Are farms useless?

[Benzin]

Hi all, im new to the game. After going thru the tutorials, i was left with the impression that farms & orchads are the "primary" means of producing food. So on my first games i went that way. But i allways had severe food shortages. Restarted the game a few times, trying different types & sizes of farms & orchads, making sure they are close to the barn, properly staffed, etc. Also build a fishing cabin for complement. And same results. Food shortages.

Then after looking at production statistics compared to the fishin cabin, i restarted the game, and this time i went with fishing cabin, gatherer and a hunter. -No Farms!-
And viola! food is now thru the roof, my town has grown far more than i ever managed with farms, and with 3 times the ammount of people i had in previous games, i still have a large surplus of food.

Looking at the stats, fishers, gatherers and hunters ALL seem to produce more food per season than any farm, plus they dont stop working on winters. So now im wondering...
¿whats the point of building farms? ¿Are they unbalanced (underproduce)? ¿why would i ever want to bother using them? or maybe im not using them properly?

thanks!

[Dakota~]

Farms are a mid-late game food source gatherers are more people effieient by 2x "MAX" BUT are not space efficient, thus mid to late game you start needing more space.

[Tony 101101]

You do need farms!
Just not early on in the game!

Early on rely on gatherers and hunters for food...
Advantages here are year-round food accumulation as opposed to an autumn-only harvest. Also, make sure that you clear the land of stone and iron from the whole area around the gatherer's hut. This allows the tree density to become maximal and since whatever food the gatherer gathers only grows under trees the denser the trees are the more food there will be to be gathered.

However as the game progresses, the amount of land required for full production from many gatherer huts and hunting lodges becomes unsustainable. You will need that land for other purposes.
So, early on gatherers are very good because the amount of food per individual gatherer is very high. Hunters are not so productive but one nevertheless requires the meat and the leather.

The productivity with farms is different. Farms, and orchards for that matter, produce a lot of food for the amount of land that they occupy.
Pastures are also required but their productivity, in terms of land used, is less than farms and orchards. Once pastures are full they also produce food year-round.

So, which food-producing strategy to use changes as your town grows.
Early on, the productivity one requires is related to food produced per individual assigned.
Later, when space is at a premium, productivity needs to become a function of food produced per unit of land used.

I never fully transition to farms, orchards, and pastures only.
Even late in the game - as much as possible I continue to hunt and gather...
I almost always continue with about four forest nodes (hunting lodge, gatherers hut, foresters lodge, seven houses, and a barn and a market) throughout my town's development. These areas are protected from development.

[Benzin]

Gotcha, thanks guys for your input.

So i can conclude that farms are good for mid / late game. And even then i cannot rely on them providing ALL the food for my people. I still need fishers, hunters, gatherers.

I think the problem on my case was, i was mislead by the tutorial into believing that farms were the way to go from the start. Plus in many other games this is true (kindgoms & castles, planetbase, judgement:, etc.).

¿I wonder how many ppl a single farm (lagest size) can sustain? and, ¿is there a formula to calculate what is the optimal number of ppl working on a farm according to its size?

[pdoan8]

Crop farm is good at any stage of the game. One of the two ways to mass produce food. I always begin a medium start game with 2 crop farms (100-120 tiles).

One farmer can handle up to 121 tiles in fair or mild weather. In harsh weather, it should be fine for fast growing crop such as bean and cabbage. Produce maximum of 7 food per tile. Crop farm is second best in food production per worker.

[Tony 101101]

Originally posted by Benzin:

Gotcha, thanks guys for your input.

So i can conclude that farms are good for mid / late game. And even then i cannot rely on them providing ALL the food for my people. I still need fishers, hunters, gatherers.

I think the problem on my case was, i was mislead by the tutorial into believing that farms were the way to go from the start. Plus in many other games this is true (kindgoms & castles, planetbase, judgement:, etc.).

¿I wonder how many ppl a single farm (lagest size) can sustain? and, ¿is there a formula to calculate what is the optimal number of ppl working on a farm according to its size?

Optimum number of farmers per unit size: 1 farmer per 121 units (11 X 11). I specifically makes my farms 11 X 22 with two farmers. Make sure they are orientated north to south, with a barn immediately to the south. Also, make sure to activate labourers to do the gathering of the harvest. This means that the farmers dedicate themselves to actually doing the harvesting rather than waste time fetching and carrying...

As mentioned, food production with farming is 7 food per tile maximum. Thus my farms produce 7 X 11 X 22. This about 1600 food with change. So two farmers produce enough food for themselves and 14 other citizens each season. (Each citizen, regardless of age consumes 100 food per year).

[Benzin]

Thanks again guys.
I think i now see what i did wrong. I think i made my farms too small. I dont recall the exact size, but im 100% they were FAR smaller than 11x11, and certainly from 11x22. Plus, i also overestimated the ammount of farmers required. I placed too many people tending farms that were to small.

On my current game im at about 50ppl, have plenty of food, and i just bought a couple of sheeps from a trader, to start getting wool. Right after i settle those sheep in, im gonna try building a couple of 11x11 farms and see how it goes!

[Benzin]

Guys, a slightly off-topic quick question, ¿Is it Ok to place the forester and a gatherer together in a wooden area? ¿wont it decrease the productivity of the gatherer?
thanks

[Dakota~]

Originally posted by Benzin:

Guys, a slightly off-topic quick question, ¿Is it Ok to place the forester and a gatherer together in a wooden area? ¿wont it decrease the productivity of the gatherer?
thanks

actually it will increase since the forester plants more trees Thus more area for the gatherer to gather.

[Benzin]

Originally posted by Thedillon25100:

Originally posted by Benzin:

Guys, a slightly off-topic quick question, ¿Is it Ok to place the forester and a gatherer together in a wooden area? ¿wont it decrease the productivity of the gatherer?
thanks

actually it will increase since the forester plants more trees Thus more area for the gatherer to gather.

Excellent!
I will make "In-forest production hubs", of a hunter, gatherer and forester next to each other in the middle of the woods, with a stone road to the barn in town for quick access. :)
Thanks!

[Benzin]

Originally posted by Benzin:

Originally posted by Thedillon25100:

actually it will increase since the forester plants more trees Thus more area for the gatherer to gather.

Excellent!
I will make "In-forest production hubs", of a hunter, gatherer and forester next to each other in the middle of the woods, with a stone road to the barn in town for quick access. :)
Thanks!

I guess it might be a good idea to also place a small stockpile in these "hubs", so they dont have to walk all the way into town to bring in the goods.

[Dakota~]

Originally posted by Benzin:

Originally posted by Benzin:

Excellent!
I will make "In-forest production hubs", of a hunter, gatherer and forester next to each other in the middle of the woods, with a stone road to the barn in town for quick access. :)
Thanks!

I guess it might be a good idea to also place a small stockpile in these "hubs", so they dont have to walk all the way into town to bring in the goods.

well that is up to debate, if its far away as 300+ tiles then yea otherwise it screws your woodcutters up.

[Benzin]

I tried to build an 11x22 crop, and the game doesnt allow me, it sais "the crop is too large". I guess larger crops can only be built using mods?

[Tony 101101]

Originally posted by Benzin:

I tried to build an 11x22 crop, and the game doesnt allow me, it sais "the crop is too large". I guess larger crops can only be built using mods?

Quite possibly - it is some time since I have played vanilla Banished...
So, I am very happy to accept the accuracy of your observation!

[Benzin]

Originally posted by Tony 101101:

Originally posted by Benzin:

I tried to build an 11x22 crop, and the game doesnt allow me, it sais "the crop is too large". I guess larger crops can only be built using mods?

Quite possibly - it is some time since I have played vanilla Banished...
So, I am very happy to accept the accuracy of your observation!

Just making sure, you dont have one of those mods that increase the productivity of farms, right? :)
I ask because if you do, then i will have different results! haha

[jim]

1 mod that is good for farms is the 1 wich makes farmers more effective. If not you have a good chance that they only harvest 50-60 % of the crop.
The mod i rely to is the 1 that makes farmer harvest in baskets so they survive on the map during all season/weather until picked up
Pritty new so i don't remember the name but wouldn't call it a cheat, they simply do what they should have done in first place.
At a 11/11 farm you mostly manage to grow at the whole with 1 worker but only harvest 40-100% depending on the type you grow without the mod.
Anyway good luck