Colonial Charter Mod Question

[megapolis]

I have a question. In two words: are there any new aspects that CC Mod adds to the game.

Now I will explain my question in details.
The game is about citizen management. You have to provide them with the following resources and services:
Shelter
Warmth (with fuel indoors and clothes outdoors)
Food
Health (by providing them with 4 different types of food and a hospital)
Happiness (divided into safety, spirit, goods and alcohol)
Productivity (education and proper tools)

I might have forgotten something but the list above explains the idea. So the question as stated above is: are there any new aspects that CC Mod adds to the game or it just makes the game wider and increases micromanagement?

[ebrumby]

Since it's free, I think you should try it an decide for yourself.

[megapolis]

Unfortunately it will take too much time to create a village big enough to find it out.

[Ddoge]

then no

[ThePlagueBeast]

It adds variety in all aspects, and something akin to a tech tree to try and achieve.

[Duke Flapjack]

I use both CC and NMT as they work well together. I am unsure exactly what it is you're looking for, though. While it is 100% true that neither of these two mods really adds anything to the mechanics of the game, they DO add to HOW you fulfil the dynamics. I highly recommend at least CC. You can get version 16 off of their website (it's not yet on Steam as it relies on the beta patch).

[ebrumby]

If you are that picky, I would be reluctant to recommend anything to you. I love 1.6. But then I'm just out to have hours of fun.

[megapolis]

Captainradish, I am looking for some additional challenge in the game. Currently I have a village with 800 citizens on hard difficulty. I use only mod for huge map and infinite mines. I understand that changing climate to cold won't add a new challenge to me. It will just slow down my development. Next I will exploit flattening terrain mod to make biggest population possible. As I understand it is around 8000, knowing that storage limit for food is 999999. I don't like RPGs so things like NMT won't add anything to me. I prefer pure math challenge.

Ebrumby, sometimes mods turn everything upside down. I was hoping it is that case.

[Boneidle001]

Megapolis from what you have asked I reckon that yes CC will add a bit more of a challenge.

So there is a crafting tree which is pretty extensive, in vanilla its pretty simple but in CC there are so many different types of resources and ways of using those resources that if will deffiently be a challenge. If you are using 1.6 then even more so as there is so much new stuff to use. I would simply say that you can play the game and not use much of the CC mod if you really wanted to but if you reckon that the game is too easy you should consider building a city using the CC houses etc etc.

Just to build the new CC houses you need a multitude of goods which means you will have to start a town get your production chains running and then start building the more "advanced" houses.

Just be careful jumping into CC is like jumping into a whole new game the first time of the production chains are very extensive.

[Reverend Belial]

Ultimately no it does not, because something like 80% of the game is hardcoded (from what I've heard anyway) so it's literally impossible to change anything directly related to settlers.

[lissa_981]

It will add vaiety to the game and add more building types and adds quite a bit to the late game (nicer/larger houses, more advanced production options) for a challange try the 1 year is 1 year mod, and an Adam and Eve senerio-- you get exactly 2 colinists and it will take at least 6 YEARS not seasons for thier 1st kid to become a worker 13 before they can begin reproducing. It changes the pace of the game drasticly.

[megapolis]

Lissa, thanks for an idea. The problem is that 1 year is 1 year will add something only to the start pace. In fact when your population is above 500 you don't care about length of citizen's lives. You only care about proper amount of children that stays the same in both cases. Longer lifespan is even a plus.

By the way I have started a fresh game with CC. The only reason why I finally decided to go for CC is Tinned Fruits and Tinned Vegetables. They might help with seasonal peaks of food storage.

Unfortunately my fears were true.

The interface is crowded with buildings. It took me 5 minutes to find Herbalist on the list. I really mean 5 minutes.

The lists became so long that they don't fit the screen. In Vanilla I used list of professions quite intensively. Now I have to use short list with labourers and builders only. (At least it exists and it is good). The limits are awful. I hate to see Iron Ore in building materials limit. I cannot get used to it. Reaching materials limit stops too many factories of different kinds.

Charcoal is a new powerhouse. Even good old Firewood was a cheat. Charcoal is twice as efficient.

CC Wiki is useless. Too hard to find information about productivity of new industries, storage limits of new buildings, weight of new materials and ores.

Different slaughterhouses for different sorts of meat? Are you kidding me? I have another brilliant idea. There are dozens types of trees in the forest. Each type should have its own type of logger's hut and different type of sawmill that produces different types of logwood and different types of lumber. Unfortunately there will be no place for trees in a forest full of loggre's huts and... Damn, hardwood is already here...

On the other side is the fact that the start is really a bit longer and some buildings are a bit smaller. Unfortunately in the long run it does not matter much. It just adds a bit of waiting.

But still I have to fight all these downsides because I want to look at tinned food industries and upgrades to ordinary 3x4 houses with bigger storage (other types of houses are useless). Maybe I will find another gem in CC but now I doubt it.

[Vrayna]

Originally posted by megapolis:

The limits are awful. I hate to see Iron Ore in building materials limit. I cannot get used to it. Reaching materials limit stops too many factories of different kinds.

We agree on that one. Sadly there are very few limits available and modders cannot add new ones with the modkit, they have to use what's available. No way to work around that unless/until Luke modifies the modkit to give modders more freedom to work around limits.

Originally posted by megapolis:

Different slaughterhouses for different sorts of meat? Are you kidding me? I have another brilliant idea. There are dozens types of trees in the forest. Each type should have its own type of logger's hut and different type of sawmill that produces different types of logwood and different types of lumber.

Don't blame CC for that. Limitation of the game. A building that accepts different types of input materials cannot give several different output stuff. We could make one that accepts all kinds of meats but only gives meat cuts. Not one that accepts all kinds of meats and gives meat cuts and sausages and tallow. It just crashes when we try to add that with the modkit, and believe me a lot of time has been spent trying to work around that limitation and to twist things around to avoid the crashes. It's just one of those things that'd require magic to happen (just like the upgraded fields using manure as a fertilizer for a production boost.)

Originally posted by megapolis:

CC Wiki is useless. Too hard to find information about productivity of new industries, storage limits of new buildings, weight of new materials and ores.

There are too many articles in the wiki to add specific numbers in them. Those numbers change from version to version each time CC gets an update. The sheer amount of things to modifiy each time would require someone with a lot more time to take care of updating that than anyone has.
Production Numbers are supposed to be on spreadsheet. There is one such spreadsheet for CC 1.5. The one for 1.6 is being worked on and should be ready when CC 1.6 is "officially" released. We're still in the early release version while Banished is in Beta. On top of the production numbers like we had for 1.5, it should have the storage capacities of all buildings, fuel consumption for houses and things like that.
There again it is a considerable amount of work that doesn't do itself magically. Denis has been spending his free time on that for the last couple of months. None of us is paid to do any of that. If you feel like we're doing a bad "job" at documenting, fair enough but remember it's not a job, we do it because we enjoy helping people have more fun in Banished if they feel that the vanilla game has turned stale.
I actually was reluctant to add numbers because the moment we add them, we get even more people telling us "but this is not profitable enough, this is overpowered, I want this easier, make the game harder" etc etc. Although they listen to suggestions and requests, ultimately the modders themselves have the last word on what they feel is the correct balance. There's no way to please everyone.

[lissa_981]

I agree that cc takes some getting used to in regaurgds to where things are in the menu. I've said it before, and I'll say it again here: This mod is beging for a UI more reminicent of Pharoh, it is too clunky to look appealing, even while the buttons are so small that they are difficult to access. Please just cut off a section of screen and make somthing that looks nice, and is relitivly easy to figure out. I'm not really a Wikki person.
I tend to prefer to figure things out on my own so I can't make any real comments on the documentation, but the in-game CC (compendium maybe) where the icons explained could benifit form a hover tool tip detailing the processes. Rather then sim I play the game more like Pharoh (what I used to cal a walking sim untill that phase go hyjacked to mean somthing else entirly) Many mods seem aimed at prettyifying your town-- I should care, I understand why others care, but I really just don't... sorry.
It does add much to the end game though. I tend to get bored around the 500-700 citizens point as I keep hitting a citizen wall around there-- that is no matter what I do it seems births and deaths equlize out. I have food, I have fire wood, I have tools all in abundance. I'l building houses as fast as I can and 20 years later my workforce is the same dispite my baby/student #'s doubeling-- topping out at a little over 100 each, and still I have 400ish working citizens. At that point I quite in disgust. As such ther are still supply chans in CC I have not manged.. one day lol

As to the 1 year is 1 year only affecting pace, you are partialy correct. I say partially because untill you try it you don't realize just how much of the game is effected/dictated by pacing. I'm a start addict. I love starting new games and overcomming the innitial challanges and balancing the jobs early on to keep a very small population happy, healthy, and thriving. For me that is where the game shines.

[Mr. Shaggnificent]

I just tried CC and holy crap is it complicated. It seems like every industry is dependant on half of the other ones.

[Boneidle001]

Thats what you call a production chain. After a while you sorta get used to what you need and what you dont need right away.

What makes me laugh thou is as you read through this post its started out asking is it more of a challenge etc and as you guys are starting to use CC you are now complaining its a bit complex or somethings arent the way you want it.

As Vrayna said they do this modding in thier spare time and for fun. If you guys dont like it i would suggest looking for other mods which you do like as CC has a huge following because of how challenging and fun it is.