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IMPORTANT
Im going to split my comment on this topic into two parts my opinion in short and opinion in long, if you dont want to read a giant block of text, scroll down to the bit where I have the caption IN SHORT where I summarise my suggestions
IN LONG
The PvP is kinda ♥♥♥♥♥♥.
The time to kill with most weapons is also ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. The new armour is kind of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, and yes I know the only one, while more realistic was buggy as ♥♥♥♥ at being realistic. (Shot not rendering as headshots when clearly shooting at a zone where the hit box would have no armour or vice versa)
Im going to do a run down on some of the ranged weapons in the game and what their damage models SHOULD be taking into account General Realism/Fairness for Optimal fun and minimal ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ moment. (Lets admit it guys, we all hate those ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ moments in multiplayer games where logically, that person we set on fire should be dead, or that person you head shot 3 times should be dead but isnt)
Be first of all something that must be mentioned.
Characther Agility and Movement Speed......and sheilds
Mount and Blade Warband. In my opinion has the most fair and non-♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ and fun combat to date.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_HXM-Wv-Fw
This isnt the best video to demonstate the combat but anyways, give you a rough idea.
Basically in Mount and Blade Warband. There is 4 attack directions and 4 block directions for most weapons.
That is an overhead swing, a left swing, right swing and a thrust.
You can block all of these attacks by blocking in their corresponding direction of whatever attack direction the attack has chose.
Shield make blocking easier, but break over time.
This plays as very fair and skill bases combat. You can also cancel your attack by blocking mid attack.
NOTE:
This is all and good, however my one major criticism about Mount and Blade combat is the "Dancy Prancyness" notice in the video how the players are very quickly moving from left to right and fighting circles around each other. I feel that this fluid like ninja movement speed takes away from the experiance and is kind of immersion breaking.
Try side step left and right and area of 5 meters in real life. Notice delay it takes for you to change direction. Its a considerable amount of time. Now do the same thing In Rust and or Mount and Blade. The time it takes to change direction is almost non existant in rust, and is only slight in mount and blade.
If you examine Rust combat, in general, alot of bullet dodging tactics are used.
Ever played battle royale and have an ak47 and you suddenly see another guy who sees you who is in short range with an ak47 and almost as a reflex you both, or one of you crouch ,stafe left and right and spazmodically shoot at each other until one of you are dead.
An extreme example of Dancy Prancyness combat in multiplayer games is Dark souls.
The players are literally rolling around each other.
The reason in rust why melee weapons are ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ useless
1) Ranged weapons like the bow and crossbow seem to suffer no accuracy penalty whilst moving.
2) Jumping does not disrupt reloads or gives a penalty to reload time.
3)No Sheilds.
I never see this brought up but is a very important aspect of pvp
(Note: I will be speaking in terms of general realism, not superealism, for example down below what I say on what the wooden spear should do when thrown at someone in the head.
Techincally speaking, if a throw a javelin and it tears some flesh off your cheeck and maybe fractures your cheek bone, is quite different if the spear has penetrated your skull. That right there is super realism. In terms of general realism , its fair to say that you should be dead or have a nasty injury as its probably more likely to occur then you getting lucky with the javelin being thrown at just grazing some skin off your cheek).
A NOTE ON RUST COMBAT:
From what I have examined from Rust Combat is that the low tier weapons that are being used, the more "prancy dancy ring around a rosy" the combat tends to be.
If you dont beleive me go ahead and play a primitive rust battle royale game and then play a regular battle royal game. Especially examine the final phases of the matches in both cases, where the fighting area is small and there are around 5-7 players remaining.
In primitive battle royale, I decribe it as monkeys jumping around trying to shoot one another.
In regular battle royale, while there is still some strafing and jumping it is too a much lesser extent, and for less periods of times.
The dancy prancy 1v1 combat examined in primitive royale ussualy last for about 30seconds or a a couple of minutes depending if on if one user lands a lucky headshot.
In regular battle royale 1v1 combat in close quarters last ussually a couple of seconds. 10 or so max. Sometimes there are 2 players who are extremly good at strafing and use up their entire mags shooting at each other and then you have this awkard moment where you are both relaoding
Wooden Spear
What the damage model for it should be: If I managed to stick a wooden spear into someones bare skull from throwing it, they should be dead, or have a severe head injury.
However the spear should bounce off and or do reduced damage if the wooden spear comes into contact with a layer of armour.
♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ things about this weapon
- I cant oneshot people wearing no head armour or do it most of the time
- Does ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ low bleeding damage
SideNote Regading the old and current armour system.
However, here is whats ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. You know you used to be able to throw a spear at that guy wearing a bucket helmet through the wire mesh of the bucket helmet and bypass the protection of the armour?
Well that is now longer the case as the devs changed it to an armour protection value system most RPGS have. Basically a piece of armour whether it is on your foot or on your face, protects your whole body.
I think the devs did this becuase they were too lazy to fix the buggy hit boxes on the old more realistic hit box system.
Waterpipe:
These early game scatter weapons of rust have seem to be replaced with your staple box and cross bow.
♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ thing about this weapon
-Pullout time is slow as ♥♥♥♥ to even be practical
-The Bleed damage received from being hit by one of these at medium-close range is stupid low.
Eoka Pistol
Yeah I get it, this weapon isnt meant to be good. But is it not reasonable if 6 pellets or so hit the person not wearing metal armour I aimed at that he is not bleeding quite terribly
♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ thing about this weapon
- Bleeding damage is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ low
Crossbow
♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ thing about this weapon is used
- This weapon is probably the most used weapon in prancy dancy combat.
You often see this alot in crossy vs crossy fights with both partys jumping around and strafing spazmodically trying to get a hit. It really is rather absurd and stupid.
IN SHORT
In Conclusion in regards to what needs to be changed in Rust PvP
- Rust should adopt a Mount and Blade Model combat system with 4 attack directions and 4 block directions.
-Decreased player movement agility speed (the time it takes to change from strafing left to strafing right and direction control when jumping)
-Setting a speed limit on how fast someone can make a full 180 degrees turn.(This will make it so players cant turn around at superhuman speeds enabling for bullet dodging capabities)
-Adding shields that can be used with melee weapons, these shields will give partial protection. The shield will only protect where it is placed.
-Some sort of accuracy penalty for shooting whilst moving.(Not a huge penalty, but big enough to make it preferable to stand still)
-More Effective Camoflage. (For some reason , how this game is graphically, its really easy to spot someone despite them wearing camo.)
-Less orange grass and more green grass for ♥♥♥♥♥ sake.
- Much Cheaper clothing
- Clothing should have increased protection vs melee.
- Clothing should do 33%or50% less vs bullets.
- A deploy time for any barricade that gives full body cover when standing up.(Barricades and High exteriors)
- Ability to hide landmines, or partially hide them.
-Higher landmine damage
-Higher snaptrap bleeding damage.
-Armour Weight. The Higher the weight of armour the player is wearing, the faster they consume food and water whilst sprinting or jumping. (Say Maximum 15% faster food and water consumption rate. Maybe more I dont know)
- Slightly slower movement speeds for players higher armour weights.
(In the realms of around 1-5%)
-Higher bleed damage for all weapons.
-Clothing should perhaps only reduce bleed damage and slow down bleed damage.
-Armour should only reduce just non bleed damage
-Rideable horses. Make it so that Mounted melee combat is a viable option. No Horse Archer whilst Mounted or very big accuracy penaltys for shooting whille moving ona horse.
Agree to the protection of clothes and the camouflage. It should be possible to survive by hiding somewhere and sneaking around. You could do so in real life, without fighting, if you want.
Agree to the weight thing. Would also make sense if someone can´t run fast because of carrying things and equipment.
Agree to the accuracy thing. If you are running you should not be able to shoot as precise as if you are standing still somewhere.
In legacy you could ♥♥♥♥ someone up in full kevlar by just using a simple pickaxe but the thing is it was extremely difficult to do this. But if you did you got rewarded for it. Because the guy in full kevlar should have get you so close. Thats what New rust doesnt have. The moment you get full gear your basically unstoppable against people with low tier guns, thats not how it should be. They should also be a threat. Thats why this game is so broken. You see these massive groups roaming around because as a solo player there is just ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ you can do about it. So then the solo players also joins a big ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ clan and this just keeps repeating itself. If they would tweak this retarded game to Legacy damage you would see alot more small teams pop up and alot more action aswell, lets be honest now the server pop is died out after 3 days because nobodys wants to leave their base anymore.
Ive watched a few videos on legacy and yes the damage model does seem more fair and realisitc.
HOWEVER. Legacy had godawful dancy prancy ring around a rosy combat. The bullet dodging in that was insane, like holy ♥♥♥♥. If you were good at spaming the keys A and D for alternating lengths of time and spazmodically moved your mouse around, you were REALLY hard to hit.
And our Nutty professor calls this a bastion of truth. You should all go study some philosophy. Because there isn't one truth.
The devs can listen to the community. But they decides what's important to change this game. And who knows maybe they'll change it. But they don't have to, because one +4k hours player wants it :p