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I think the issue here is that Westernesse is speaking from experience of DTG's rather short release schedule of successful bugfixes to date, rather than a position of blind acceptance and naivety that you and "Kane..." are.
If this happens they have lost me, and my money too!
Thousands of customers, have supported DTG for YEARS, have spent a lot of money on this game, the DLC, and the required PC upgrades. If this turns into a poor port from x-crap or anything else, what few die-hard supporters they have will dissapear...and fast!
This isn't a game, its a simulator, and it is supported by those who are WAITING for improvements that were the entire point of this simulator in the first place. If they go off-track now, and start marketing this to console players. They have lost their minds, and will face crippling backlash.
But thats just my opinion.
Just to reassure you I have never seen/read anything anywhere that has remotely suggested that TrainSimulator is suddenly going to become a console game. I suppose it's possible that the new Fishing game (in particular) or perhaps even the new FSX may head that route. But the success of TS is built on being a computer game, and it needs the raw computing power more so than a console can currently offer. A modern PC with good independent graphics card is years ahead of what a console (even the latest ones can offer processing power-wise), and for the Simulator to work well the strong processing power of a PC is key requirement. TS does also does not lend itself very well to display on a very large monitor/TV which would again be required if they were to head down the console route. So I'm very hopeful consoles will not be considered a viable option at least in the short to medium-term.
I'm afraid I can't reassure you here with DTG's perspective on game v simulator. A couple of months ago in a thread with a newbie challenging the fact that TS was not a simulator but merely a regular game, Martin (DTG) basically agreed with the poster, that TS was basically not a real simulator but more aimed at the simple gaming market. This was despite fierce opposition from hard core simmers in our community that pointed-out that with good quality 3rd party add-ons: proper lighting effects, professional loco sound packs, pro sound announcements, 3rd party locos with quality realistic physics, and 3rd party support for devices such as TrackIR and RailDriver; that TS could very much be custom built by the owner to be a powerful simulator. But the over-ridng argument by DTG (Admin) was it was a game designed for the gaming market. Sad but true! DTG do seem to be seeing TS as a game which equals more sales and turnover, rather than the super powerful simulator it could be; as some Flight Simulators have developed over-time.
I'm not all together convinced DTG know what they would like the game to be. It's success has grown from being a niche market simulator. But there's no doubt about it DTG's marketing strategy over the last couple years (which entirely coincides with their rebranding their company as Dovetail Games, rather being known as Rail Simulator) and production of new DLC and the reworking of the core programe (to be trendy graphically colourful 'sharp' sharp, over working simulator physics/substance) has been targeting more of a 'gaming' audience; whether this will this progress to true train arcade style who knows! But from my perspective the alarm bells are most certainly ringing in this regard!!
To be fair, if the company is diversifying (and why shouldn't it grow from a niche market) then it had to rename away from trains. I also suspect that the word "simulator" isn't a great selling point and is significantly devalued, when many items on Steam with the word "simulator" in the title are arguably less of a simulator than TS is. To illustrate this, I was a bit alarmed that the description of a farming simulator last year read "For the first time ever in a farming simulator: Different seasons" - I don't know much about farming and don't intend to buy a farming simulator, but how could you have a farming "simulator" without seasons! So I can see why they would want to distance themselves from that (including ditching the old Microsoft-esque italic font that all "simulator" games adopted).
Yes PC is much stronger than current consoles, but there are quite a few Unreal Engined console titles and TS2015 is not very well optimised for getting the best out of the hardware so would struggle on the current consoles I agree, but a new version 64bit using DX11 and the UE would be quite feasible.
Both MS and Sony boxes run driving games that have real(ish) world physics (how real are TS's), plus they have to throw scenery past at high speeds where the vehicles route is less predictable as well as running AI that has to avoid and give competative racing, so I am not as convinced as you that the ever powerful PC is as much as an obstruction to a console port as you think, even worse they could code for console and port to PC......
But I was only asking if it had been mentioned as a possible future for the franchise, I hope not too.
That being said, it would certianly be a sad day for us. Most likely route design would certianlly suffer. Unless, they added some arcadish way of creating routes, vis-a-ve(y) Sim city(ish).
Most of my objections stem for the idea that this was intended(at least I thought), to improve over time, and become an awesome train Simulation/Simulator. I assumed that given time, all the crappy DLC would be worked on, and physics and opertating paramaters improved, moving towards very realistic train operation. Sadly this has not happened, but some people have made money, and we all know that is the bottom line....NOT creating the worlds best train simulator. :(
The biggest most popular farming simulator now "FarmingSimulator 2015" previously "FS2013" doesn't have seasons! That's the one; I was very shocked having actually bought the game to only then discover this crazy situation; in fact it was the killer for me playing the game, just too unrealistic. Shame becuase everything else about the game was better than "ProfessionalFarmer 2014" (which I played befor) which actually has seasons, and this one core difference makes the world of diference in terms of realism. i.e. it's completely unrealistic for me spoiling the game entirely; you just have one endless season of sunshine and rain, no weeks, months or seasons! Put seasons in and the game would hammer ProfessionalFarmer and FS2015 would completely dominate the market!!
As for DTG (as it is now), yes it for sure has every right to diversify, and branch out into other new ventures. Full agreed!. But surely it must show some loyality and responsibility to all those that have over the last 5+ years bought TS (and it's earlier incarnations) and have spent a small fortune in the process. i.e. we've helped make the company successful and able to now grow in the way it chooses. This was based on the selling the customer a Train Simulator.
But I like (thousands of us) in this niche market made the active decision to buy a train Simulator, and have spent a small fortune in the process. And now with scores of DLC purchased by me for that end I (think quite reasonably) would rather like to carry on playing on with these simulator like products for a fair duration of time. I do accept like with much software it is unrealistic for it to last for decades - that has to come a cut off time when the product is no longer further supported, but I don't know maybe say 10 years is a fair time for everyone that has made very large financial commitments buying a large proportion of the game (many DLC) and helped to grow RSC/DTG into the company it is today, where it can choose to diversify. This doesn't require signficant financial commitment by DTG to enable this, just the leaving us with a final ?TS2016 stable platform of the current version of the game, for us to simply carry on playing what we already have. No further changes to the core game software necessary.
If the new UE4 based train game goes a completely different direction, i.e. far more arcade like than simulator, I can make the decision not to buy into the new product. But I would like to think quite reasonably like lots of others, expect DTG to leave TS2015 or TS2016 (whatever the final version of the current form of the game is) is in a fit stable condition, that allows us players to carry on playing with our DLC collections for at least a few more years to come. Very much as was the case with MS FSX, which still has a huge active playing community all these years later after formal core software production ceased.
I agree with everything you said, but I just wanted to emphisize this part.
Saddly, I don't feel we have ever been given that. We have a great train game...but as far as simulation..not so much. Granted Third-party vendors have some great trains...but I know from experiance that there isn't a whole lot that can be done(withing the current game core as it is) to replicate anything close to realilistic train simulation. Don't even think about reallistic Steam operations. So I feel a bit slighted,(intentional or otherwise), by that fact that what this game started out to become, has yet to materialize and those of us who spent money from day one , KNOWING that the DLC was going to be sub-par for a while...and have kept supporting this game, are not getting what we signed up for. Leaving me feeling a bit like I've been had...and my butt feels a bit chapped as well.
Do I really need to go to THIRD-PARTY vendors for trains that act like they should?...or have SOUND?
Is the new UE4 version, going to be a "Game" too, or is it going to be a simulator...that turns into a game, because creating realistic trains is just too hard?
The die-hard supporters of this game, did so (I believe), to help (as much as they could), this company create a fantastic train Simulation. If they cop out on TS20???, or any other veriation of it, be it TS or UE4, on their inital goal of creating a proper simulation, than thay are going to walk away having milked alot of people out of A LOT of money on false pretenses. That doesn't sit well with me.
If there is some fine print somewhere that says this game was never intended to be a simulation...even though it was called that for years, then it was some VERY fine print, and still borders on the nafarious.
I hope I am wrong, really, but the latest trends and tendencies make me feel like it's going to be a game with new graphics engine and that's about it.
Considering amount of work DTG have to do to make it simulator wise as stunning as graphically, I doubt things will change. If they do change, the price would be quite high, as optimisation and simplification of the issues and problems (not simulation wise, I mean, but, rather, in the way the production and developing processes are organised) have never been characteristic of DTG.
Not to change subjects, or hijack the thread;
But, does anybody know why all the various third-party tools, and utilities, for route creation, engine tweaking, Scenario creation, ect...have NEVER been incorperated into this game? Some of this software has been around for half a dozen years, and are still relied on heavilly today. Isn't that why we supported this "project" financally all these years...buying stuff we KNEW would be subpar, because we wanted them to have OUR money to invest in these types of purchases or aquisitions?
Well if the worst comes to worst let's just pray that a certain Australian company and their new TrainSim offering comes real good! The advertising looks very good. However, is there any substance behind the game in terms of realistic physics etc.. rather than just pretty graphics? Next year will be an interesting one as they have a decent head-start over DTG with their second generation TrainSim effort. Like many I look forward to the end of February with their early release that should at least give us some idea of where they're headed!
The only reason I invest in DTG products (and, by far, this is the question I have to answer most often) is that I am pretty much sure most of them will be expanded with some high quality third party addons.
In the light of this I really miss the point DTG are trying to make when they so persistently ban any talk about third parties on the official boards.
I may need to do some research into that, as I have been away from this genre for a few years.
This leaves me with hundreds of different vendors, levels of quality, sites I can no longer find, vedors that no longer support their products, money spent joining fourms and purchasing nessasary parts, utilities that are outdated, unavaialable, numeous conflicts with the core game, conflicts between products,...ect. Not, what I was looking forward too. I had hoped that DTG would have, at some point, centralized this process. I was WAY off base on that one. :(
I'll buy it on day 1 if they let you map controls to analog "joystick" inputs. My throttle quadrant is sick of flying everywhere and wants to see what it's like to travel by train.
Well I sincerely hope it gives you that option for game control. I suspect you'll also have the benefit of a number of controlling device options including TrackIR/RailDriver/Oculus Rift.
The new game will work very well for some people. It's just for players that have invested huge energies (time and mostly money, and a lot of it!) in the current TrainSimulator format, are less likely to make the transition to the new programme. It's a horrible prospect having to spend a huge sum of money again for another TrainSim collection; starting entirely from scratch. For that reason I suspect for many long-term devoted TrainSimmers it can't (won't) be justified.