Rotor attached objects keep ship from standing still

[Ryuul]

my ship won't go down to 0.0 Meters it's always around 0.1/0.05. When I deactivate the inertia damper the ship goes to 0.0. Apparently something moves the ship around and the ship tries to counter it.

It only works when I delete my rotors and the objects attached to it. They are two hangar bays.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=290992633

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=290993992


The bays had originally thrusters, gyroscopes , reactors and a beacon. Now they only have a beacon and 4 small reactors for the interior lights and each 2 covers for the entrance.

Previously: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=287550171

Now: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=291565186

[Tal Maru]

its because the mass of the object on the rotor is applyign torque to the ship and the ship tries to componsate but does not take the object on the rotor into account and does not componsate correctly.

[Ryuul]

But that happens even when the rotors are off. They should keep the objects in place or?

Also what can I do to make it stop?

[Tal Maru]

it keeps it still relative to the ship.
So if the ship wiggles the object on the rotor wiggles.
which causes the ship to wiggle more
which causes the object to wigggle.
and thus the vicious cycle continues.

Do you have the braking torque turned all the way up on the rotors it might help.

[Darth Chalupa®]

As Tal said, it's an issue of the mass of the object compared to the mass of the ship. It's still hapening with the rotors off though? And you've visually confirmed they're off? If they arent moving, but it's still affecting the rest of the ship, then you've got me. Is it possible that even powered down, the movement of the ship is still causing them to move a bit, or is this still happening at a dead stop?

[Ryuul]

All of my rotor are turned off, braking torque is at max, everything is locked with multiple landing gears. The Big Bays weigh 20 Million kg and the ship weights 160 Million kg, both bays together plus the side covers weigh ca, 45 Million. That's still only a quarter of the main ship mass.

[Darth Chalupa®]

I'm not sure how to fix this problem. If the rotors aren't moving, I don't see why they should still be affecting the ship. Hopefully someone else has had the same issue, and has a remedy.

Parting thought. Are you positive it's the rotors? It might be a pain, but if you temporarly dismantle/remove the rotors you can trouble shoot and see if they positively are the problem. Just a thought. Good luck.

[Ryuul]

Also the bays don't move, I only see it trough the energy usage and through Space engineers Toolbox. Also when I reset the Speed in the Toolbox and load the save in the game, then go into toolbox again and reload the speed is again over 0.

I just looked again in the toolbox and the speed varis from object to object but is between 0.017 and 0.004 m/s.

I made a copy of my ship and deleted the rotors and the ship stopped, so it must be the rotors.

[Tal Maru]

This is happening because the child on the rotor does not share the same inertial frame as the parent.
So when your ship moves the child on the rotor has its own inertia which your parent tries to componsate for but cannot because it is not "aware" of the child.
So the parent tries to stop it's self, then the childs inertia drags it a bit more, so the parent tries to componsate, and the child drags it...ect

I have been saying for months that objects on rotors need to share the same inertial frame and CoM calculations as the parent side.

[Ryuul]

Originally posted by Tal Maru:

This is happening because the child on the rotor does not share the same inertial frame as the parent.
So when your ship moves the child on the rotor has its own inertia which your parent tries to componsate for but cannot because it is not "aware" of the child.
So the parent tries to stop it's self, then the childs inertia drags it a bit more, so the parent tries to componsate, and the child drags it...ect

How do I fix that? Could you possible explain that to me?

So you mean the bays move and the Main Ship tries to compensate for that, but than the bays move again etc?

But shouldn't the Landing Gears keep the rotor attached objects from moving?

It is getting a little hard to follow cause English is not my native language.

[Darth Chalupa®]

Landing gear only does so much. For example, you can still see a smaller ship, docked to a larger ship, fidgiting around as you steam about. They acutally improved that alot. Maybe they'll fix it completly some day. I remember a fighter actually breaking loose inside my mothership, causing a good deal of destruction as it collided with things.

i havent had one completly break loose since they fixed it, but they still 'vibrate' as i move about.

[Ryuul]

OK, I thought landing gears would stop them from moving.

[Tal Maru]

Landing gear only keeps it the object from moving relative to the ship.
If the ship moves the object moves and has its own momentum.
So when your ship stops the object's inertia tries to keep it moving.
This drags the main ship and it attemps to stop.
When it attemempts to stop it under componsates because it's not aware of the extra mass on the rotor.
I have stopped trying to use rotors on ships because of all the issues they create which are impossible to componsate for.
I've made fighters with doors that cover the cockpit only to have them torque widly out of control while under thrust.
I've made large ships with large hanger doors that spin widly when trying to stop because the inertia of the door spins the ship around.

[Ryuul]

Thank you for the clarification, the I will just have to live with it for the moment. Maybe it will be better implemented in later updates.

[PepZ]

It may be worth your time and looking at each rotor/hing's velocity.
They may look like they are not moving, but they may be trying too
If the upper/lower limits are incorrect your rotor/hinge may be stuck in position trying to reach its set position.
If you separate the rotor/hing from the main mass and the rotor hing suddenly moves or keeps rotating, then that is adding inertia. [removed section needs power]
TCES | Turret Controller Enhancement Script by Whips can be good for rotor/hinge.
Even has resting positions

[herrschaftg35]

Originally posted by DINGO:

It may be worth your time and looking at each rotor/hing's velocity.
They may look like they are not moving, but they may be trying too
If the upper/lower limits are incorrect your rotor/hinge may be stuck in position trying to reach its set position.
If you separate the rotor/hing from the main mass and the rotor hing suddenly moves or keeps rotating, then that is adding inertia.
TCES | Turret Controller Enhancement Script by Whips can be good for rotor/hinge.
Even has resting positions

"Phantom forces" have existed in the game since it was released. And the forum mods lock any thread that is older than 48 hours, this thread is 9 years old.