FortressCraft Evolved

FortressCraft Evolved

minecarts refuse to network properly
Started playing again over the last month or two and have spent an ENORMOUS amount of time babysitting/fixing the various levels of minecart distribution.

The problem is that the carts just simply stop on the track. constantly, at any point on it where there is either a turn or a junction, the minecarts are leaving the loading areas completely empty despite the fact they are set for wait for full and the mass storage is completely full on top of that. They are leaving loading centers completely empty quite allot as well, after stopping to be loaded for a few seconds then ignoring the settings. And lastly the carts, once stopped on the track, refuse to resume routing and must be removed from the track, often times an entire line of like 20 carts needs to be removed. Some other times the system sends 2 to 3 times the number of requested carts to a bay and clogs it up that way, as the cart currently having been loaded might also refuse to move.

There are no breaks in the line, nothing obstructing their destinations but for some reason the adventure pack minecart system just won`t work reliably. I am 99% sure I am not screwing it up myself by some unknown mistakes but I`m certainly not ruling that out. Does anyone have any advice?

Some screens:


https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1921672306
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1921672267
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1921672226

This one showing the cart idling has a load close to the offload center where the destination is completely empty and requesting several thousand of its resource.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1921672195

World save file:
mediafire. com/file/swmqv5a04edt1k3/Octogon.7z/file

just remove the space since steam takes it upon itself to remove any links you try to put up.
Last edited by Titanium Jesus; Nov 26, 2019 @ 6:37pm
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Showing 1-15 of 26 comments
Maverick Nov 27, 2019 @ 3:07pm 
I find my freight carts all stopped sometimes. What happens to me is some of the carts end up going the wrong direction around the track. They then collide with carts going in the other direction. Now all of the carts are stopped in a big line. It's hard to tell which are going one way or the other. I just remove all of the track under them and let them drop to the ground, then replace the track and put the carts back into the depot. When the depot places them back on the track, they all end up going in the same direction. Later after I have exited the game and loaded my world a few times, I will inevitably find them stuck again and have to fix it again.
Titanium Jesus Nov 28, 2019 @ 12:04pm 
Yah. This happens almost exclusively when a cart just parks itself at a corner or junction for me. It parks, clogs others, and the others then try going the wrong way just to move. I always use one way tracks at junctions to control direction. If the carts stopped derping at random corners or junctions I don`t think I`d have any other issues.

It`s almost like the game loses track of carts at those areas or something. There`s only like, 40 carts going in the network too, over the span of at least 500 blocks minimum.
steveman0 Nov 30, 2019 @ 5:04am 
First question before I dig into any details: are you running the P25 beta? The P25 build has many fixes for the carts and cannot debug any systems running on P24 due to the number of code differences. If you're still on P24, please update and review everything again before updating your post as many edge cases may go away.
Titanium Jesus Nov 30, 2019 @ 8:50pm 
Originally posted by steveman0:
First question before I dig into any details: are you running the P25 beta? The P25 build has many fixes for the carts and cannot debug any systems running on P24 due to the number of code differences. If you're still on P24, please update and review everything again before updating your post as many edge cases may go away.

It was p24. However after having updated I am still having one or two issues remaining.
The carts seem to be handling junctions and corners just fine now, but I am still getting massive backlogs stuck at loading terminals from time to time because a cart either gets stuck idling on it or finishes loading and refuses to move because it wrongly announces there is no route to its destination./ no offload available. Also continuing is that ocassionaly a cart will not unload cargo and make a trip back to the loading bay, which confuses the bay and the cart will then not get sent back down the line to deliver cargo again.
Last edited by Titanium Jesus; Nov 30, 2019 @ 9:24pm
steveman0 Dec 1, 2019 @ 8:40am 
What makes you think it is wrongly announcing no route or offload station available? The system monitor is always reliable and will confirm the state of the system and what carts are doing or why they are failing. If a cart is failing to find a destination it's either due to an improper one-way orientation blocking the route or a target station is otherwise not connected to the grid. The system monitor should help you identify which station is isolated and needs to be reconnected.

Carts stuck idling also indicates you have an issue with your grid that carts can't navigate. Common causes are you've assigned a station to a freight network that needs/offers goods for another station but the two aren't connected on the same track grid.
Last edited by steveman0; Dec 1, 2019 @ 8:41am
Maverick Dec 1, 2019 @ 2:48pm 
I updated to V 25 but I still have the same problem I described earlier in this thread. I am using freight carts. The track is in a loop with two stations, load and unload. If I set the loading station to "wait for full", there will be a line of carts waiting to enter the station to fill up. If it takes too long for the first cart to fill, the carts at the end of the line will take off in the opposite direction. They will then eventually collide with the full carts as they are travelling to the unloading station. So far, my only idea to work around the problem is to set the loading station to "wait for any" and add a lot more freight carts to the system since they won't be carrying as much.

edit: With the loading station set to "wait for any" I still have the same problem. While the carts are unloading, two of them stopped in the middle of the track. After a while, one of them took off in the wrong direction.

edit 2: I followed the misbehaving freight cart until it collided head on with a cart heading in the correct direction. Luckily, it recognized it's mistake and turned back around heading in the right direction. Hopefullly the carts continue to sort themselves out in this way instead of jamming up the whole system. Previously in P24, I would find the whole system jammed up frequently.
Last edited by Maverick; Dec 1, 2019 @ 3:02pm
steveman0 Dec 1, 2019 @ 5:41pm 
Is there enough demand to ensure the cart can fill up? If there isn't then it'll continue to wait until you can supply enough demand for goods. In general, wait for any is the desired behavior. It's very rare that wait for full is necessary to improve system throughput.

If carts are turning around where you don't want them to, use one-ways to enforce track directionality.
Titanium Jesus Dec 1, 2019 @ 7:34pm 
Steveman0

Thanks for spending your time.



Originally posted by steveman0:
What makes you think it is wrongly announcing no route or offload station available? The system monitor is always reliable and will confirm the state of the system and what carts are doing or why they are failing. If a cart is failing to find a destination it's either due to an improper one-way orientation blocking the route or a target station is otherwise not connected to the grid. The system monitor should help you identify which station is isolated and needs to be reconnected.

Carts stuck idling also indicates you have an issue with your grid that carts can't navigate. Common causes are you've assigned a station to a freight network that needs/offers goods for another station but the two aren't connected on the same track grid.

The game popped up a message just like "idling" except it was red and said something like "no route" After having checked the rail at least 10x I can 100% say there was no break in the line or a reversed one-way. It is clear sailing straight to destination.

Originally posted by steveman0:
Is there enough demand to ensure the cart can fill up? If there isn't then it'll continue to wait until you can supply enough demand for goods. In general, wait for any is the desired behavior. It's very rare that wait for full is necessary to improve system throughput.

If carts are turning around where you don't want them to, use one-ways to enforce track directionality.

The destination needed more than 3K of the assigned material.

HOWEVER. After having these issues persist after updating to p25 again (I don`t know why it reverted to 24) I decided to simply remove one random piece around the malignant area and replace it after a few seconds and poof. It seems to be working well now. I will continue to monitor my networks for any continuing naughtiness.

You`ve been a big help again Steve.
steveman0 Dec 2, 2019 @ 4:29am 
Originally posted by Titanium Jesus:
Originally posted by steveman0:
What makes you think it is wrongly announcing no route or offload station available? The system monitor is always reliable and will confirm the state of the system and what carts are doing or why they are failing. If a cart is failing to find a destination it's either due to an improper one-way orientation blocking the route or a target station is otherwise not connected to the grid. The system monitor should help you identify which station is isolated and needs to be reconnected.

Carts stuck idling also indicates you have an issue with your grid that carts can't navigate. Common causes are you've assigned a station to a freight network that needs/offers goods for another station but the two aren't connected on the same track grid.

The game popped up a message just like "idling" except it was red and said something like "no route" After having checked the rail at least 10x I can 100% say there was no break in the line or a reversed one-way. It is clear sailing straight to destination.
I can guarantee it won't give that except in the specific case where the AI can't establish a route. Odds are you either missed something or you misread which station it was targeting. Always give your stations distinct, meaningful names so the destination can't be mistaken for another.

Originally posted by steveman0:
Is there enough demand to ensure the cart can fill up? If there isn't then it'll continue to wait until you can supply enough demand for goods. In general, wait for any is the desired behavior. It's very rare that wait for full is necessary to improve system throughput.

If carts are turning around where you don't want them to, use one-ways to enforce track directionality.

The destination needed more than 3K of the assigned material.

HOWEVER. After having these issues persist after updating to p25 again (I don`t know why it reverted to 24) I decided to simply remove one random piece around the malignant area and replace it after a few seconds and poof. It seems to be working well now. I will continue to monitor my networks for any continuing naughtiness.

You`ve been a big help again Steve.
The color of the track is there to help identify when a section is isolated. The system is quite good at collecting everything into one grid, but with every change to the track there's the chance of timing conflicts that can lead to some areas becoming isolated as track sections rearrange their groupings. If you ever see track of a different color that appears like they should be the same, pressing Q on a junction will cause the system to recheck all its track and should fix anything that had become separated. This sounds like what happened in this case. The system monitor also provides a listing of all distinct track sections which can identify a spurious station or junctions that lost connection to the main grid.
Maverick Dec 2, 2019 @ 5:40am 
Originally posted by steveman0:
Is there enough demand to ensure the cart can fill up? If there isn't then it'll continue to wait until you can supply enough demand for goods. In general, wait for any is the desired behavior. It's very rare that wait for full is necessary to improve system throughput.

If carts are turning around where you don't want them to, use one-ways to enforce track directionality.
I think the demand varies depending on the position of my cargo lifts. I must have never researched one way tracks. I haven't seen them. I have some track stuff not researched that I skipped because the research has the blue track icons which made me think it must not apply to scrap track. I am using scrap track exclusively. I will try that when I get a chance.

I found a cart stopped on the corner just after my unloading station last night when, waiting for my rock grinder to produce ore. When the ore from the rock grinder became available at the loading station, the cart did not start moving toward the loading station. I had to break the track and replace it, then the cart behind it continued on as intended. Maybe adding a second depot would help since carts return to the depot when there is no work to do. I have never used the system monitor either. I think i will try that also.
steveman0 Dec 2, 2019 @ 9:36am 
You can also hop in the cart with U to find out why the cart is stuck. This is rather unusual behavior for P25 though so anything you find out about stuck carts is appreciated.
Titanium Jesus Dec 2, 2019 @ 12:26pm 
I spoke too soon. Now having the same issues on p25 as p24. I even caught on cart pop a message while idlung on a junction in red "no accesable....." i assume the rest was no accesable route, but the cart was stuck 5 sections from its destination. If i shut the game down and restart the carts will move again for a few moments, but then start getting stuck on junctions again right away, in numerous cases stuck at junctions less than 10 sections from the destination. Since you said it is impossible to see these messages unless the ai cant find the route this makes me think that the ai is literally forgetting sections of the network.

Since my net has been down for a couple days and im on my phone i will upload the current world again once it comes back so you can see the network.
Last edited by Titanium Jesus; Dec 2, 2019 @ 12:28pm
Maverick Dec 2, 2019 @ 1:55pm 
When I loaded my game today, I found this:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1926953829
The cart in the station was bouncing back and forth, running into the carts on either side. I broke the corner track under the full cart on the right and replaced it. After that, the carts started moving again but it was too late, all of the carts waiting in line took off in the wrong direction. So a few minutes later, I have carts colliding everywhere, stuck all over the place.

I cleaned all of this up and added some one way tracks and a mass storage to the unloading area.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1926954146

It seems to be working ok now. I can probably ignore the system for a while but I think when i reload the world or the mass storage becomes full, I will have to mess with them again. The carts pause for a little while and show the message "station unload is full", then they gradually unload and move on, the next does the same. While they are unloading it will say "freight cart idling" but nothing seems to be getting stuck. If they stop too long, they might turn around, but hopefully the one way tracks prevent that. I most frequently see carts stopped on corner blocks, but that might also be because corners are frequently adjacent to my stations and the carts might be travelling in opposing directions when I load my world, i don't know.

Here is another example. First time underground after loading the world and these carts are stuck here on the corner.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1926997418

After filling the hopper with ore, the other carts spawned from the depot but couldn't get around these two. I removed the track underneath them, added a one way at the depot and everything is working for now but that is typical. I typically fix the stuck carts and they run without issue for a while, but inevitably are stuck again and require maintenance.

Sorry for the wall of text, just trying to provide as much information as possible. I don't know what is going on. If I am doing something wrong, if there is a bug or if this is just the way freight carts are meant to be.
Last edited by Maverick; Dec 3, 2019 @ 7:11am
steveman0 Dec 3, 2019 @ 4:20am 
Originally posted by Titanium Jesus:
I spoke too soon. Now having the same issues on p25 as p24. I even caught on cart pop a message while idlung on a junction in red "no accesable....." i assume the rest was no accesable route, but the cart was stuck 5 sections from its destination. If i shut the game down and restart the carts will move again for a few moments, but then start getting stuck on junctions again right away, in numerous cases stuck at junctions less than 10 sections from the destination. Since you said it is impossible to see these messages unless the ai cant find the route this makes me think that the ai is literally forgetting sections of the network.

Since my net has been down for a couple days and im on my phone i will upload the current world again once it comes back so you can see the network.
The full error is "No accessible destination station" which generally means you have a station demand goods on the freight network but it is entirely isolated from the track grid the carts are on. That's not a routing issue or bug with the carts, most likely you have a break in your track grid. You'll need to identify the grid section that's isolated. This can be done either by checking the system monitor for isolated grid sections and identifying what stations are on them, or by checking the network demand for the good/network in question and attempt to identify the station that it wants to deliver to and find which isolated grid section it is on.
steveman0 Dec 3, 2019 @ 4:31am 
Originally posted by Maverick:
When I loaded my game today, I found this:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1926953829
The cart in the station was bouncing back and forth, running into the carts on either side. I broke the corner track under the full cart on the right and replaced it. After that, the carts started moving again but it was too late, all of the carts waiting in line took off in the wrong direction. So a few minutes later, I have carts colliding everywhere, stuck all over the place.
This doesn't surprise me. From the looks of it, you have no one-way tracks enforcing the cart flow direction. Carts will always take the shortest route to their destination and if you provide them no one-ways to enforce the route direction, nothing stops them from coming in at two different directions and getting stuck on each other. The cart on the corner is trying to get into the station.

I cleaned all of this up and added some one way tracks and a mass storage to the unloading area.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1926954146

It seems to be working ok now. I can probably ignore the system for a while but I think when i reload the world or the mass storage becomes full, I will have to mess with them again. The carts pause for a little while and show the message "station unload is full", then they gradually unload and move on, the next does the same. While they are unloading it will say "freight cart idling" but nothing seems to be getting stuck. If they stop too long, they might turn around, but hopefully the one way tracks prevent that. I most frequently see carts stopped on corner blocks, but that might also be because corners are frequently adjacent to my stations and the carts might be travelling in opposing directions when I load my world, i don't know.
It's probably best to avoid stocking more than your mass storage can hold. As you've seen, this will lead to a backup of idle carts because they have no choice but to wait while they have goods they can't deliver. If you keep the stock level below the storage's limit, when the stock level is met, the extra carts can return to a depot or, even better, get reassigned to help other stations get other goods moved around so that they don't go to waste.

That said, nothing stops you from letting them back up and this may be worth it for a high volume station where you know there will be a large enough demand for the goods that more will be needed quickly. You need to be sure you've considered the maximum that carts can back up and account for that in your track layout so that they don't end up clogging a prior intersection preventing other carts from getting where they need to go. Otherwise, you can end up with a gridlock on your hands.
Here is another example. First time underground after loading the world and these carts are stuck here one the corner.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1926997418

After filling the hopper with ore, the other carts spawned from the depot but couldn't get around these two. I removed the track underneath them, added a one way at the depot and everything is working for now but that is typical. I typically fix the stuck carts and they run without issue for a while, but inevitably are stuck again and require maintenance.

Sorry for the wall of text, just trying to provide as much information as possible. I don't know what is going on. If I am doing something wrong, if there is a bug or if this is just the way freight carts are meant to be.
Again, it appears you've left out the one-ways and the carts came from the different directions because that happened to be shorter based on where they originated. If you want carts to go a specific direction to avoid colliding, you need to specify that direction. Generally, laying out tracks that ensure a particular route is always faster to ensure carts flow a specific direction is quite difficult so it's always recommended to just use one-ways to enforce the rule. They don't cost any more than a straight track so there's little reason not to use them generously.
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Date Posted: Nov 26, 2019 @ 1:44pm
Posts: 26