Riviera Line in the '50's, Praise and Criticism

[simonmd]

So, I upgraded to TS2016 in the sale and as I have recently done a lot on the original Riviera line including writing a couple of scenarios, I was very interested to see the difference between that and the old 1950s version.

Well first of all, lets give credit where credit is due, its a LOVELY looking route. This has obviously taken a lot of work to put together and my previous comments deriding it as no doubt being 'nothing more than the modern route with old signals' have been proved wrong. It's fascinating to explore the route and see what's changed, seeing all those little dead end branches, transformed into useful parts of the network, the one just south of the Exeter St Thomas running down to Exeter Basin looks perfect for some interesting shunting scenarios and then we have such interesting touches as whistle points actually marked on the HUD and the water trough down past Exminster for Express trains to use. Even the existing parts of the line have been nicely transformed with period signals, signs, building frontages and vehicles.

The most interesting part has been exploring the line from Paignton down to Kingswear. The track for this exists in the original modern day Riviera line but the scenery people went home once they had got down to Paignton for some reason. However, DTG have finaly made use of this and very nice it is too, with some great details and the tiny branch down to Brixham modeled as well. I have already found out that the steep climb out of Kingswear can be very challanging and so, rewarding.

The rolling stock is great too. We are si used to getting a route with just one train, however i ntheis kind of era, they couldnt really do that so have included a great assortment of stock, including three types of engine and a nice variety of passenger and goods stock. They are all nicely modeled and I have noticed the sounds seem far better than previous steam era trains I have used in the past as well.

So, overall, I would like to say Thank You and Well Done DTG, a great little package!

Wait, I said criticism as well didn't I?

Ok, this is leveled more at the creators than the actual route and it is this,

Why did you bother?

Not wishing to sound ungrateful, however this has been done at least TWICE already by other people. 'Both South Devon Banks' http://www.trainsim.com/vbts/tslib.php?searchid=5807239 and 'Glorious Devon 1960s' http://www.dpsimulation.org.uk/routes.html are fine routes and are also FREE (assuming you already own two others in the case of the last one).

So my question is this, DTG WHY did you do it when there have been so many requests over the past year for other routes? Surely, your time would have been better spent doing something new, South Wales for example?

[Scouser888]

A very eloquent and well reasoned post, but I disagree somewhat.

[Axe]

Your first link simon just sends me to a trainsim dot com page saying no search results.

Maybe we need to be logged in already?

[simonmd]

Probably, here's a link to a video published back in 2009 that shows the 'South Devon Banks' in action on the original Railworks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWCTO9LXiQQ

[simonmd]

Originally posted by Scouser888:

A very eloquent and well reasoned post, but I disagree somewhat.

What do you dissagree with, the fact the route's quite good or that DTG should have done something different instead of spending their time and effort on something that has already been done?

[Axe]

Originally posted by simonmd:

Probably, here's a link to a video published back in 2009 that shows the 'South Devon Banks' in action on the original Railworks.

Where?

[Mavadelo]

Originally posted by Axe:

Your first link simon just sends me to a trainsim dot com page saying no search results.

Maybe we need to be logged in already?

logged in gave the same result
http://www.trainsim.com/vbts/tslib.php?searchid=5809490 might work, else just type the name in search and 3 results will show

[Axe]

Originally posted by Mavadelo:

Originally posted by Axe:

Your first link simon just sends me to a trainsim dot com page saying no search results.

Maybe we need to be logged in already?

logged in gave the same result
http://www.trainsim.com/vbts/tslib.php?searchid=5809490 might work, else just type the name in search and 3 results will show

Same as before for me Mav.

[Mavadelo]

guess search results are one time only there lolaid, type name in search, download files, use rw tools to check if you have all and always read the readme :)

Praise from Simon, I can almost hear the champagne corks popping and the pats on the shoulders over at DTG

lmao

[Axe]

Originally posted by Mavadelo:

guess search results are one time only there lolaid, type name in search, download files, use rw tools to check if you have all and always read the readme :)

Praise from Simon, I can almost hear the champagne corks popping and the pats on the shoulders over at DTG

lmao

You are wicked Mav...

[Axe]

I don't even know which categories apply to train Sim as it has had different names etc.

http://s8.postimg.org/7rrviks7p/tstststst.jpg

Anyone fill me in please?

[Mavadelo]

on trainsim.com click file library in the menu bar, in the drop down click search files, in the new page type south Devon banks and hit search

[simonmd]

Originally posted by Axe:

Originally posted by simonmd:

Probably, here's a link to a video published back in 2009 that shows the 'South Devon Banks' in action on the original Railworks.

Where?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWCTO9LXiQQ

There, sorry, clicked 'post' without pasting the link.

For those that cant see the file i'm talking about in Trainsim.com,

http://s14.postimg.org/avchjvcrl/sdb.jpg

The POINT gentlemen is not where these things are, its that they EXIST, does NO ONE else agree with me that DTG have wasted alot of time and effort here? Again, it's a fine route, not perfect, i've already found a couple of major bugs while trying to create a scenario for it but on the whole, has a nice atmosphere and nice rolling stock.

The POINT is that wouldn't it be much nicer to have such effort put into a route that we DONT already have? South Wales, Ireland, extending the Riviera line down towards Plymouth even? Surely something NEW would have been a better use of their time, especially when one of the other main routes bundled with 2016 was Sherman Hill, a route that's also been out for some time.

[Axe]

Originally posted by simonmd:

Originally posted by Axe:

Where?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWCTO9LXiQQ

There, sorry, clicked 'post' without pasting the link.

For those that cant see the file i'm talking about in Trainsim.com,

http://s14.postimg.org/avchjvcrl/sdb.jpg

The POINT gentlemen is not where these things are, its that they EXIST, does NO ONE else agree with me that DTG have wasted alot of time and effort here?...

Thanks simon - as you know I am too new to TS to understand your real question and therefore cannot answer you with any knowledge or experience :-)

[simonmd]

Let me put it in simple terms. If I said to you that there was a route in Train Sim that has been done in the modern era and which has also been extended AND redone in a classic era already TWICE in the past by other enthusiasts, would you not agree that for the developers to pick that same route to get ANOTHER makeover was a waste of time and resources?

Wouldn't you, given the choice, rather have something different rather than something that now has FOUR different versions? You don't have to be a train Sim expert to answer that.

Originally posted by Mavadelo:

Praise from Simon, I can almost hear the champagne corks popping and the pats on the shoulders over at DTG

lmao

I always say "credit where credit is due". I know I bash DTG a lot but I like to think i'm FAIR. If DTG get more bashing then praise then that's their own fault and i'm genuinely delighted when the rare opportunity comes round for me to actually be pleased with something and have the chance to say so. Regardless of my bewilderment as to why they thought we needed a FOURTH version of this route, hey did do a reasonable job and for that I say, 'Well Done'.

[LeadCatcher]

Originally posted by simonmd:

Originally posted by Axe:

Where?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWCTO9LXiQQ

There, sorry, clicked 'post' without pasting the link.

For those that cant see the file i'm talking about in Trainsim.com,

http://s14.postimg.org/avchjvcrl/sdb.jpg

The POINT gentlemen is not where these things are, its that they EXIST, does NO ONE else agree with me that DTG have wasted alot of time and effort here? Again, it's a fine route, not perfect, i've already found a couple of major bugs while trying to create a scenario for it but on the whole, has a nice atmosphere and nice rolling stock.

The POINT is that wouldn't it be much nicer to have such effort put into a route that we DONT already have? South Wales, Ireland, extending the Riviera line down towards Plymouth even? Surely something NEW would have been a better use of their time, especially when one of the other main routes bundled with 2016 was Sherman Hill, a route that's also been out for some time.

No Simon, I don't agree with you - I have all three routes that you use in this thread, Glorious Devon, and South Devon -each one has it's own unique charm but I like DTG's the best. Besides there are many users of Train Sim that are unaware there exists any routes outside of Steam.

By having this route available to the "Steam only" crowd I hope will generate more interest for "period" routes. Additionally, whether you like the workshop or not - it is a great resource of quickly finding new scenarios for the route. Yes I am a premium member at UKTrainSim, active on Railworks America, several German sites so know where other sources of great scenarios are - but still find myself looking through the Workshop first. I feel there time was well spent making this route for those reasons.