There a reason we didn't do a unified weapons framework?

[sintri]

Haven't SE'd for a bit but was looking at the spotlight, and seeing weapons on there each with a different framework, pretty sure even previous spotlights never included anything from weaponcore.

Why'd everyone go off to do their own thing? Pretty sure none of them are compatible with each other given they're modifying the same things. Whatever happened to weaponcore, felt like it should've been the clear choice?

[CaveDweller]

My understanding is that the sun rose and set on the Weaponcore empire. People seemed to love it until they realised that it does not play nice with other weapon mods. From what I've read, it seemed as though Weaponcore wanted to be the mod that ends all weapon mods through brute force alone and not skill or talent. I'm open to correction though as I have not really followed the mods development

[Dan2D3D]

Hi, not sure on what you mean but Mods are players sharing the Modif they like and not all will like it.

I remember weaponcore was made for a private server and the author shared on the Workshop after a lot asked for it, that Mod was the authors liking.

[Capt Fuzzy]

I don't have extensive experience with Weaponcore, but I have messed with it here and there. For the most part, I liked it in the beginning, but when others started making their own weapon mods, it presented me with a lot of choices that I didn't have before.
I wanted to use them alongside Weaponcore, but as has been mentioned, they didn't play nice together.
I ended up just going back to the vanilla weapons and dealing with things as they come.
I may look into the weapon mods again some day, but for now, most of them seem to be more trouble than they're worth...

[Dan2D3D]

To be honest, I never needed / never used weaponcore Mod but I saw the first video of a battle in the private server and the reactions of players watching and asking the author to share it.

[TheHellKat]

I've played with weapon core enough to know I don't like weapon core.

Don't get me wrong it is a good mod but it comes with a number of complications that I find really off putting.

It is also very much not user friendly when troubleshooting issues, which can be a major problem when your weapons stop working mid combat.

As far as vanilla frameworks go, I honestly don't think we need one.
Mods allow you to bolt on any additional weapons you like without effecting the base stuff.

[Kreeg]

Most weapon mods play nice, prior to WeaponCore.
Most frameworks don't inject themselves onto everything, but only on stuff they introduced.
WeaponCore decided, that it didn't like that native compatability that mods had, and decided Exclusivity on a Workshop-level was going to be its thing.

WeaponCore, decided it not only was going to operate on its own stuff using its own custom hooks, but it was going to strip the Vanilla support from the game itself.
On top of doing that, it decided that if another mod added its own blocks, that WeaponCore was going to scan it, find that WeaponCore wasn't controlling those blocks and then it would delete those blocks, fire up a scary fake message declaring the other should be deleted, gave the mod's location and steps to uninstall.

So once it started picking a fight with every mod that used Vanilla TypeIDs, and trying to have exclusive control & use of Vanilla TypeIDs, IE entire block types while also not doing anything to that entire type -- it didn't add controls, or support to that entire type.
You still had to write mods dedicated to WeaponCore, there was no native conversion or support , there was just "You can not exist unless you use WeaponCore if you are using Vanilla TypeIDs or have anything to do with These TypeIDs"

Which it kept up with no off-switch for over a week.
So you had a mod, that Suddenly with no warning deleted other mods from user worlds, gave fake error messages to users about other mods, that demanded exclusivity as the Sole mod allowed to use Vanilla typeIDs.

If Keen added a new typeID or weapon using their own TypeID, WeaponCore would flag it, delete it and lock it from the game until WeaponCore decided it was allowed to exist.

So after that, the users and authors that already didn't like WeaponCore, were given a considerable reason to make their own things.
As turns out when a Mod tries to monopolize an entire type of mod, down to trying to install a "Walled Garden" where they own exclusive rights to chunks of the game... It doesn't work out long term.

Every other weapon mod can be installed, without conflicting with each other.
Only WeaponCore has compatability issues -- and that is since it tries to Delete other mods. It wants to be Apple', and force authors & users to be exclusively in their ecosystem.

[FeuerAurora#2839]

I think there should be a main gun competitive and made out of more blocks so it is tuneable ingame.
But game already takes so much ressources that I cannot play on planet (moon is ok though)

[Ronin Planetary Industries]

Mods require updates and maintenance. If they don't get that, the mod stops working. Now imagine building a mod on top of a mod. Now you have twice as many points of failure.

[sintri]

Originally posted by Kreeg:

So you had a mod, that Suddenly with no warning deleted other mods from user worlds, gave fake error messages to users about other mods, that demanded exclusivity as the Sole mod allowed to use Vanilla typeIDs.

Yikes, don't think it was doing that when I tried. Though guess partially made sense it needed to access blocks since it was also revamping penetration and overall damage mechanics. Will take a look when I get around to hopping back on. Though quick look seems like that might've just been an heavy handed method of forcing people to stop complaining and they have added an "/wc unsupportedmode" option for it.

Overall think at the very least we need something given that vanilla engagement ranges are so short. Anything else that a framework could add is sort of just icing on the cake. When you have too many competing frameworks that just ends up with incompatibilities everywhere and then you're forced to pick and choose which to keep and dump.

[Kreeg]

Originally posted by sintri:

Originally posted by Kreeg:

So you had a mod, that Suddenly with no warning deleted other mods from user worlds, gave fake error messages to users about other mods, that demanded exclusivity as the Sole mod allowed to use Vanilla typeIDs.

Yikes, don't think it was doing that when I tried. Though guess partially made sense it needed to access blocks since it was also revamping penetration and overall damage mechanics. Will take a look when I get around to hopping back on. Though quick look seems like that might've just been an heavy handed method of forcing people to stop complaining and they have added an "/wc unsupportedmode" option for it.

Overall think at the very least we need something given that vanilla engagement ranges are so short. Anything else that a framework could add is sort of just icing on the cake. When you have too many competing frameworks that just ends up with incompatibilities everywhere and then you're forced to pick and choose which to keep and dump.

Well thats the irony.

Mods in SE natively don't conflict. The only way to conflict is to modify the exact same block.
WeaponCore went out of its way to artifically make incompatabilities.

It was a 'heavy handed' way to force users to drop any mods that wasn't itself, on the excuse of 'reducing bug reports', but reports were already invalid, and were exclusive to Githib, which auto-identified.
The only reason "unsupported mode" exists is since the automatic deletion which still doesn't register in the game log I might add, caused a near riot.

Vanilla Engagement ranges can be easily considered tiny, but that doesn't require giving a Mod a monopoly & total control over chunks of the game.
All the new frameworks that came after , returned to the Original workshop principles.

Which is "Be compatible with other mods. Do not make it your business to Moderate or control the User Modlist. Do not dictate to your userbase what they are allowed to use"