Jumping is different?

[Tilarta]

I've been having this problem a lot, the jumping triggers feel like they're coded differently then in the original games.
I am playing with Tank control setup.

What it feels like to me is that Lara keeps missing jumps I know I can make in the original game.
I didn't even get past 3 jumps in the TR2home obstacle course because she kept slipping off instead of jumping.

Does anyone know how or why this is different enough to keep sending Lara to the ground?

[EF_Neo1st]

Originally posted by Tilarta:

I've been having this problem a lot, the jumping triggers feel like they're coded differently then in the original games.
I am playing with Tank control setup.

What it feels like to me is that Lara keeps missing jumps I know I can make in the original game.
I didn't even get past 3 jumps in the TR2home obstacle course because she kept slipping off instead of jumping.

Does anyone know how or why this is different enough to keep sending Lara to the ground?

The difference in jumping with tank controls are absolutelly zero, playing the old classics and playing the remaster the jumping is exactly the same to the pixel for standing still jumps and run&jump jumps (so much the tricks needed with precise jumping and even glitches can be performed exactlly the same with exacltly the same distances and positioning).

[Chelle-corn]

I've had the same issues, a jump I can make in the classics, I can't make in the remasters. There's definitely something up with the code. Jumping from the first secret surrounded by water in the River Ganges for example, getting to the secret was fine, but the long jump when leaving the secret room just wouldn't succeed. Had to do a hang from ledge, climb up and roll, then run and jump to succeed. Walking to the edge and tapping backwards just wouldn't work no matter what at that jump. Hope I'm explaining that well :P

https://www.youtube.com/embed/n12dV8UxvvE?si=h9DpTbmtALH8Uixq

[EF_Neo1st]

Originally posted by Chelle-corn:

I've had the same issues, a jump I can make in the classics, I can't make in the remasters. There's definitely something up with the code. Jumping from the first secret surrounded by water in the River Ganges for example, getting to the secret was fine, but the long jump when leaving the secret room just wouldn't succeed. Had to do a hang from ledge, climb up and roll, then run and jump to succeed. Walking to the edge and tapping backwards just wouldn't work no matter what at that jump. Hope I'm explaining that well :P

https://www.youtube.com/embed/n12dV8UxvvE?si=h9DpTbmtALH8Uixq

You can see every one of these jumps require a full run distance (1 block)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gp3tdO8q6E

on your video:
First 2 jumps you had her too close to the edge when you was going to grab and the game did not register the grab for that reason (so your fault for jumping that at the edge, this happen anywhere in the classics too)
At 0:03 to 0:04, when you leap backward it is possible to notice she was not aligned and to her left.
At 0:12 you flicked Lara a bit to her right and it shows when you leap backward at 0:14, she was again not aligned but to her right.
Then you jump without run&jump and laugh (for whatever reason, as in you knew it would absolutely fail).
Then you run&jump and land her in the middle and she grabs (goes figure, it worked, as in the classics).
Lara not correcting her alignment when you went backwards also is part of the gameplay, align her going forward like you did wheen you nailed the jump, in case of doubt, use the cam key/button you would use to check around (not the screenshot command, the free camera view) and check if she is properly aligned, these long jumps require the full length and a little bit to the side (or near the edge) andd she will not grab.
Nothing changed with the remaster, always worked like that.

[ERROR_372]

I'm not sure what's up with your video. I just started up TR3 on remastered, skipped to river ganges, got to the secret room, and I literally cannot make her miss the jump back. I did exactly what you did in those jumps (ran from back right corner to left edge after walking up to edge and hopping back, and 2nd jump ran straight from right side to right side of far platform). My only thought with the 2nd jump is that you were actually a bit too far to the right of the far platform for her to get a grab on the edge. Unfortunately without some sort of indicator of x,y,z coordinates and exact angle, the only way to exactly line things up across saves/games is to do hanging strat.

[shadowgravy]

I don't perceive the jumps are coded differently. The jumps and grabs are all about timing.

Step up to the back edge of first platform where the timer digits first appear. (Hint: start from the left side of the platform.) From there you should be able to do a standing jump to the next platform. Continue Lara's forward momentum the instant she lands, and then jump forward when her foot arrives at the front edge of that platform. She should be able to jump the gap. Next, run up to the wall on the next platform until Lara's face is against it, jump straight up, press and hold Action to grab the top, and push forward to have Lara pull herself up onto the platform.

The first black and orange rectangular platform is a running jump. Run from the back edge to the front edge, and jump when Lara's foot comes to the edge of the platform. Her jump should carry her over the gap to the next black and orange platform. Continue running when she lands, and once again jump when her foot touches the edge of the platform. This time, hold the Action button as soon as she jumps, and she should grab and hold the top of the next obstacle.

Pull up, then slide down the ramp to near its bottom, and jump toward the cargo net. You won't catch the net; you'll have to walk up to it in the water. When Lara's face is against the net, jump up, hold the Action button, and climb to the top.

Position Lara on the center of the first black square block (to her left). From there she can make a standing jump to the next block, then a standing side jump to the block to her right, then another standing side jump forward, and then a standing side jump to the block to her left. Make the last standing jump forward.

Slide to near the bottom of the ramp before jumping. Hold Action to catch the net, then climb up the net. Run across the bridge and jump into the water. From there all you have to do is swim to the last cargo net, climb up to the zip line, and ride it down to the end of the assault course.

[EF_Neo1st]

Originally posted by ERROR_372:

I'm not sure what's up with your video. I just started up TR3 on remastered, skipped to river ganges, got to the secret room, and I literally cannot make her miss the jump back. I did exactly what you did in those jumps (ran from back right corner to left edge after walking up to edge and hopping back, and 2nd jump ran straight from right side to right side of far platform). My only thought with the 2nd jump is that you were actually a bit too far to the right of the far platform for her to get a grab on the edge. Unfortunately without some sort of indicator of x,y,z coordinates and exact angle, the only way to exactly line things up across saves/games is to do hanging strat.

I could notice, before each of his failed jumps that were full run&jump, that Lara was not aligned for the jump and that is what happen (also reason why many, including myself, said that modern controls with too much freedom of movement would be more of a hassle than a help in terms of platforming but you can still make modern controls deliver - Chelle was using tank control, I just commented about modern controls because of the alignment problem).
Just a small tap to the left or to thee right is what is happening and leaping backward with Lara not aligned (and in his case I think he would still make both first jumps was it not for Lara trying to grab the block at the edges, where it is prone to fail at all 3 games and would require the most perfect alingment to work at the edges)

[Tilarta]

Got some comparitive data from the original Tomb Raider 2 for comparison.
Something's definitely off, but starting to suspect that is more to do with Windows10 then the game engine.

I do not think it was this game, but I remember one game refusing to acknowledge combo key presses when 3 keys were used/pressed simultaneously.
In this case, pressing forward+jump+grab.

For something specific to this game, there have been many times when I pressed that combo and the screen rotates 90 or 180 degrees.
Then I have to load a savegame and reset the rotation back to normal before trying the jump again.

[Ebin398]

I don't notice any difference. One thing is that I notice I can do the midair roll much more consistently, maybe just because my child hands found it hard to press square and circle at the same time.

[Tilarta]

I don't play with a game controller, I use keyboard.

Forward=Up Arrow
Jump=Alt
Grab=Ctrl

[EF_Neo1st]

Originally posted by Tilarta:

I don't play with a game controller, I use keyboard.

Forward=Up Arrow
Jump=Alt
Grab=Ctrl

I also played the classic TR games on keyboard alone too (both on emulator and the original at PC) with the layout:
WASD - directional control
IJKLOPYUTHG - commands
NB - Pause/Select
And whenever I needed to jump and grab I released jump (J) and pressed action (K) along with always keeping W pressed.
I know the default control scheme of the classics is nowhere near that but I am used to IJKL as Triangle/Square/X/Circle, OP as R1/R2, UY as L1/L2 at emulator and it mimics the ddefault TR scheme on PS1 (extra keys because of extra movements TR at PC dont have because it dont have the "keys combo").

[shonasof]

Originally posted by Tilarta:

Got some comparitive data from the original Tomb Raider 2 for comparison.
Something's definitely off, but starting to suspect that is more to do with Windows10 then the game engine.

I do not think it was this game, but I remember one game refusing to acknowledge combo key presses when 3 keys were used/pressed simultaneously.
In this case, pressing forward+jump+grab.

For something specific to this game, there have been many times when I pressed that combo and the screen rotates 90 or 180 degrees.
Then I have to load a savegame and reset the rotation back to normal before trying the jump again.

Some keyboards have trouble with multi-key presses. That would be my best guess. personally i find everything feels exactly like it did on the PSX. I even pulled out my original discs to compare.

Edit: is it possible that that combination of keys is triggering some function in windows itself or some other open program? that could cause some interference to the game as other things start happening in the background.

Have you tried the same move with a controller? or maybe mapping to different keys to test?

[Ebin398]

I haven't noticed any difference in the jumps.

[Teratus]

I've noticed some aberrations but I believe it's mainly due to player error.

For example, I may have jumped at a slight angle without noticing therefore falling just shy of the maximum distance I needed to grab a ledge.

So it looks like I should have made the jump and grabbed the ledge but I still fell to my death anyway.

This happens sometimes and could be for a few reasons.
Best bet is to always save before you try something you're not 100% sure of.

This was also a thing in the originals as well, it's not new.. just something i've noticed about these games.

[Uzi Master]

Technically, jumping is different in TR1, but only so far as they made it like it is in 2 and 3.

It's almost certainly something on your end, either keyboard ghosting as was mentioned, or input delay caused by something.

[Plomb Rouge]

I believe it's exactly the same than in the original games, however it seems like in the first game jumping work slightly differently because if you press a bit earlier she still waits to reach the end of the tile to jump and there's no super hard pixel perfect jumps.
While in the 2nd game and especially 3rd a few times I noticed you need to jump at the perfect time so Lara starts jumping when she is completely on the edge of the tile (having her feet between the tile you're walking on and the one that is empty).
I don't know how to explain it better so I hope it's clear