[SPOILERS] My (Shocking) Theory

[Kingbob]

*WARRNING CONTAINS SPOILERS FROM THE FIRST 2 EPISODES*

Okay, so at the end of episode 2 we are shown something that makes us think that Crane is likely the murderer that we have been after but the more I thought about it the less likely that this seemed. Why would Telltale reveal their hand with more than half the episodes still needing to be made? It seems far more likely that it is going to be something like what they did with Snow where we thought she was dead and then she wasn't. So, I then started to think about what characters could possibly be the murderer and suddenly I thought of a shocking possibility. The character that has the greatest potential to be the murderer is Snow.

I haven't really thought through all the possible reasons why it might have been her based on episode 1 but here are a couple of the reasons why it could be her:
Snow was the person who found faith's head meaning that she had the potential to have been the one to place it there since no one else had seen it there. No one knew where Snow was during the time that the fake Snow was killed meaning that she could have in fact murdered her.

Now, episode 2 is what makes me really think it could be here and this is why:
Snow has to deal with all the fables that come to get help and therefore she would have known that Lilly was missing. Assuming that Snow tried to find out what happened to Lilly then she may have learned that she was a hooker. The photo and the hair that was used to make the black market glamor would have been easy for Snow to have provided. Now, what if Crane did in fact have an unnatural interest in Snow (i.e. the whole Snow White roleplaying thing) and maybe Snow was aware of this. Maybe she had even played along for a while by either going and meeting up with him at the open arms a few times or by sending Lilly in her place (this would explain why the dress had so much wear and tear, it had been well used). Maybe one of these times she ended getting the picture of Crane with her sleeping body. Now, what if Crane went to meet Snow at the open arms, he brought the wine from episode 1 (yes the wine that Buffkin was drinking is in the hotel room), Lilly showed up glamoured as Snow, and they then role played Snow's story. What if Crane then left before Lilly woke up (asleep like Snow in her coffin) but then Snow slipped in and murdered her and planted the photos of crane. She would have done this while Bigby was at the Trip Trap. She then could have taken the head and planted it at the woodlands and then gone to dump the body in the river. Since she was the only person who knew the Toad Jr. had found a body then it could be possible that she dumped the body knowing that he was there to see it. The reason for this could be to establish an alibi. In addition to this by making everyone think that she was dead it makes it unlikely that anyone would ever think that she was behind the killings.

In addition to all of this there was one more thing that makes be consider her, a quote from the magic mirror in the trailer for episode 2: "Friend on friend, at the end of the end."

Now I am sure that this theory is not perfect and part of me really hopes that I am wrong because I love Snow's character, but it just seems like there is a lot of potential for her to be behind all of this.

If anyone has anything to add to this theory, can see potential flaws in it, or has anything to say about the theory I'd love to hear it.

(I know that this game is set to take place before the Fable comics and having never read them I do not know whether it is possible to learn who might be behind the murders by reading the comics so I just ask that any comments that provide reasons for or against this theory only be based on things in the game and not from the comics.)

[Kingbob]

I would like to metion that in the episode 3 trailer Crane drops the glamour box which could indicate that the Crane from the photo was not infact the real Crane. However we do not know that he was infact using the glamour, we only know that he had the box.

[Kieran]

Originally posted by Zursa:

Okay, so at the end of episode 2 we are shown something that makes us think that Crane is likely the murderer that we have been after but the more I thought about it the less likely that this seemed. Why would Telltale reveal their hand with more than half the episodes still needing to be made?

Forgive me, it's nice that it got you thinking, but I honestly can't believe why it would make ANYONE think that Crane is the murderer. First the picture just shows him with a "Snow", it doesn't show him murdering a "Snow". Second it makes very little sense that he would take a picture of himself and third even way less to leave it there! Besides as you finally figured out, if he was the murderer, what would they keep us occupied with for the remaining three eposides?

I don't mind anyone throwing in their own theories, but please for goodness' sake people, stop pretending everyone else is an idiot. By the way, if you take a look at the threads that have been created since episode two came out, you'll find that you're not the first, second or even fiftieth to come up with "I don't think it was Crane".

[Kingbob]

Originally posted by Noobsn:

Your theory makes sense, but the one thing im missing is Snows motive. Why would she murder Faith and Lilly? She didn´t know about Faith in the first place and she didn´t know Bigby has met her. Besides that I really like this theory, nice work.

We don't know that she did not know Faith. My guess is that if she does end up being the murderer then we wont have any motive untill end of episode 4 or episode 5 because as soon as we start to get a motive we will start to suspect her

[Kingbob]

Originally posted by Kieran:

Originally posted by Zursa:

Okay, so at the end of episode 2 we are shown something that makes us think that Crane is likely the murderer that we have been after but the more I thought about it the less likely that this seemed. Why would Telltale reveal their hand with more than half the episodes still needing to be made?

Forgive me, it's nice that it got you thinking, but I honestly can't believe why it would make ANYONE think that Crane is the murderer. First the picture just shows him with a "Snow", it doesn't show him murdering a "Snow". Second it makes very little sense that he would take a picture of himself and third even way less to leave it there! Besides as you finally figured out, if he was the murderer, what would they keep us occupied with for the remaining three eposides?

I don't mind anyone throwing in their own theories, but please for goodness' sake people, stop pretending everyone else is an idiot. By the way, if you take a look at the threads that have been created since episode two came out, you'll find that you're not the first, second or even fiftieth to come up with "I don't think it was Crane".

The end of episode 2 is suppose to suggest that Crane is almost stalker-ish with his obsession with Snow. It suggests that he only wants to be with Snow to the point that he recreates her fairy tale to get off. On top of this he has various pictures of Snow along with the picture of him with Snow on the bed. This suggest that he could have been planning to do something for months or even years. The fact that Lilly glamoured as Snow gets killed this Snow White fantasy room is meant to make the viewer think that perhaps Crane's fixation with Snow could go as far as wanting to kill her. Think of it as a kind of snuff film (a video where someone is rapes and then killed). If someone looks at this way then it is easy make the conclusion that perhaps Crane would take a photo of him with Snow because he wanted to have something to remind him of this. As for why he would leave it Beauty said it herself, the key that is suppose to one all the doors didn't work, maybe the person who was renting the room is renting it long term. Going back to Crane being obsessed with Snow it is likely that seeing as he thought he had killed Snow White in this room that he decorated with things to recreate her fairy tale then it is not hard to come to the concision that he could want to return to the scene of the crime to relive it. He could have left the pictures there specifically to do just that, relive the murder.

This is what I feel TellTale was aiming to have you suspect Crane was doing which was solidified by Crane becoming so angry that he smashed the magic mirror.

[Kieran]

Originally posted by Zursa:

The end of episode 2 is suppose to suggest that Crane is almost stalker-ish with his obsession with Snow. It suggests that he only wants to be with Snow to the point that he recreates her fairy tale to get off. On top of this he has various pictures of Snow along with the picture of him with Snow on the bed. This suggest that he could have been planning to do something for months or even years. The fact that Lilly glamoured as Snow gets killed this Snow White fantasy room is meant to make the viewer think that perhaps Crane's fixation with Snow could go as far as wanting to kill her. Think of it as a kind of snuff film (a video where someone is rapes and then killed). If someone looks at this way then it is easy make the conclusion that perhaps Crane would take a photo of him with Snow because he wanted to have something to remind him of this. As for why he would leave it Beauty said it herself, the key that is suppose to one all the doors didn't work, maybe the person who was renting the room is renting it long term. Going back to Crane being obsessed with Snow it is likely that seeing as he thought he had killed Snow White in this room that he decorated with things to recreate her fairy tale then it is not hard to come to the concision that he could want to return to the scene of the crime to relive it. He could have left the pictures there specifically to do just that, relive the murder.

This is what I feel TellTale was aiming to have you suspect Crane was doing which was solidified by Crane becoming so angry that he smashed the magic mirror.

So... Crane would take a picture of him and "Snow", to remind him a of a murder he could easily commit again, since he only killed a copy, and then instead of keeping it close to him, he would leave it in an envelope in the room he killed her in, because the room and the blood doesn't remind him enough of it. In addition, he would take "Snow's head" and place it on the doorstep to make sure it's going to be investigated, and so that everyone knows a "Snow" died, to ensure his secret could get out at some point, since it's not the real Snow and her head will change back at one point which not only might destroy his fantasy, but will also make it more difficult for him to get another girl to pose as Snow... and him smashing the mirror doesn't solidify him being the murder in any way, the fact that soon all of fable town could find out what a creep he is in addition with him being a suspect now is more than enough to cause that reaction.

Your effort is noted, it still doesn't make any sense though.

[BeastBox]

Yeah, I have to agree; this is that "mental gymnastics" I keep calling people out on. There's no way Crane is the killer; he's got a creepy fetish, he's mad/ashamed he got caught on it, and that's all.

Snow as the murderer lacks anything even resembling motive, which is kind of super-important, so until I see that I'm not buying it. I buy Toad killing people with Woody's axe before I buy that.

[Kingbob]

Originally posted by Kieran:

Originally posted by Zursa:

The end of episode 2 is suppose to suggest that Crane is almost stalker-ish with his obsession with Snow. It suggests that he only wants to be with Snow to the point that he recreates her fairy tale to get off. On top of this he has various pictures of Snow along with the picture of him with Snow on the bed. This suggest that he could have been planning to do something for months or even years. The fact that Lilly glamoured as Snow gets killed this Snow White fantasy room is meant to make the viewer think that perhaps Crane's fixation with Snow could go as far as wanting to kill her. Think of it as a kind of snuff film (a video where someone is rapes and then killed). If someone looks at this way then it is easy make the conclusion that perhaps Crane would take a photo of him with Snow because he wanted to have something to remind him of this. As for why he would leave it Beauty said it herself, the key that is suppose to one all the doors didn't work, maybe the person who was renting the room is renting it long term. Going back to Crane being obsessed with Snow it is likely that seeing as he thought he had killed Snow White in this room that he decorated with things to recreate her fairy tale then it is not hard to come to the concision that he could want to return to the scene of the crime to relive it. He could have left the pictures there specifically to do just that, relive the murder.

This is what I feel TellTale was aiming to have you suspect Crane was doing which was solidified by Crane becoming so angry that he smashed the magic mirror.

So... Crane would take a picture of him and "Snow", to remind him a of a murder he could easily commit again, since he only killed a copy, and then instead of keeping it close to him, he would leave it in an envelope in the room he killed her in, because the room and the blood doesn't remind him enough of it. In addition, he would take "Snow's head" and place it on the doorstep to make sure it's going to be investigated, and so that everyone knows a "Snow" died, to ensure his secret could get out at some point, since it's not the real Snow and her head will change back at one point which not only might destroy his fantasy, but will also make it more difficult for him to get another girl to pose as Snow... and him smashing the mirror doesn't solidify him being the murder in any way, the fact that soon all of fable town could find out what a creep he is in addition with him being a suspect now is more than enough to cause that reaction.

Your effort is noted, it still doesn't make any sense though.

I think that what you are missing if the fact that I am saying that the game wants you (to some degree) to think that maybe Crane is behind it. What I am saying is that I don't think that it is Crane, I am suggesting that up until now it seems possible that maybe Snow is the murderer

[Kieran]

Originally posted by Zursa:

I think that what you are missing if the fact that I am saying that the game wants you (to some degree) to think that maybe Crane is behind it. What I am saying is that I don't think that it is Crane, I am suggesting that up until now it seems possible that maybe Snow is the murderer

If Telltale really "wanted" me to believe that, then they did an even worse job than our politicians are doing in pretending to be competent. Since the consensus around here is that they've already given up on that a while ago, I just find it hard to buy, that's all.

[Kingbob]

Originally posted by BeastBox:

Yeah, I have to agree; this is that "mental gymnastics" I keep calling people out on. There's no way Crane is the killer; he's got a creepy fetish, he's mad/ashamed he got caught on it, and that's all.

Snow as the murderer lacks anything even resembling motive, which is kind of super-important, so until I see that I'm not buying it. I buy Toad killing people with Woody's axe before I buy that.

I agree that this theory lacks motive at the moment but that could simply be because we still have over half the episodes left. However, my question to you then is what suspects so far have a legitimate motive because as far as I have seen any character that seems likely to have done it seems to be working for someone else but no character really has a huge amount to gain from these murders.

[Kingbob]

Originally posted by Kieran:

Originally posted by Zursa:

I think that what you are missing if the fact that I am saying that the game wants you (to some degree) to think that maybe Crane is behind it. What I am saying is that I don't think that it is Crane, I am suggesting that up until now it seems possible that maybe Snow is the murderer

If Telltale really "wanted" me to believe that, than they did an even worse job than our politicians are doing in pretending to be competent. Since the common opinion around here is that they already gave up on that a while ago, I just find it hard to buy, that's all.

Fair enough, it definitely was done in a way that made it open to interpretation.

[BeastBox]

Originally posted by Zursa:

Originally posted by BeastBox:

Yeah, I have to agree; this is that "mental gymnastics" I keep calling people out on. There's no way Crane is the killer; he's got a creepy fetish, he's mad/ashamed he got caught on it, and that's all.

Snow as the murderer lacks anything even resembling motive, which is kind of super-important, so until I see that I'm not buying it. I buy Toad killing people with Woody's axe before I buy that.

I agree that this theory lacks motive at the moment but that could simply be because we still have over half the episodes left. However, my question to you then is what suspects so far have a legitimate motive because as far as I have seen any character that seems likely to have done it seems to be working for someone else but no character really has a huge amount to gain from these murders.

I think the motive is going to tie into the thing Faith stole, and may possible just revolves around Lily (since Faith's murder could have been a mistake; she was filling in for Lily that night). They could come back with a twist, but I have a feeling the murderer hasn't been introduced yet.

I'm still guessing the murder weapon is Woody's axe, even if Woody himself isn't killing them.

[Kieran]

Originally posted by BeastBox:

I think the motive is going to tie into the thing Faith stole, and may possible just revolves around Lily (since Faith's murder could have been a mistake; she was filling in for Lily that night). They could come back with a twist, but I have a feeling the murderer hasn't been introduced yet.

I'm still guessing the murder weapon is Woody's axe, even if Woody himself isn't killing them.

I'm not so sure Faith's murder was a mistake. I still remember thinking Lily might have been the first victim that we haven't found yet the first time I was in the bar and got told from Grendel that she's already been missing for a week while Faith was still running around a few hours before she died. I think it's quite possible or likely the music Beauty heard didn't cover up the murder of Lily but rather that of Faith. There isn't much of an indication of how much time really passed since we first met her.

[SlackerBoe]

My theory: One night Crane and Lily were at the hotel, doing there usual roleplaying sexual fanatsies. All of a sudden there is a knowck at the door. It's the crooked man. He hands crane a envelope and smiles. Crane opens the envelope and sees blackmail photos of him and a glamoured Lilly. The crooked man gives Crane his demands and leaves. Crane throws down the envelope in disgust and looks at lily lieing on the bed. He than makes a plan to kill Lily in the same manner than Faith was to try to pin this murder on the person that killed Faith.

[BeastBox]

Originally posted by Kieran:

Originally posted by BeastBox:

I think the motive is going to tie into the thing Faith stole, and may possible just revolves around Lily (since Faith's murder could have been a mistake; she was filling in for Lily that night). They could come back with a twist, but I have a feeling the murderer hasn't been introduced yet.

I'm still guessing the murder weapon is Woody's axe, even if Woody himself isn't killing them.

I'm not so sure Faith's murder was a mistake. I still remember thinking Lily might have been the first victim that we haven't found yet the first time I was in the bar and got told from Grendel that she's already been missing for a week while Faith was still running around a few hours before she died. I think it's quite possible or likely the music Beauty heard didn't cover up the murder of Lily but rather that of Faith. There isn't much of an indication of how much time really passed since we first met her.

Faith's head was darkening the Woodlands' doorstep the night before Beauty heard the music. And Lily had been missing for weeks. If she was killed long before that night, they wouldn't only just be dropping the body in the river. And the note said Faith was covering for Lily "tonight", which was likely the first night of the game (since Woody was expecting her and not Faith). Plus Lily had the petals in her hand. So yeah, I'm pretty sure she died in 207 while you were contemplating whether or not Gren really needs two arms.

It's a neat idea, but it doesn't quite add up and it makes Lily's death much less interesting since it doesn't really fit into the whole timeline in a constructive way anymore.

PS: I'm not saying Faith's murder actually was a mistake, just contemplating the possibility since she was working Lily's job that night. This could be some other entity trying to find the thing Faith stole, it could be someone after Lily, it could be someone who just likes killing hookers. We don't know enough yet.

[Kingbob]

Originally posted by BeastBox:

It's a neat idea, but it doesn't quite add up and it makes Lily's death much less interesting since it doesn't really fit into the whole timeline in a constructive way anymore.

PS: I'm not saying Faith's murder actually was a mistake, just contemplating the possibility since she was working Lily's job that night. This could be some other entity trying to find the thing Faith stole, it could be someone after Lily, it could be someone who just likes killing hookers. We don't know enough yet.

I agree that the timeline is a bit off but the idea of the crooked man is interesting because each victim was in debt to someone. I think if Beauty ends up becoming a victim then it will be clear that it is the crooked man behind all of it. Perhaps they couldn't keep up their payments on time.