Tomb Raider 4,5,6 remaster when?

[TsudaTumiko]

...

It seems that the left media don't want more tomb raiders as they get offended.

https://www.thegamer.com/tomb-raider-remastered-trilogy-4-last-revelation/

[OyajiBR☕]

I WANT TR456 Remastered, but I think they're hard to happen for several reasons.

Lara's French friend Jean Yves in TR4 is a direct virtual version of the real archaeologist Jean Yves Empereur. He sued Eidos and Core for using his image. That's exactly why he's not in TR5. I don't know if Embracer and Aspyr could remaster the game with his image, unless he agrees. TR5 is fun but too short for the effort and depends on TR4 remaster coming as well. And TR6 would need to restore a lot of cut content, stabilise controls, etc. It's hard to happen. The good thing is that gamers are fixing TR6, in a close future we'll see a better version of it.

[Non-Denominated]

By broken from the foundation, you mean that AOD's physics and controls cannot be refined? So you haven't seen any of these Tomb Raider Legend based on the game engines used by Core Design? I never understood why there were some players who just outright hated AOD with no explanation other than controls and physics. They decided to try some thing that was considerably different and I'm not faulting Core for that. The whole nephilim legend was a bit on the silly side, but the game wasn't the worst I've ever played.

[chakkman]

People like to exaggerate. That's all.

[EF_Neo1st]

Origineel geplaatst door Non-Denominated:

By broken from the foundation, you mean that AOD's physics and controls cannot be refined? So you haven't seen any of these Tomb Raider Legend based on the game engines used by Core Design? I never understood why there were some players who just outright hated AOD with no explanation other than controls and physics. They decided to try some thing that was considerably different and I'm not faulting Core for that. The whole nephilim legend was a bit on the silly side, but the game wasn't the worst I've ever played.

AoD is what happen when you have freedon of movement without automatic protection on a non-blocky world and cluttered places you can jump in and grab at, it becomes more of a chore than anything else until too much practice is put into the game and then it still bad amyway.

Legend have a lot of protections that sort of automate the gameplay making it sort of boring in some cases ... in part because of the highlighting if where to go and the auto targeting too, player dont have to think or even explore with the camera, just react to cues and it takes away from the free exploration and free puzzling, it still Tomv Raider but "way easier" or "for those lacking attention abd patience"? I dont know how to describe but TR 2013 not being a TR and TR 1 and 2 from the 90s being and prime examples of how a TR game should be (and I dont mean blocky) LAU is like a transition between "full Tomb Raider experience" from the 90s and "it us everything but a Tomb Raider game" from TR 2013.
I would say that Shadow did better just by hidding the cues and the tombs, despite being sort of linear, are more fun to replay for the puzzling and engaging plqtforming, some even requiring some exploration too.

[Lanzagranadas]

Origineel geplaatst door Non-Denominated:

I never understood why there were some players who just outright hated AOD with no explanation other than controls and physics.

AoD had far bigger problems than controls and physics: http://web.archive.org/web/20130531052922/http://www.edge-online.com/features/making-tomb-raider-angel-darkness/

It's simply a game not even its creators were happy with. AoD isn't something you can fix by just adding better controls.

[v00d00m4n]

Origineel geplaatst door OyajiBR☕:

I WANT TR456 Remastered, but I think they're hard to happen for several reasons.

Lara's French friend Jean Yves in TR4 is a direct virtual version of the real archaeologist Jean Yves Empereur. He sued Eidos and Core for using his image. That's exactly why he's not in TR5. I don't know if Embracer and Aspyr could remaster the game with his image, unless he agrees. TR5 is fun but too short for the effort and depends on TR4 remaster coming as well. And TR6 would need to restore a lot of cut content, stabilise controls, etc. It's hard to happen. The good thing is that gamers are fixing TR6, in a close future we'll see a better version of it.

Paying dude or convincing him it's a good promotion for him and that he is part of culture and history is not a big deal.

In worst case scenario ai could be used to revoice few lines with slightly different name pronounced to sounds the same with same voice over.

[The LEGEND]

AOD deserves the trilogy that it was meant to be. The story is the best in the whole Tomb Raider series

[TsudaTumiko]

I don't know, it looks totally fixable for me:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVjzTrbvBSQ

[Anthony]

Origineel geplaatst door Non-Denominated:

By broken from the foundation, you mean that AOD's physics and controls cannot be refined? So you haven't seen any of these Tomb Raider Legend based on the game engines used by Core Design? I never understood why there were some players who just outright hated AOD with no explanation other than controls and physics. They decided to try some thing that was considerably different and I'm not faulting Core for that. The whole nephilim legend was a bit on the silly side, but the game wasn't the worst I've ever played.

I don't hate it or anything but they could be referring to things like currency and things to sell which are completely useless and you stop seeing them altogether later into the game, or things like the RPG mechanics where you kick this door so that you can kick the other door that's quite literally identical.
Even at the end of the game the one guy comes out of nowhere for 5 minutes and then it's over

[EF_Neo1st]

Origineel geplaatst door Anthony:

Origineel geplaatst door Non-Denominated:

By broken from the foundation, you mean that AOD's physics and controls cannot be refined? So you haven't seen any of these Tomb Raider Legend based on the game engines used by Core Design? I never understood why there were some players who just outright hated AOD with no explanation other than controls and physics. They decided to try some thing that was considerably different and I'm not faulting Core for that. The whole nephilim legend was a bit on the silly side, but the game wasn't the worst I've ever played.

I don't hate it or anything but they could be referring to things like currency and things to sell which are completely useless and you stop seeing them altogether later into the game, or things like the RPG mechanics where you kick this door so that you can kick the other door that's quite literally identical.
Even at the end of the game the one guy comes out of nowhere for 5 minutes and then it's over

Nah, it is broken.
The fixed cameras dont help at all and the controls are clunky and unreliable either way making it be a pita just to do simple things.
Ye,s I know, "speedrunners" of AoD do exist, still how long had they played until they could do it anywhere near like that until they could try to speedrun?
The "feeling second nature" at AoD takes... I dont know how long it takes, I finished the game once back in the day and it never felt anywhere near "second nature" (to do normal stuff wiithout bumping and fallling off everywhere).
Classic TRs felt second nature within a few hours even when it was my first game of the kind, "LAU" and the "Uncharted trilogy featuring a female char named Lara Croft" also felt second nature quite fast (well, a bit faster also classic TRs were one off the first 3D games I played too and without analog stick whatsoever, still it did not took me long)

AoD movement and camera need refinement to the point of requiring a whole remake of both systems for it to be "properly playable" without goingg through a crash course of tens to maybe over hundred hours to have it playable anywhere near as 2nd nature as any other TR game.

[shadowgravy]

I played through the PS2 version of Angel of Darkness "back in the day" and the Definitive Edition mod twice last October. I believe I've played it through unmodded a few times over the years as well. It can be completed in its original formats, but I do like the Definitive Edition which does attempt to fix the controls and improve the levels.

AoD isn't entirely a bad game. Anthony pointed to some of it's glaring imperfections; and I remember AI enemies falling off platforms in the Serpent Rouge nightclub, levers not working, jumps in the Hall of Seasons rooms being almost impossible to control, etc. However there are some really good scenes in the game that make playing it worthwhile.

[Patrick M. Bateman]

TRAOD had such horrible controls

[Lanzagranadas]

Origineel geplaatst door Anthony:

I don't hate it or anything but they could be referring to things like currency and things to sell which are completely useless and you stop seeing them altogether later into the game, or things like the RPG mechanics where you kick this door so that you can kick the other door that's quite literally identical.

Yeah, the game had a serious case of identity crisis and conflicting direction. Pointless currency system, pointless stamina upgrades, NPC interaction mechanics borrowed from Shenmue, Stealth borrowed from Metal Gear or Splinter Cell, Kurtis who was supposed to have unique abilities but they didn't have the time to implement it. Too many ideas cramed in, but with the lack of time and vision to integrate them properly.

All that while also trying to have a more serious, dramatic, and realistic story, as Lara escapes after being framed for Von Croy's death... and begins her quest to find the truth and prove her innocence, while shooting guards in her way. Seriously, that's why it's important for writers/developers to realize when a franchise just doesn't have the framework for serious stories, something the first TR games were perfectly aware of.

First half of AoD feels like the game wants to be too many things, until later in the game it's like "Screw all that, let's go back to being Tomb Raider", and can't even get that right since it already lost most of its predecessors' charm.

[shadowgravy]

The post below was in response to a question that has since been deleted, asking if any of the developers who worked on The Last Revelation and Chronicles also worked on Angel of Darkness. My response was from memory. More accurate information is at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomb_Raider:_The_Angel_of_Darkness#Development and https://www.thegamer.com/tomb-raider-angel-darkness-development-facts-lara-croft/

I don't believe any of the original Tomb Raider (1996) developers were still involved during development of The Last Revelation. According to legend, all the fresh talent Core assigned to the TR3 and TLR projects were burned out on PS1 era Tomb Raider level design, and were eager to move on to something new. So Lara Croft was 'killed.' And the big chair people were outraged, so Core immediately put its most experienced TR designers on Chronicles to repair the damage done to the franchise; and a less experienced team to begin Angel of Darkness for PS2. When the Chronicles team was finally integrated into the AoD project they found it was a complete mess.

[EF_Neo1st]

Origineel geplaatst door shadowgravy:

I don't believe any of the original Tomb Raider (1996) developers were still involved during development of The Last Revelation. According to legend, all the fresh talent Core assigned to the TR3 and TLR projects were burned out on PS1 era Tomb Raider level design, and were eager to move on to something new. So Lara Croft was 'killed.' And the big chair people were outraged, so Core immediately put its most experienced TR designers on Chronicles to repair the damage done to the franchise; and a less experienced team to begin Angel of Darkness for PS2. When the Chronicles team was finally integrated into the AoD project they found it was a complete mess.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomb_Raider:_The_Last_Revelation
"Production of The Last Revelation began in mid-1998, with development running parallel to Tomb Raider III.[12] By this point, series developer Core Design had produced games annually for publisher Eidos Interactive since completing the original game. This led to both franchise fatigue, and emerging physical and mental health issues among the staff. They were also running out of ideas for keeping the franchise relevant.[13][14] Since they were being given a large amount of creative freedom by Eidos, the staff secretly decided to kill off Lara and close the series. They formed the plan over a fortnight, and managed to keep it secret until it was too late to make any changes. When Core Design CEO Jeremy Heath-Smith discovered the team's plan, he reprimanded the team.[15] Despite ultimately failing, the team were generally happy to have killed off Lara.[14]"
Also, you are very wrong (you can check more details onm the team at the link):
https://core-design.com/article2.html

NAME: Richard Morton
AGE: 26
CURRENT JOB TITLE: Level Creator
CURRENT JOB DESCRIPTION: Creating Lara’s new locations, inventing the puzzles and traps, adding the enemies to each finished map, playing the entire game and checking playability.
WORK HISTORY: Tomb Raider II & III

NAME: Martin Gibbins
AGE: 29
CURRENT JOB TITLE: Programmer
CURRENT JOB DESCRIPTION: I am working on effects, traps, puzzles and general engine changes / improvements.
WORK HISTORY: Tomb Raider 3 (PC/Playstation)

NAME: Andy Sandham
AGE: 29
CURRENT JOB TITLE: Level Designer
CURRENT JOB DESCRIPTION: Level design, graphics and objects required for levels specifically under my jurisdiction.
WORK HISTORY: Tomb Raider III

NAME: Mark Hazelton
AGE: 26
CURRENT JOB TITLE: Graphic Artist
CURRENT JOB DESCRIPTION: I produce all publicity graphics for Tomb Raider and Lara. This includes magazines, billboards and the box art. Posing Lara in a 3D software package, I build the relevant scenery and light accordingly. The image is then rendered and retouched by myself, to iron out any floors and add special touches. When I have time I also help out with the games FMV by building models.
WORK HISTORY: Tomb Raider II, Tomb Raider III

NAME: Jerr O'Carroll
AGE: 34
CURRENT JOB TITLE: Animator
CURRENT JOB DESCRIPTION: I’m responsible for the continuation of Lara’s ever-expanding movement abilities. New moves are a major part of what will help Tomb Raider grow, and hopefully these new ones will be up to the task! Also the games in-game cut-scenes and new vehicles.
WORK HISTORY: Tomb II, III & now the fourth

NAME: Derek Leigh-Gilchrist
AGE: 25
CURRENT JOB TITLE: Console Programmer
CURRENT JOB DESCRIPTION: Mainly Technical stuff - I’m in charge of Improving the Game Engine and Optimising the game code so we can get more things happening on screen such as environment mapping, skinning etc.
WORK HISTORY: Tomb Raider - Playstation

NAME: Richard Flower
AGE: 30
CURRENT JOB TITLE: Programmer
CURRENT JOB DESCRIPTION: Responsible for the PC Version and the addition of some of the new features for both PC and PSX.
WORK HISTORY: Tomb Raider III and Tomb Raider II: Golden Mask

NAME: Jamie Morton
AGE: 21
CURRENT JOB TITLE: Level Designer
CURRENT JOB DESCRIPTION: The design, textures and objects for each of my levels. Where traps and enemies will be placed in the maps. Also to help produce the basis of the game story, and new ideas for puzzles and Lara animations.
WORK HISTORY: Tomb Raider III

NAME: Phil Chapman
AGE: More than 21, less than 40!
CURRENT JOB TITLE: Animator
CURRENT JOB DESCRIPTION: Design and animation of enemies.
WORK HISTORY: Tomb Raider III animations

NAME: Tom Scutt
AGE: 34
CURRENT JOB TITLE: Artificial Intelligence (AI) Programmer
CURRENT JOB DESCRIPTION: Programming all the creatures and people (except Lara) in Tomb Raider 4. Prototyping the AI for other Core Design games.
WORK HISTORY: moved to Core in 1998 and worked on the AI in Tomb Raider 3 for the last six months of that project.

Most of the team had worked previously on previous TR games and some even on TR 1 and 2 too.
"From the original" seem like only 1 but there are people that worked on 2 and 3 too.