Worlds keep switching to experimental

[BonnieB]

This has happened to me twice now. I open a creative world in normal/stable mode to build ship designs, I just now attempted to load a world that I started in normal mode, but the world got unloaded and I got the error I couldn't open Experimental Mode worlds. *I did NOT save it in experimental!* I do not understand why this keeps happening, it's terribly annoying because experimental mode worlds cause performance issues with my old rig. Is there anything I can do to prevent this?

[TheHellKat]

The one thing that springs to mind is the 'Share Inertia Tensor' option as I believe it is experimental only, so if you have any blocks with that option then the world save would be an experimental one.

That being said I play exclusively on experimental so my knowledge of the differences between them is somewhat out of date.

[Dan2D3D]

Hi, looks like the settings have been changed in the world you try to load in the Default mode and why it enabled Experimental auto.

You will have to disable Experimental and create a new world where you can paste back in your creations, well Blueprint the ones in the Experimental save first so you can have all in the Bp menu F10 in-game and paste back in using the God mode in Alt+F10 (enable creative in survival)

[BonnieB]

Originally posted by Dan2D3D:

Hi, looks like the settings have been changed in the world you try to load in the Default mode and why it enabled Experimental auto.

You will have to disable Experimental and create a new world where you can paste back in your creations, well Blueprint the ones in the Experimental save first so you can have all in the Bp menu F10 in-game and paste back in using the God mode in Alt+F10 (enable creative in survival)

So hang on. Changing settings whilst in the admin tool can change it from stable to experimental without my consent or even a warning? How about making it so worlds don't get saved in Experimental without my permission.

[Dan2D3D]

Keep in mind the game is the same on both modes, it becomes different when we change its settings.

Game mode :

1 - Default "Safe mode" = Limited so to have a better server Perfo and to be fair in PVP.

-> For MP play where we can build the needed on one planet only and must play with friends to be able to build more.

___________

2 - Experimental = Unlocks all world advanced settings + can add Mods + can play with Scripts + can disable the Block limit + can create complex Multigrid.

-> For Solo play where we can build ships and stations on all planets and way more by disabling the "Block limit".

[Dan2D3D]

Originally posted by BonnieB:

So hang on. Changing settings whilst in the admin tool can change it from stable to experimental without my consent or even a warning? How about making it so worlds don't get saved in Experimental without my permission.

For that I am not sure cause I always play Experimental to be able to build on all planets and be able to build stable Multigrid creations.

But I will go try to see if messing in the Admin menu Alt+F10 will change the world mode, be back later ....


Edit
Note
Multigrid creations can lower the server Perfo when too much in a world and why it's in Experimental mode only.
(Multigrids that needs "Share inertia tensor" to be stable)

[Dan2D3D]

BonnieB, can you share the exact steps you did in the Admin menu?

Because I was not able to reproduce following those steps ;

1 - Disabled "experimental" in game options.

2 - Created a new Star System world all on default settings exept I disabled "Block progression" and "auto-respawm" (cause I don't like those)

3 - Loaded and selected the Earth Droppod.

4 - Openned the admin menu to enable creative and pasted in a Blueprint of mine.

5 - Saved and exited to main menu.

=
Experimental mode was not enabled.

BUT
-> it switched to Experimental mode after loading a Workshop world set Experimental mode.

Now I will go try by pasting in a Blueprint made for experimental, so one having "Share inertia tensor" enabled on it and see if that will change to experimental auto.

Be back later and you may share your exact steps by the time I will go do more testing ...

[Dan2D3D]

More testing = Still not able to reproduce

Testing details :

1 - Keep experimental OFF
2 - Load my new world created in the Default mode and it loded OK
3 - Enabled Creative in the admin menu Alt+F10
4 - Pasted in a Blueprint created in experimental mode, so having "Share inertia tensor" enabled on all pistons, hinges and rotors.
5 - Noticed the "Share inertia tensor" was completely removed after pasting my new Building station in :
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2782600752


I'll say try to find the exact steps to reproduce and share it here so I can add it to my report to the SE Team.

[Dan2D3D]

BonnieB,

could it be possible that you loaded a Modded Workshop World save that enabled "Experimental" and later on you loaded your Default mode world and saved it in Experimental mode ?

-> it got saved while Experimental was enabled
+
You disabled Experimental later
+
Now that save give you a popup message saying "Experimental must be enabled to open that save" ??




EDIT

OR
You joined a Modded server / Friend world set experimental that enabled experimental auto.
+
Later on you loaded and saved your Default world while in experimental mode.

[BonnieB]

Negative on all accounts. These are worlds I created on my own. So far the only correlation between both instances is that I disabled PCU limit. I would also like to remind you that I cannot load stable worlds while experimental mode is enabled in the game menu, nor can I load experimental worlds with Experimental World disabled in the game menu. I did Google this before and my search results came back telling me that I can't change world settings, that if I wanted to get a world out of experimental I had to basically recreate it with experimental mode disabled in the game menu, so I am not sure why you suggested I did this.

[Dan2D3D]

I just try to find the exact steps to reproduce because I can't on my side playing all on Default.

Plus I must not save in experimental mode cause I can't revert back to "default mode" after.


I think it may be better for you to report all this to the ones working on the game.

Support Portal = https://support.keenswh.com/spaceengineers/pc
(create "Bug report" or "Request help"(Private) or "Feedback"(Petition) on the Portal)

Here some important Data we have to add in the report to help the SE programmer before they ask you :
Bug report Guide
https://steamcommunity.com/app/244850/discussions/1/523897653318639486/

Note
All may use the Support Email to report the bugs found if they prefer :
Email = [e-mail]

[Sir Spoony]

Originally posted by Dan2D3D:

I just try to find the exact steps to reproduce because I can't on my side playing all on Default.

Plus I must not save in experimental mode cause I can't revert back to "default mode" after.


I think it may be better for you to report all this to the ones working on the game.

Support Portal = https://support.keenswh.com/spaceengineers/pc
(create "Bug report" or "Request help"(Private) or "Feedback"(Petition) on the Portal)

Here some important Data we have to add in the report to help the SE programmer before they ask you :
Bug report Guide
https://steamcommunity.com/app/244850/discussions/1/523897653318639486/

Note
All may use the Support Email to report the bugs found if they prefer :
Email = [e-mail]

Sorry ahead of time for the long post...Just a frustrated long-time supporting player...

I am at the point of believing KEEN truly does not want to be responsible for supporting their game by not allowing players to be notified that they are choosing experimental mode with their current action. What is wrong with this is I changed nothing just today to even spark experimental mode at all and it made a game save I was literally playing non-experimental for 2 years into experimental tagged after exiting and reentering the same game without changing a thing. A 2-year-old save is gone forever now if I want game support. This is the first reason I quit playing years ago because I thought switching to experimental mode would've just been for that one game save, but instead, it tagged and label every single save I had to experimental! AT the time I had over 30 game saves! So many hours and builds lost if I wanted to maintain support! So sure I could turn it on again and get my designs, but then my 5 other non-experimental games would also turn into experimental mode games. This should be done on a game-by-game basis in settings, not account-wide...

You and I both know KEEN does not provide support for experimental mode even though it is KEEN that decided to allow the workshop. KEEN forces players into experimental mode without their consent or knowledge just by changing something simple like daylight cycle or making sure you can build unlimited. Such a poor show of support. Using workshop MODs should be the only thing KEEN does not support. Instead, KEEN limits the vanilla game settings to force players into experimental mode because they know outside of weak settings the game still does not perform well. WHY let the settings go past the "HIDDEN" vanilla setting limits at all then without first turning on experiment mode and then and only then allowing the sliders and checkboxes to be increased beyond vanilla limits? This makes no sense at all that KEEN forces players into an experimental mode that do not want to be in experimental mode.

A true shame. I was returning to streaming. I thought trying this out once again was a great idea, and things were really working out well. I was even going to make sure this game was one of my most featured games. I wanted to also import a non-experimental save onto a hosted server, but with KEEN's hidden limits and unstableness forcing experimental mode you destroyed any hope of this ever happening. Players cannot revert back to normal/vanilla mode once tagged experimental which digs this completely unfair ditch even further! It is unbelievable how unfair this is and the grief it causes!

I just went to edit settings for a game save I just literally played 25 minutes ago with no issue, just to check if block limits were still set correctly. The game was acting like I met the block limits of creative mode and it never stated this in its 2 years of life. Isn't creative mode supposed to be unlimited and built at your own leisure? Ridiculous if you actually changed that and forced a setting change without the consent of my 2-year-old non-experimental game save. Why was I allowed to leave and reenter today a few times without any issues? I changed no settings at all and didn't even toggle anything or activate a slider. I hit cancel since I changed nothing and tried to reenter the game with 20+ ship designs to find it was considered experimental mode...FOR WHAT REASON? Nothing was changed in this 2-year-old NON-EXPERIMENTAL MODE game!

Well, congratulations KEEN you finally lost this player and quite a few hundred disappointed players that signed up as interested in the server idea last month. I can't play/support a game any longer that forces you into a non-supported option without your consent. This makes one really question the morality of such a company that does this to its own player base. True most love experimental mode because all those that didn't quit over the last few years to never return, but some of us which used to be many of us like having game support from a game that provides it! I guess I will just join my vanilla friends that also all quit and play other things due to this same reason.

A true shame what KEEN is doing to players. Definitely starting to see why the game is not even more successful. A true shame indeed. I would send a support email, but now that the game save is labeled experimental out of my own control; I am tagged as a forever non-supported player!

So I guess going into edit settings for a creative game and then hitting cancel because you changed nothing = forces players into experimental mode! Enough is enough for me. COuld've been the greatest game in my lifetime anyways, but instead thrown away and lost for the rest of it instead...

[Sir Spoony]

Originally posted by BonnieB:

Negative on all accounts. These are worlds I created on my own. So far the only correlation between both instances is that I disabled PCU limit. I would also like to remind you that I cannot load stable worlds while the experimental mode is enabled in the game menu, nor can I load experimental worlds with Experimental World disabled in the game menu. I did Google this before and my search results came back telling me that I can't change world settings, that if I wanted to get a world out of experimental I had to basically recreate it with experimental mode disabled in the game menu, so I am not sure why you suggested I did this.

All I did was go to settings to check that they were the same as when I lasted played due to the game stating I reached max limits in creative mode or all things... I then hit "CANCEL" because I changed nothing and it forced my game into experimental mode. Once tagged as experimental I have learned that you are no longer a supported player by KEEN support.

Old post but my situation that just happened was similar to this. Even if I did accidentally or intentionally change something there should be a pop-up prompt that lets me, you, and all players know if you do this experimental mode will need to be enabled.

It si like they do not want to provide support for their game that came with support...frustrating!

[Dan2D3D]

Originally posted by Sir Spoony:

Originally posted by BonnieB:

Negative on all accounts. These are worlds I created on my own. So far the only correlation between both instances is that I disabled PCU limit. I would also like to remind you that I cannot load stable worlds while the experimental mode is enabled in the game menu, nor can I load experimental worlds with Experimental World disabled in the game menu. I did Google this before and my search results came back telling me that I can't change world settings, that if I wanted to get a world out of experimental I had to basically recreate it with experimental mode disabled in the game menu, so I am not sure why you suggested I did this.

All I did was go to settings to check that they were the same as when I lasted played due to the game stating I reached max limits in creative mode or all things... I then hit "CANCEL" because I changed nothing and it forced my game into experimental mode. Once tagged as experimental I have learned that you are no longer a supported player by KEEN support.

Old post but my situation that just happened was similar to this. Even if I did accidentally or intentionally change something there should be a pop-up prompt that lets me, you, and all players know if you do this experimental mode will need to be enabled.

It si like they do not want to provide support for their game that came with support...frustrating!

It's a good suggestion to send to the SE team so I will add it to my monthly report to help you on this.

+
I strongly recommend to report on your side too so I will not be alone reporting, the more report they receive will push on the priority.


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++
Don't be shy to create a new forum discussion if needed.

[Dan2D3D]

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