How demand really works?

[RealOfficialTurf]

I'm fairly new to this game. I've built a city that goes like 20k pop and I noticed that my demand bar has lowered to be almost 0% on ALL zones. Then, I started another city and observed the demand to be normal. But, as I developed the second city the demand goes lower and lower till it's almost 0% on ALL zones. And now no one wants to come to the city.

I checked everything the toolbar has to offer - polices, hospitals, landfills, cemeteries, schools, traffics, parks, etc.... I made sure that I avoided the so-called "deathwaves," and lowered the taxes into 4%. Yet still no demand despite the effort. I heard that taxes do not count to demands.

Then, I experimented. Firstly, I hypothesized that removing the road without de-zoning them is the culprit of the low demands. I've carefully built a control city that uses the same building layouts as my previous cities, avoiding accidental de-zones. Then, I removed the roads that are adjacent to residential zones and replaced them quickly. I see a noticeable drop from 10% to 0% of my residential demand. But even with careful building, I still experience demand drop.

Maybe there's something wrong with building with grids and not building naturally. In Sim City, we don't have the problem of having 0 demands on all zones. All demands adds up to 100%. That was good. Why CS didn't have the all-demands-adds-up-to-100% feature?

No, Installing mod that locks demand at 100% will not help, since I'm playing on vanilla. I've seen other people hitting 80k without mods. If anyone wants to help, I can give screenshots and even the savegame itself.

[Prometheus]

The primary factor is unemployment. High unemployment = high industrial demand. Low Unemployment = high residential demand. Residential demand zeroes out around 10%. Industry zeroes around 1%.

When you place a zone it places a temporary claim on some of the demand of its type. The demand will return when it fills in then adjust as cims move into or take jobs in the zone.

Commercial is weird. It definitely works a bit off the unemployment rule but it also has another rule. I cannot completely confirm it but based on my testing, I think the second commercial factor is based on employed cims compared to amount of shopping available.

Also jobs filled anywhere count against the demand bar. Cims working in your hospital reduce industry demand. Cims working in your commercial reduce industry demand.

[Pops]

Actually the rci is not demand in CS like it is in sc. As Prom... says orange and green bars are directly related to the amount of cims you have OF WORKING AGE.

Workers are all adults and a % of young adults. Wont go into explaining it, ive already done that.

[RealOfficialTurf]

Okay, I made another city. This time, I play it normally until it reaches 7.5k, which unlocks the high density residential zones. When I used them, ALL demands drop down to 0%. Could the high density residential zones affect the demands? I usually use the high density zones so I can achieve more people in small areas.

EDIT: After waiting long enough, all zones eventually fills up and the demand goes back up again. I guess the demand bar is slow rising.

[Pops]

You prob zoned too many, influx will only go so high and isnt instant, go have something to eat and come so game can catch up with your zoning speed or prepare for the massive death wave sure to fllow.

Also, having no low density is a mistake in CS.

[Prometheus]

Look at the third sentence in the post I made, first in this thread. I literally explained your problem with a tiny amount of words and gave it its own line.

[Com_Evans]

Originally posted by RealOfficialTurf:

I heard that taxes do not count to demands.

Can somebody confirm that?

[Pops]

If you mean lowering taxes to entice more into the city like you can do in sc, then no. Lower taxes in CS does not aid to influx of more cims.

[Com_Evans]

Originally posted by Pops:

If you mean lowering taxes to entice more into the city like you can do in sc, then no. Lower taxes in CS does not aid to influx of more cims.

And in reverse this means that demand does not drop due to higher taxes (?)

Many thanks in advance! :)

[Pops]

The rci is not demand, if you tax at 13% or higher the cims simply leave the city.

[OneJasonBradly]

The RCI my views\opinion

Unemployment calls for industrial demand, if many jobs are available then demand be low. Residential needs\desire to buy goods calls for commercial demand.
Residential demand is based upon how many home units are available to move into and Jobs available. If the number of available (empty) homes is low this will this will add demand. If your unemployed find jobs this too will add to residential demand.

If you have a medium industrial demand and no residential demand then improving a residential neighbourhood so that the neighbourhood upgrades to the next level will cause more places to live which will further drop residential demand. The industrial demand will increase for the new homes will increase the need for more jobs as citizens move in. If you reduce the unemployment below a certain% it will reduce the industrial demand.

Worker shortages "Not enough workers" Should raise residential demand. If not then the shortage could be caused by them not being able to get to work.

Whenever I have had the chance to repair someone’s city I have always used the RCI to guide me to stability in the city. Holding a somewhat high demand in industry means all or almost all jobs are filled, which means you have unemployment above 10-20%.
Commercial I try to keep from going above 50%. I always want a commercial demand to distribute unemployment a bit and so you don't flood the city with commercial\shops driving the “Land Value” of commercial down. Residential demand I keep low. For one of the things this can tell me is that I still have homes citizens can move into.

The RCI tells you what will develop if zoned, It tells you your unemployment between industry and commercial. It tells me that many homes are not sold yet. It warns me if something is wrong with the city.

[RealOfficialTurf]

Originally posted by Pops:

Also, having no low density is a mistake in CS.

So, I need to have some low density building somewhere in the city? This time, I replace the low residential with high residential step-by-step, making sure the high residential all filled up before replacing another.

Also, what are "deathwaves?" If that just means a lot of dead person waiting for transport, can we solve it by more hearses or improving traffics?

[OneJasonBradly]

Originally posted by RealOfficialTurf:

Originally posted by Pops:

Also, having no low density is a mistake in CS.

So, I need to have some low density building somewhere in the city? This time, I replace the low residential with high residential step-by-step, making sure the high residential all filled up before replacing another.

Also, what are "deathwaves?" If that just means a lot of dead person waiting for transport, can we solve it by more hearses or improving traffics?

High density and low density populate differently. I think low density residential create families which create children or are more prone to.

The death wave is created when you lay down a large amount of residential zoning at one time. It creates many citizens life clock to start at the same time causing them to pass all at the same time creating a backlog of dead that may overwhelm your death care facilities. In turn cause abandonment and restarting the cycle over again.

[Prometheus]

Originally posted by RealOfficialTurf:

Originally posted by Pops:

Also, having no low density is a mistake in CS.

So, I need to have some low density building somewhere in the city? This time, I replace the low residential with high residential step-by-step, making sure the high residential all filled up before replacing another.

Also, what are "deathwaves?" If that just means a lot of dead person waiting for transport, can we solve it by more hearses or improving traffics?

Deathwaves are something that happens once your city gets large enough. People will tell you there are ways to work around it like staggering your zoning or something but all that does is delay the inevitable if it even works at all. The cause of deathwaves is tied to the way cim death is coded in the game.

You have two solutions.

The first is to massively overbuild death services. This will clear the problem when it occurs but you will still have to deal with the massive swings in population and what that does to your employment.

The second is to get the lifecycle rebalance mod. This solves the problem entirely.

[OneJasonBradly]

Originally posted by Promethian:

Originally posted by RealOfficialTurf:

So, I need to have some low density building somewhere in the city? This time, I replace the low residential with high residential step-by-step, making sure the high residential all filled up before replacing another.

Also, what are "deathwaves?" If that just means a lot of dead person waiting for transport, can we solve it by more hearses or improving traffics?

Deathwaves are something that happens once your city gets large enough. People will tell you there are ways to work around it like staggering your zoning or something but all that does is delay the inevitable if it even works at all. The cause of deathwaves is tied to the way cim death is coded in the game.

You have two solutions.

The first is to massively overbuild death services. This will clear the problem when it occurs but you will still have to deal with the massive swings in population and what that does to your employment.

The second is to get the lifecycle rebalance mod. This solves the problem entirely.

Death wave means many “passing away” at the same time. The fact your death care facilities all of a sudden can’t deal with it should alert you to investigate the issue.
I have been playing since the beginning March2015 and I can say with certainty you are wrong! So what population is large enough to have a death wave? My main city is at 95k, never waved. I have a city at 150k, never death waved. Also one at very close to 200k also never seen a death wave. Do I have to wait till a population of 200k or more before I see one on my maps? Not likely! Having said all that I have seen situations that many have called a death wave and it turned out to be traffic flow issue.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1533844801
"The cause of deathwaves is tied to the way cim death is coded in the game." ?

They have a life span of 6,six game years. (So i have read before but can't say I know as fact).
I do know I have never used those mods nor have I ever felt the need to. I have many times repaired deathwave cities from others and rarely did so by adding more death care though I always add one near cemeteries without a crematorium near them. So the emptying does not hamper traffic or pickups. You can have deathwaves caused by not enough death care facilities, traffic, zoning large plots of residential at one time. The death wave just like the single lane line up IS THE SYMPTOM not the cause. Unfortunately many tie a symptom to one cause only and assume they are right and any event that falls out of the assumption is deemed broken game.

Overbuilding deathcare facilities to deal with a deathwave is not dealing with the cause most times. That would be similar to instead of getting the muffler on the car repaired you just keep turning up the volume on the radio to drown out the noise. In the case of the above clip more death care would have done nothing at all.

[Saturn]

Originally posted by OneJasonBradly:

The RCI my views\opinion

Unemployment calls for industrial demand, if many jobs are available then demand be low. Residential needs\desire to buy goods calls for commercial demand.
Residential demand is based upon how many home units are available to move into and Jobs available. If the number of available (empty) homes is low this will this will add demand. If your unemployed find jobs this too will add to residential demand.

If you have a medium industrial demand and no residential demand then improving a residential neighbourhood so that the neighbourhood upgrades to the next level will cause more places to live which will further drop residential demand. The industrial demand will increase for the new homes will increase the need for more jobs as citizens move in. If you reduce the unemployment below a certain% it will reduce the industrial demand.

Worker shortages "Not enough workers" Should raise residential demand. If not then the shortage could be caused by them not being able to get to work.

Whenever I have had the chance to repair someone’s city I have always used the RCI to guide me to stability in the city. Holding a somewhat high demand in industry means all or almost all jobs are filled, which means you have unemployment above 10-20%.
Commercial I try to keep from going above 50%. I always want a commercial demand to distribute unemployment a bit and so you don't flood the city with commercial\shops driving the “Land Value” of commercial down. Residential demand I keep low. For one of the things this can tell me is that I still have homes citizens can move into.

The RCI tells you what will develop if zoned, It tells you your unemployment between industry and commercial. It tells me that many homes are not sold yet. It warns me if something is wrong with the city.

What happens if my population is more than my available jobs? I have 21k pop. and 17k available jobs with 13% unemployment. What should I do?