The power cell / scrap metal change from way back...

[Riktor87]

Am I the only one who still finds this massively annoying more than a meaningful 'feature"? Even after 2000+ hours I STILL despise this change with every ounce of my being. Just because I want to reconfigure a survival build, the loss of components is just the worst idea KSW has had in its 10 years of se even above the boom hounds... I honestly still prefer the original method "no charge - get cells back" as the proper method. And with the addition of things like turbines, hydrogen engines, etc, this concept is kind of unneeded imo. Just curious how others feel about this and or other changes in the past, for better or worse.

[ShadedMJ]

I think we've all seen it, but it isn't much to be upset about for many of us. Sorry.
Not really worth complaining about.

Could use a mod to get the powercells back
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=541501927&searchtext=grind+down+batteries

Could vote for it, since that is what Keen wants:
https://support.keenswh.com/spaceengineers/pc/topic/change-new-battery-and-powercell-behavior-back-to-their-pre-01-105-states

[Riktor87]

Wasn't really complaining, its kind of become normal now, and yeah im aware of the mod, have my own I use, however when I forget to load it Im hit with a feeling of loathing. Hence why I was more curious what others thought about it after all this time with it being a normal mechanic. People need to quit looking at someone having a disagreement with something as a complaint these days, seriously.

I guess if someone asks an opinion on the climate of a region cause they dislike heat or whatever it's a complaint smh

[Spaceman Spiff]

The purpose of scrapping battery power cells is simple: since batteries are built with a certain amount of starting charge, one would simply grind down a dead battery and rebuild it for free energy. The other option is to eliminate the starting charge. Power cells are easy to make, so I've never stressed about it.

[Riktor87]

Fair enough, yeah they are easy to make and all, just annoying sometimes when your grinding a build and "whoops..." great now I need to go walk back to storage and pack over replacement cells that gets me, speaking of realistic inv sizes of course. I think for me it's just that it's the only object with this kind of mechanic and it always catches me unawares when I'm unprepared But yeah I'm aware of the logic behind the change, and it did of course make sense with the times of application.

Edit; I mean It does however bring SOME legitimacy to my boom trucks and forklifts lol

[Drizzt]

yeah i always play with powercells not being scrapped but new batteries starting empty - which can make for some interesting early game scenarios since you don't get that free charge - but you can move your batteries, while also losing any charge they have - so often a new battery will be be created anyway, so that the charge can be transferred across

also means that batteries can be moved in the initial stages of a build without losing the power cells - while also requiring that a vehicle be built from a merge block or rotor so that the battery can be charged

i don't mind the mechanic since it was easy to mod - and so it allows for varied play styles - i pretty much always use my mod - but now that i'm doing a lot of playthroughs with neutral and hostile ships, stations and drones to hack i may vary my use to add some more challenge - so maybe i won't allow myself to just hack the batteries, and instead have to decide whether to keep them charged but unowned by me, which could cause issues if they are enemy batteries (since my other ships may fire on them) - or instead i can hack them but will need to replace the cells

but i think i still prefer new batteries to start empty whatever happens with the power cells

i think the most important think is to have the option to decide how these kind of mechanics work, and then shape the challenge the way we want - since different game types or play styles may favour different options - or different options could change the way that a particular scenario plays etc

[Riktor87]

Interesting, in all my time I had never actually thought about simply breaking the batteries when taking over outposts "I mean considering I have modded it to get cells back'... Guess I'm a glutton for punishment as I always seem to tell myself not to grind batteries and beat the defenses in a traditional combat style since I do use the hack block to take over all the 'systems" once turrets and bombs etc are neutralized but leave defense emplacements as the actual target. Think subconsciously at least for myself it feels odd taking apart the devices with no presence inside to stop me. "Thanks rust for making me feel what the bottom of the pit is"

[OPERATOR]

I find it annoying too, but not the end of the world, I do get mods to change it to not give scrap + no charge half the time though.

[Drizzt]

Originally posted by Ricktor:

Interesting, in all my time I had never actually thought about simply breaking the batteries when taking over outposts "I mean considering I have modded it to get cells back'... Guess I'm a glutton for punishment as I always seem to tell myself not to grind batteries and beat the defenses in a traditional combat style since I do use the hack block to take over all the 'systems" once turrets and bombs etc are neutralized but leave defense emplacements as the actual target. Think subconsciously at least for myself it feels odd taking apart the devices with no presence inside to stop me. "Thanks rust for making me feel what the bottom of the pit is"

not sure if by "hack block" you mean the mod, since i recall seeing something like that - but i am referring to needing to grind down and rebuild blocks with one or more computers in them in order to take ownership of them - and needing to own most of those kind of blocks on a grid in order to take ownership of it

to be fair, i only tend to hack neutral stations (the Economy orbital stations and moon outposts with the safe zones disabled), neutral ships and the smaller enemy drones that have no turrets and only a few guns and so can be relatively easily approached - and only with an un-nerfed jetpack - the main point is to give me a chance at the beginning of the game when playing using the Corruption mod - since many of the drones from that mod can be pretty relentless, and attack in packs, and are often very heavily armed

(also the pirate stations from Modular Encounters actually send out attack and salvage drones - which i am not sure they do in vanilla)

but with most enemy ships i still use the traditional method of combat (or run away) - but the turrets use the same logic as for hacking and so there is often little to hack or salvage after the battle - which is realistic - but being able to hack a few drones early on allows for construction of a basic space craft, without having to hunt for Platinum etc

it would also be nice if there was a setting for the turret AI which prioritised enemy weapons - i may have to look into mods for that

but i have only recently started playing with the PvE content, and never even had economy enabled in my playthroughs generally - happily spending several thousand hours just mining and building and living out a version of the movie The Martian :-)
(although without the Daily Needs mod - so no potatoes :-))

but i have been having a lot of fun starting on the various moons and spending more time in space of late, and exploring the pirate Mayday signals (and getting blown away often and having to restart - since i play with one life) - or having to run from a little fleet of hardcore Corruption drones or a crazy Reaver - i have quite the "Firefly" roleplay going on :-)

but to get back to the point - yes - i still prefer the batteries being hackable without replacing the cells, and new batteries starting empty - but i also don't often venture close to or into enemy ships or stations to try and hack them - since if the external guns don't get me, they often have internal turrets to defend against that sort of thing - and with my one life policy that is often a quick "game over"

one last note is that there is a limit to how much one can hack a neutral faction before they become hostile (500 points for each) - and the lower quality tools take longer to hack and i have had scenarios where i used up my whole allowance and didn't manage to take control of a station (and will be the same for the largest ships) - and if you want to become non-hostile with the pirates (if not using the Perpetually Perturbed Prates mod), you can only gain 100 points of reputation with them per faction that you hack (or attack i assume) - so you have to do a lot of hacking of multiple factions before you can approach pirates without getting fired on - and you lose rep with the pirates when you hack (or attack) them, so to be able to take over a pirate base or ship this way is not a quick goal

also - some NPC ship types will detect the player boarding and power the thrusters to full - and so with a nerfed jetpack and/or a speed mod you can be in for some wild rides when trying to hijack these :-)

anyway - like i said - it is nice to have the option to decide how we want to play - and currently i'm Malcolm Reynolds with an angle grinder :-)

[Riktor87]

Originally posted by OPERATOR:

Yeah, I mean it's not the end of the world. ;p Do apologize if the op seemed like a 'rant" but I mean if your describing something you like, you say happy stuff, if it isn't well what is there to say to express yourself? I was actually genuinely curious as to others experience regarding it. I mean I have a friend who actually has the opposite case, uses a few personal mods that do the same thing but with various other components of some blocks 'antennas, solar panels, tanks, just to name a few'.

Originally posted by Drizzt:

Yeah I think the ability to customize the play style to what suits you has always been SE's biggest selling point. Apologies I was referring to the mod for hacking / firewalls. I hadn't run across any of these ships that alter thrust output when boarding, well since the pilgrims release, but we play with an assortment of the same mods it seems 'reavers, modular encounters, etc'. So perhaps I will run across these rodeo ships to try and salvage.

I am quite surprised to hear someone else does play by the "one life rule' though. Imo it does add a bit of necessity to actually build some stuff / certain contraptions with a bit of practical as well as logical purpose behind it 'as well as not wasting valuable resources in the early game lol". I will however say the one exception I use is if the death is a result of clang, which honestly happens far more often than I'd like to admit. But when in doubt, just use more pistons, it'll buff out in the sim speed.

[Geck0]

eh, i kinda like it as it is now, making batteries have a bit of power to start with rather than coming in empty.
what's weird to me is that they don't have lithium or zinc in them.

[Riktor87]

Originally posted by Geck0:

eh, i kinda like it as it is now, making batteries have a bit of power to start with rather than coming in empty.
what's weird to me is that they don't have lithium or zinc in them.

Yeah I think that's always been whats jarring to me when I forget the mod. Since In my head I see power cell I think of like the rechargeable packs with the yellow heat shrink around them you can use in things like RC. Reality != Expectations lol

[Gasboy]

It's no big deal.

[Drizzt]

Originally posted by Ricktor:

I hadn't run across any of these ships that alter thrust output when boarding

it is this one - SPOILER ALERT - R.U.S.T. Freighter

I am quite surprised to hear someone else does play by the "one life rule' though.

i do it in pretty much every game i play - Skyrim, Factorio - i often even restart Kerbal Space Program if i kill a Kerbal - don't want to carry that guilt around with me lol

so in Factorio i really had to learn to watch out for trains.....

I will however say the one exception I use is if the death is a result of clang

yeah - if it's the game's fault i will decide if i want to continue based on if i am enjoying it enough, or would prefer to restart - i also play with an increased speed limit, and so have ended many games by flying face first into stuff due to inadequate braking distance lol - but other times have been killed when welding a broken closed door as it suddenly spawns into existence in the space that i am standing and the resultant existential confusion causes me to be catapulted through a wall to my death :-) - i also don't respawn and instead load the last save if i decide to continue

although i may set up a deep space game and have a main ship that i will allow myself to respawn on, basically roleplaying as a Cylon in Battlestar Galactica :-)

[Spaceman Spiff]

Originally posted by Drizzt:

Originally posted by Ricktor:

I hadn't run across any of these ships that alter thrust output when boarding

it is this one - SPOILER ALERT - R.U.S.T. Freighter

The Encounter Imp does it too.

[Riktor87]

Ill have to keep my eye open for those signals I suppose ;p