Weapon upgrade/crafting rules?

[ShiveringSun]

Just noticed I can apply Volatile Hunter Sword to a Leaping Tiger Dao. But I can't apply a Frying Pan to the Dao even though the Pan only requires "melee weapon".

This makes me wonder what the rules (or weird combinations) are for applying these blueprint "skins". And also, how do the straight upgrades (King etc) fit in? Is it best to apply the upgrades before any skins, after the first or only after the final skin?

Basically, which skins can be stacked?

I'm still playing through the campaign in the slums...

[Kraft51]

DLC weapons aren't just skins, as for the Frying Pan i'm not sure what to say there. its similar with the Volkan gear set, the Combat Sword only counts towards any blueprint with a Melee only requirement, however anything that requires a sword of any kind can't be applied.

personally i Modify my weapon first to get a base Dmg, from there i apply any upgrades (ie, King, Enforcer and so on) ... i generally apply upgrades that improve stats that are lacking, tends to lean towards durability more than anything besides damage. so i end up selling a great deal of upgrades because i'm rather particular about the ones i keep.

for me anything with increases in Dmg and Durability i keep, all others i sell with the exception of purple and orange upgrades that increase Damage and Handling i use for weapons like the Baseball Bats and Military Shovels since they have very low handling out of the box.

edit: suppose i should clarify that you can only apply ONE blueprint per weapon, just in case thats what you meant by "stacking skins" ... again DLC weapons are oddities so i don't think they are categorised the same as base weapons. in some cases the blueprints actually make the DLC weapon worse, noticed this again with the Volkan set.

[ShiveringSun]

Thx for the info. And yes that's what I meant by "stacking".

It does seem it is possible to apply 2 blueprints: make a Leaping Tiger Dao, which requires a weapon, and see that you can then apply a Volatile Hunter Sword BP to that newly made Dao, greatly increasing its damage and adding the elements of Volatile, and renaming it to Volatile Hunter Sword.

Hmm.. maybe this is a special case, or maybe a bug? If so, it's a nice bug!

[StinVec]

Most normal blueprints modify an existing weapon that is used as the base and only applies elemental attachments to it. The end result is the exact same actual weapon item just with added elemental effects on it that are tied to the blueprint that added them. As the weapon (or specifically the effects on the weapon) is now tied to that blueprint, the item cannot be used again in another blueprint.

However, DLC blueprints (and maybe one or two odd ones) produce an entirely different weapon item from what is used as the base instead of applying elemental effects to the weapon. The result is that an item with an entirely different item name is produced. As the produced DLC item is freshly made, it hasn't been modified by/tied to a blueprint and is still able to be used in yet another blueprint.

So:
Generic Sword 1 > Elemental BP = Generic Sword 1 modified (same item)
Generic Sword 1 > DLC BP 1 = DLC Sword (different item)
DLC Sword > DLC BP 2 = DLC Big Axe (different item)
etc.

So using a weapon as a base weapon in a DLC blueprint causes that base item to no longer exist and an entirely different item is produced, which can then go on to be the base weapon in another blueprint.

DLC blueprints also possess an attribute on them of "InheritBaseStats", which means for the most part the produced weapon will have the stats of the base weapon which was used in its crafting, though I believe it is additive. As the produced item has configured stats of its own prior to inheriting stats from the base weapon, I think it is configured stats+base stats=final stats.

As an example it may be more like this:
1) DLC Sword internal stats = 500 dmg
2) Generic Sword 1 stats = 500 dmg (300+200 dmg from 2x King mods)
3) Putting Generic Sword 1 through the DLC BP = DLC Sword (1000 dmg)

I haven't done any real testing on this, but I think others have and have worked out how to maximize the damage/durability and other stats. So depending on the stats of the base weapons used in the blueprints, which weapon upgrades are slotted in them prior to crafting, and which sequence of blueprints that each produced item is then run through after slotting new upgrades each time, the end weapon could be made to be as powerful/durable as it possibly can be based on what is available in the game at the time.


EDIT:
Regarding the Frying Pan and the Leaping Tiger Dao sword

The Frying Pan blueprint can use any weapon as a base whose internal item name begins with "Melee_".

The Leaping Tiger Dao sword's internal item name is "Melee_ShortSword_Dao_SHU" so it qualifies to be a base weapon in the crafting of the Frying Pan blueprint.

If the Dao you're attempting to use is not listed as a viable base weapon when trying to choose a weapon to use for the blueprint:
- the Dao may have already been used in a generic elemental-adding blueprint and cannot be used in any more blueprints
-or perhaps the Dao is still equipped in a primary weapon slot (I believe only weapons unequipped into the inventory get listed in the blueprint screen's item selection list to craft and not those that are currently equipped, might be wrong on that but something to check)

[ShiveringSun]

Originally posted by StinVec:

Most normal blueprints modify an existing weapon that is used as the base and only applies elemental attachments to it. The end result is the exact same actual weapon item just with added elemental effects on it that are tied to the blueprint that added them. As the weapon (or specifically the effects on the weapon) is now tied to that blueprint, the item cannot be used again in another blueprint.

However, DLC blueprints (and maybe one or two odd ones) produce an entirely different weapon item from what is used as the base instead of applying elemental effects to the weapon. The result is that an item with an entirely different item name is produced. As the produced DLC item is freshly made, it hasn't been modified by/tied to a blueprint and is still able to be used in yet another blueprint.

So:
Generic Sword 1 > Elemental BP = Generic Sword 1 modified (same item)
Generic Sword 1 > DLC BP 1 = DLC Sword (different item)
DLC Sword > DLC BP 2 = DLC Big Axe (different item)
etc.

So using a weapon as a base weapon in a DLC blueprint causes that base item to no longer exist and an entirely different item is produced, which can then go on to be the base weapon in another blueprint.

DLC blueprints also possess an attribute on them of "InheritBaseStats", which means for the most part the produced weapon will have the stats of the base weapon which was used in its crafting, though I believe it is additive. As the produced item has configured stats of its own prior to inheriting stats from the base weapon, I think it is configured stats+base stats=final stats.

As an example it may be more like this:
1) DLC Sword internal stats = 500 dmg
2) Generic Sword 1 stats = 500 dmg (300+200 dmg from 2x King mods)
3) Putting Generic Sword 1 through the DLC BP = DLC Sword (1000 dmg)

I haven't done any real testing on this, but I think others have and have worked out how to maximize the damage/durability and other stats. So depending on the stats of the base weapons used in the blueprints, which weapon upgrades are slotted in them prior to crafting, and which sequence of blueprints that each produced item is then run through after slotting new upgrades each time, the end weapon could be made to be as powerful/durable as it possibly can be based on what is available in the game at the time.

Interesting. I just tried crafting a Volatile Hunter Sword from a base weapon to see if I could then apply Leaping Tiger Dao to it. Nope. I wonder if the Dao can be overwritten because it has no elemental effect? I also tried placing a Fencer upgrade on a Dao before applying the Volatile and the effect was lost.

BTW, your mods are really cool! I'm using a couple and thinking of adding the one that multiplies the power of any weapon so I don't get boxed in with using Volatile BP's all the time. It seems they offer by far the biggest damage increase, at least at this point in the game. TY :)

[Poppi !!]

Basic rule; always craft the weapon first, then apply the mods 👍🏻