So is RL crates gambling now?

[crazycupmuffin]

Now that others have been deemed gambling for random loot crates?

Edit: For those that feel it isn't. A couple of commenters below have pointed out that even the layout of the opening of crates is all based on gambling machines.

[GeneralVeers]

İlk olarak treebeard tarafından gönderildi:

Except you can easily buy every single MTG card online if you want.

And you can buy every single Rocket League crate item online if you want.

Jesus, are you even trying?? Even wrestling baby harp seals isn't this easy.

[old Charlie]

@Vonstyne: After reading up a little on the matter, the only thing I would add is, that a gamble is mostly decided by luck. In fact in germany its part of the word gamble - "Glücksspiel" or "game of luck". So basically, If I challenged you to a game of Rocketleague and we both bet money on ourselfes, it wouldn´t be considered gambling in germany, because Rocketleague would be considered skillbased. However, if somebody else beside us would bet on our game, it would be considered gambling.

But it doesn´t change a thing, because in the end there is another paragraph, that adds a certain leniency if the amount you bet/win is low. Thats why Boosterpacks are not considered gambling in germany - and can be therefore purchased by kids. Everything else is 18+.

Now the interesting thing is, that german law couldn´t outlaw lootboxes BUT they could force an 18+ rating on those games - which in turn would hurt disney and ea more than enough for them to reconsider. There are also certain moderating influences on casinos etc. - The operator of such an establishment has additional rules to obey.

[VonPumpkinson]

İlk olarak Bowerick Wowbagger tarafından gönderildi:

@Vonstyne: After reading up a little on the matter, the only thing I would add is, that a gamble is mostly decided by luck. In fact in germany its part of the word gamble - "Glücksspiel" or "game of luck". So basically, If I challenged you to a game of Rocketleague and we both bet money on ourselfes, it wouldn´t be considered gambling in germany, because Rocketleague would be considered skillbased. However, if somebody else beside us would bet on our game, it would be considered gambling.

In that regard, yes. If it's between you and I, in a sense, we're taking a gamble in who is a better player.

İlk olarak Bowerick Wowbagger tarafından gönderildi:

Now the interesting thing is, that german law couldn´t outlaw lootboxes BUT they could force an 18+ rating on those games - which in turn would hurt disney and ea more than enough for them to reconsider. There are also certain moderating influences on casinos etc. - The operator of such an establishment has additional rules to obey.

As least we share a common ground to see EA crumble. Disney really needs to consider revoking EA's Star Wars license.

[poly]

İlk olarak GeneralVeers tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak treebeard tarafından gönderildi:

Except you can easily buy every single MTG card online if you want.

And you can buy every single Rocket League crate item online if you want.

Jesus, are you even trying?? Even wrestling baby harp seals isn't this easy.

Alright, that got a laugh out of me. Go to the trading section, trade keys for the item you want.

And congrats, you've now bought an RL item online.

[GeneralVeers]

Exactly. I notice you used the word "bought" right there. Not the word "gambled".

So, nice try, Treebeard. He tried to point out a non-existent difference between MTG boosters and RL crates. They're the same thing. And MTG boosters are not considered gambling.

[VonPumpkinson]

İlk olarak Dino tarafından gönderildi:

Crates gambling, teammates are bad and I GOT BANNED FOR NOTHING!!!!!????????

Wow did I just sum up all threads?

And EA is going kill the Star Wars franchise.

[Pickles]

This is really pathetic, literally defending devs pulling this ♥♥♥♥ and introducing kids to predatory practices and gambling because you like a videogame. I knew useful idiots were a thing but this is just on another level.

[Sanyavok]

they said we dont allow steam market into our game because its bad for the players and blablabla but I dont see anything being better just because there is no steam market its just that you dont buy the universal skins for hundreds of euros instead you trade them with keys... how good that is and while they are adding ♥♥♥♥♥♥ crates for rich idiots the rumble game mode is still there with ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ bugs but I guess nobody will fix something that doesnt bring money for the company

[VonPumpkinson]

İlk olarak treebeard tarafından gönderildi:

This is really pathetic, literally defending devs pulling this ♥♥♥♥ and introducing kids to predatory practices and gambling because you like a videogame. I knew useful idiots were a thing but this is just on another level.

You don't have an argument. Quit stroking the fire.

İlk olarak Sanyavok tarafından gönderildi:

they said we dont allow steam market into our game because its bad for the players and blablabla but I dont see anything being better just because there is no steam market its just that you dont buy the universal skins for hundreds of euros instead you trade them with keys... how good that is and while they are adding ♥♥♥♥♥♥ crates for rich idiots the rumble game mode is still there with ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ bugs but I guess nobody will fix something that doesnt bring money for the company

Here's a tissue. Don't use it all in one wipe.

[Sanyavok]

İlk olarak Vonstyne tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak treebeard tarafından gönderildi:

This is really pathetic, literally defending devs pulling this ♥♥♥♥ and introducing kids to predatory practices and gambling because you like a videogame. I knew useful idiots were a thing but this is just on another level.

You don't have an argument. Quit stroking the fire.

İlk olarak Sanyavok tarafından gönderildi:

they said we dont allow steam market into our game because its bad for the players and blablabla but I dont see anything being better just because there is no steam market its just that you dont buy the universal skins for hundreds of euros instead you trade them with keys... how good that is and while they are adding ♥♥♥♥♥♥ crates for rich idiots the rumble game mode is still there with ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ bugs but I guess nobody will fix something that doesnt bring money for the company

Here's a tissue. Don't use it all in one wipe.

wow you are really trying to defend the game or just ignore everything and waste everybodys' time with nothing?

[Sanyavok]

İlk olarak Dino tarafından gönderildi:

"for rich idiots" Go fight csgo then with their overpriced cancer keys

yeah thats even worse but this game is also a game that you have to buy and you still get collectibles hidden behind paywalls which is sad because I would really like to get a nice looking car without paying my ass off and end up paying more on skins rather than buying a better game... these features should stay in f2p games

[GeneralVeers]

İlk olarak Dino tarafından gönderildi:

Crates gambling, teammates are bad and I GOT BANNED FOR NOTHING!!!!!????????

Wow did I just sum up all threads?

You forgot the ones where people go "[H] Heatwave [W] White Zomba" and then mysteriously disappear from the forum for three days.

[Silky]

İlk olarak crazycupmuffin tarafından gönderildi:

Now that others have been deemed gambling for random loot crates?

Edit: For those that feel it isn't. A couple of commenters below have pointed out that even the layout of the opening of crates is all based on gambling machines.

For those who believe it isn't gambling, they're just uninformed, lucky, or are just too young to spend their own money.

It is gambling. Even though there's only so many ways to randomize numbers within coding (It's impossible to have an absolute random value), nothing is EVER random when it comes to tech, every slot machine on this earth has a set value of when the winning try will occur, seeing how I spent $40 to try to get the Jaguar and didn't, I see it's the same mechanism. They're a company, they want your money.

[GeneralVeers]

İlk olarak 40 Gallon Gas Water Heater tarafından gönderildi:

It is gambling. Even though there's only so many ways to randomize numbers within coding (It's impossible to have an absolute random value), nothing is EVER random when it comes to tech

You believe that, but you can't prove it.

First off, you don't know how the code in Rocket League was actually written. Does it actually use an RNG of some kind? Does it use a hash number based on your username and the date? Are the game admins logging in and deciding what loot you'll get next crate you open?

You have absolutely no idea. But wait, it gets better. Whichever mechanism the game uses, you have no idea what loot you're going to get next time you open a crate.

If the result is impossible to predict, then the result cannot be distinguished from true randomness. If it looks random, and you can't prove it isn't random, then it's random.

[VonPumpkinson]

İlk olarak Flat Roof Gary tarafından gönderildi:

The reason I said "both" is because I'd like hear "what definition you found in the internet" versus "what's written in books". That's why I went with the encyclopedia as a near-accuracte description of gambling. They share similar descriptions: element of chance and/or skill.

Unfortunately: http://www.ign.com/articles/2017/11/25/uk-gambling-commission-determines-loot-boxes-arent-gambling-under-british-law
With the provided link, the UK doesn't consider loot boxes as gambling. My guess it was probably "money's worth". Money's worth, defined from the Act, of a value. Sadly, those values (or prices) are genereated by the players not the developers.

However, there should be rules on crates. Psyonix did it damn right but EA failed horribly.