Lack of damage up items

[eDy]

I've played the original isaac and rebirth quite many hours and I really do love these games but the situation with damage items is getting just ridiculous. After repentance released I have had so many runs with zero or one damage up item offered all run. I get why certain items were nerfed and Edmund doesn't like players just winning every run but at least give me a fighting chance. Item pools are so polluted with useless items that it's just too hard to find even the small amounts of damage ups right now.

Edit: I know this might be hard thing to fix right now but this should have been fixed with repentance already since the lack of damage items was noticable with previous dlcs too but now things have gotten even worse.

[dwinters62]

They added way too many tears up items to the boss pool

[Revalopod]

Escrito originalmente por dwinters62:

They added way too many tears up items to the boss pool

yeah it's way too easy to reach the tears cap and then future tears up items become wasted. I wish the tears cap was increased to 7 or 8 :(

[T1N1->Casper_Ksta]

Escrito originalmente por Revalopod:

Escrito originalmente por dwinters62:

They added way too many tears up items to the boss pool

yeah it's way too easy to reach the tears cap and then future tears up items become wasted. I wish the tears cap was increased to 7 or 8 :(

HOT TAKE: No bullet cap! If the player got enough tear up items, let said player appreciate them.

[dwinters62]

Escrito originalmente por CryoSpider:

Escrito originalmente por Revalopod:

yeah it's way too easy to reach the tears cap and then future tears up items become wasted. I wish the tears cap was increased to 7 or 8 :(

HOT TAKE: No bullet cap! If the player got enough tear up items, let said player appreciate them.

There may be no Bullet Cap, but there's still a tear rate cap. It's way too easy to get tears up compared to damage ups. I normally hit the tear cap by floor 3.

[T1N1->Casper_Ksta]

Escrito originalmente por dwinters62:

Escrito originalmente por CryoSpider:

HOT TAKE: No bullet cap! If the player got enough tear up items, let said player appreciate them.

There may be no Bullet Cap, but there's still a tear rate cap. It's way too easy to get tears up compared to damage ups. I normally hit the tear cap by floor 3.

Yes I mean tear cap not bullet cap, sorry.

[JellyPuff]

I have quite the opposite experience. Had countless trainwrecks pre-rep. Now, you're guaranteed at least 1 damage up per run in the form of The Negative.

But damage isn't everything.

Early game, many familiars are effectively double damage at base Isaac stats. There also are more ways, to make them scale now.

There also are many potentially game-winning tear-effects and synergies in the game, which allow you to become OP without any or few damage ups. They instead indirectly scale with tears and often directly scale with luck on top. Getting past the tear cap is also easier now, since more items decrease tear-delay.

Look for temp damage boosts, tear-effects or other ways to temporarily scale up for final bosses, if you need 'em. (cards, Book of Belial, Sulfur, Box of Friends, etc)

[Revalopod]

Escrito originalmente por CryoSpider:

Escrito originalmente por Revalopod:

yeah it's way too easy to reach the tears cap and then future tears up items become wasted. I wish the tears cap was increased to 7 or 8 :(

HOT TAKE: No bullet cap! If the player got enough tear up items, let said player appreciate them.

yeah that would be even better. there's no damage cap, so why tears cap? :(

[Lucifer ★✬]

Escrito originalmente por orian34:

Escrito originalmente por Lucifer ★✬:

But when bosses are just hp and damage checks it gets impossible when the game dosnt give you said items

If it were the case, I'd agree, but it's not true here. The only stat that can screw you over directly is low speed

as above have said, if you need to fight a boss for 20 mins or so then ill reset. sure speed is a factor aswell, but damage and hp are more so

[Zephyr the Kibago]

Escrito originalmente por CryoSpider:

THIS CONVERSATION AGAIN BOIS.
On a more serious not we are in a effect-item meta, as much as I hate the phrase "git gud" I think you could benefit from using the tools the game gives you better.

i mean... when the selection of items is just "here have more HP/Range" or when the game doesn't give you a single key or bomb the entire floor so you can't even enter the treasure room? or when the boss challenge room has nothing but a stupid HP up item? The game doesn't always give you anything you can even remotely use. There are so many runs i have had where i have like insane amount of pickups and nothing more since the game gives you nothing. No tear effects, no damage ups, barely (if any) tears up... tons of range though!

[Rio]

I had a tainted lilith run yesterday with no damage up items. The BROKEN angel 100% mechanic NEVER works for me anymore. its always 33%. So I often go two more floors with nothing. So when I finally got an angel deal it gave me the bible. And by this point it was mom foot fight time.

Only I had taken 1 experimental treatment so my damage was 2.50, not even 3.50. I exited the game rather than go through with it. I was so annoyed, because it was suppose to be a run to mega satan.

[UwU]

Escrito originalmente por Sashie:

I had a tainted lilith run yesterday with no damage up items. The BROKEN angel 100% mechanic NEVER works for me anymore. its always 33%. So I often go two more floors with nothing. So when I finally got an angel deal it gave me the bible. And by this point it was mom foot fight time.

Only I had taken 1 experimental treatment so my damage was 2.50, not even 3.50. I exited the game rather than go through with it. I was so annoyed, because it was suppose to be a run to mega satan.

It's not broken. You get 100% chance that it's going to be angel room, but not that it's appears 100% from the first floor.

[eDy]

Escrito originalmente por CryoSpider:

THIS CONVERSATION AGAIN BOIS.
On a more serious not we are in a effect-item meta, as much as I hate the phrase "git gud" I think you could benefit from using the tools the game gives you better.

I'm really not sure how I'm supposed to 'use the tools' better in this kind of cases. [imgur.com]
Goat's head from the first or second floor, no damage ups or tear effects offered all run and was forced to pick up negative just to get some damage. I had no business winning this run if I was playing on any other character but tainted Judas.

[Ketrai]

Escrito originalmente por orian34:

Escrito originalmente por Lucifer ★✬:

But when bosses are just hp and damage checks it gets impossible when the game dosnt give you said items

If it were the case, I'd agree, but it's not true here. The only stat that can screw you over directly is low speed

Low firerate/damage would like to introduce you to cross pattern bomb mulligan room, single strip bomb fly room, and 3 globulins 2 strips womb room. There's also that really rare room in the caves enemies run at you across a narrow path that's literally impossible to avoid without killing one fast enough or flight. So sorry to break it to you buddy, but the game does rely on damage and fire-rate to a certain degree. Sure, a lot of fights and bosses can be won at a snail's crawl space, but some rooms are literally impossible to complete unscatched without the appropriate stats.

[Meta Binding]

Escrito originalmente por EDYSTERi:

Escrito originalmente por CryoSpider:

THIS CONVERSATION AGAIN BOIS.
On a more serious not we are in a effect-item meta, as much as I hate the phrase "git gud" I think you could benefit from using the tools the game gives you better.

I'm really not sure how I'm supposed to 'use the tools' better in this kind of cases. [imgur.com]
Goat's head from the first or second floor, no damage ups or tear effects offered all run and was forced to pick up negative just to get some damage. I had no business winning this run if I was playing on any other character but tainted Judas.

Thats because you were using the book of whatever it is - it guarantees the boss of that floor will be a horseman, thus stripping you of any sort of damage items.
Edit: there is a specific horseman per chapter, so if you use it in the basement you will get famine - the next boss will be normal. This was a thing pre-repentance also. The best way to use this item is to go alt path, as they cant spawn on the alt path.

[Ketrai]

Escrito originalmente por JellyPuff:

I have quite the opposite experience. Had countless trainwrecks pre-rep. Now, you're guaranteed at least 1 damage up per run in the form of The Negative.

But damage isn't everything.

Early game, many familiars are effectively double damage at base Isaac stats. There also are more ways, to make them scale now.

There also are many potentially game-winning tear-effects and synergies in the game, which allow you to become OP without any or few damage ups. They instead indirectly scale with tears and often directly scale with luck on top. Getting past the tear cap is also easier now, since more items decrease tear-delay.

Look for temp damage boosts, tear-effects or other ways to temporarily scale up for final bosses, if you need 'em. (cards, Book of Belial, Sulfur, Box of Friends, etc)

Talking about familiars. Seven seals is now kinda top tier simply because of war. I've had war with mega blast bombs before, and his flies would just instakill low hp bosses and still decimate high hp bosses. Just uh, be wary of collateral. Even more insane if you get brim bombs or even bob's curse. Just any strong bomb upgrade suddenly gets procced for free.