunning the gatherers, which form 60% of the population. They're good for the rest and double-stuns are still strong, but let's not pretend like it's a requirement for a smooth court run.

Not sure I like your tone since the OP was asking for advice on things that might help their run go smoother (no one used the word requirement). You dont need a double stun, but they are certainly helpful against the most dangerous creatures in there. If you are a more experienced player, many parties work well.

[No One]

Originally posted by RopeDrink:

It's not all that difficult - he just hits frequently for moderate numbers the longer it takes you to force the next phase.

If he decides to triple necessary discipline and one or two of them crit he can end your run right then and there. For this reason I usually leave one add alive so he has another option competing for the whip.

Originally posted by MagnusGrey:

You want either a PD or a Hellion with high speed to clear the courtyard map, double stunning before the enemy goes will take your incoming dps down a lot.

Yes, either of those make life a lot easier. PD competes against the JES/VES combo though, and the hellion is a great bleeder in any case.

That said I actually ran PD-JES-♥♥♥-OCC all the way through the baron map in one go. This was with infinite stalling though, I'm not sure it still works because trying it out would mean doing a whole estate up to the baron again. Sadface about no incision from row 4.

I did utterly murderize the dungeon, including the baron, with VES-JES-FLG-HEL after the CoM patch.

[RopeDrink]

Funny, been using a no-VES variation of that as a means to speed-grind a team from 0-4 in prep for the mid-court missions of a new save -- HM>JES>FLG>HEL -- just ended a 5.2hr long stream where they featured prominently. Given you have access to pretty much three sources of stress-healing, all you have to do is sustain health (which is the easy part).

There's really no need for healing in the lower bracket and the bleeds are obnoxious - front-line stuns and/or backline projection if required. Shamblers, TFTStars, Collectors and bosses dying in 2-3 rounds, so replacing the HM with a VES would be solid for prolonged maps for sure. It's also why I can never fathom the people in other threads claiming FLG's apprentice damage is poor - he's hands-down a huge comfort-pick for me in the lower tiers, but that's because I've been rocking DoT comps for a hell of a long time (and he's got one of the nastiest).

Naturally, I wouldn't be as comfortable with such a comp in Champ, but it was a fun Apprentice/Veteran stomp nonetheless. Chances are I'll bring a VES variation to the court later.

[Manslayer]

Originally posted by LV-04 "Leelee":

Honestly I think the biggest problem of Crimson Court dungeons is that the tools to best handle the Croc, pushing or pulling him out of rows two and three, borders on worthless for every other enemy in the Court, While the Croc has relatively high resistance to stuns, bleeding, and especially debuffs, which are all useful for dealing with other Bloodsuckers. Meaning you could need an entirely different team just for this boss.

One thing to consider, you can go in with a team to deal with mobs, clear up said mobs then go back in with a new team to deal with the croc, baron etc. It all depends on how safe you want to be.

You can take the risk and do it very quickly, which can be very rewarding in of itself, or you can take it very slowly, which can be very risky if the crimson curse is taking over at the hamlet. The way I went through it was pretty much 6-7 runs making sure not to take too many risks and usually using my crimson cursed team to deal with it.

[RopeDrink]

Not sure I like your tone

no one used the word requirement

You dont need a double stun

You want either a PD or a Hellion with high speed to clear the courtyard map, double stunning

Mmhmm.

[JustSen]

Edit: One real downside to the party I describe below, is IF stress starts to get out of control, it's really hard to get it back, as party buffing is pretty necessary for the crits to happen, and crits if one of the bigger parts of stress releafe, as aoe heal crits more often and the stress heal from dealing crits helps alot, especially if it happens to proc on all your team. So in Crimson Court if stress is starting to get out of control, I think that's the only real problem with this team. (especially if you're as unlucky as me and the Ghoul using Howl manages to give your Vestal The Worries disease.... ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ +30% stress on the one char that gets least benefit of crit stress heal)

4. Vestal with the basic skill set for 4th slot, Junia's Head and Sacred Scroll as trinkets.

3. Jester with Dirk Stab, Stress heal, party buff, Finale, I used Bright Tambourine and Critical Dice as trinkets as I haven't gotten anything better for him (Might want to swap Critical Dice with some dodge+ trinket, but Luminous and Evasive quirks so I didn't take dodge trinket)

2. Highwayman with Duelist's Advance, Point Blank Shot, Trcking Shot, Wicked Slice(swap with Open Vein if you can bleed and need it over better chance to crit)
for trinkets I have Crystalline Gunpowder and Sun Cloak (I would use the Sharpening Sheath over Sun Cloak if I had it)

1. Shieldbreaker with Pierce, Adder's Kiss, Expose, Serpent Sway with Spectral Speartip and Dismas' Head Trinkets.

This comp, is so ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ averagely OP(saying it like this,as I haven't found anything yet that's totally wrecked me, some fights just aren't as favourable for me as others.) for everything, and currently I'm looking for yellow key and this is my first trip with Baron's Invite to the courtyard, I only wish I had the Mill built so I wouldn't apparently have random hunger prompts, else I believe I'd be able to clear the Baron quest in one go (I'm currently in it myself, while typing this, as I came looking for the confirmation that I needed to find certain keys to open the locked gates,as I have been postponing this trip to meet the baron ALOT)
Using similiar comp but with the Crystal Mercenary recruits I've gotten to 258 or something like that in the Endless Harvest, only reason I stopped was I didn't want to risk it anymore, as I already had everyone been to death's door once due to the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ Unlcean Giant hitting me with Treesmack critting for 58, which no-one obviously has the HP for in this comp and since that reduces crit% and dmg, I couldn't deal as much dmg as I would've wanted to.

As for how to use this comp. Simply put spam party buff on jester, or use Dirk Stab to finish off a mob you absolutely want killed before it's turn(and on bosses, get the boss low enough and let that 50-70dmg crit Finale to finish them). use stress heal when someone goes over 40 stress, otherwise hope for the crits to keep the stress in check, which should be around 39-50% on both shieldbreaker and HWM when at max party buff, keep Riposte up ALL THE TIME on HWM(riposte has +5% crit chance ontop of all the other crit chance), and mainly use Pierce on Shieldbreaker, unless you can use Adder's Kiss on low prot and blight resist target and not screw up getting riposte up, as Adder's Kiss has 1% better chance to crit than Pierce.