What does "cookie cutter build" mean?

[Jemne Perlivá]

^

[Barry Baloney]

A build so easy to play that no skills are required.

[Gralzeim]

No, it means it's a common build, hence the term (like if you have a cookie cutter and cut a bunch of cookies with it they'll all be more or less the same).

[Energist]

It's a build that is generally known to the community to be effective and well used.

Personally, I recommend against following any of those builds if you're a new player for the following reasons:

1) many of the "popular" builds are based on fad set ups that are likely exploitative in nature

2) they often expect/lead to unrealistic gear requirements that are driven more by greed and less by enjoyable gaming

3) if the build is generally exploitative, it will nullify all sense of challenge and reward from playing the intended way.

4) Often leads to or follows from a Min/Max philosophy which I think is extremely destructive to gaming overall because it replaces creativity and enjoyment with obsession over optimization.

5) A good part of the game is making builds. Letting someone do that for you will remove a very rich and rewarding character development system from you.


Make a character that you want to play. Build it around your own concept, and you will enjoy the game far more.

[jpem]

Originally posted by Energist:

4) Often leads to or follows from a Min/Max philosophy which I think is extremely destructive to gaming overall because it replaces creativity and enjoyment with obsession over optimization.

So true. Min/Maxing seems to just rip the soul out of games and their communities.

[Lagwin1980]

It's the type of thing vegetables build to, takes no effort on their part as someone else done the work, it's chosen because it is borderline OP/totaly OP because those people don't like putting any effort into the game.

Make one character cookie cutter, use it to farm currency and gear and make alts and start experementing.

[Jemne Perlivá]

Originally posted by Energist:

It's a build that is generally known to the community to be effective and well used.

Personally, I recommend against following any of those builds if you're a new player for the following reasons:

1) many of the "popular" builds are based on fad set ups that are likely exploitative in nature

2) they often expect/lead to unrealistic gear requirements that are driven more by greed and less by enjoyable gaming

3) if the build is generally exploitative, it will nullify all sense of challenge and reward from playing the intended way.

4) Often leads to or follows from a Min/Max philosophy which I think is extremely destructive to gaming overall because it replaces creativity and enjoyment with obsession over optimization.

5) A good part of the game is making builds. Letting someone do that for you will remove a very rich and rewarding character development system from you.


Make a character that you want to play. Build it around your own concept, and you will enjoy the game far more.

Thank you for your explanation of both the terminology and issues with the builds in question. The points you made are thought provoking and make perfect sense. Thank you to everyone else too. :)

[jamesc70]

1. Make a character anyway you want and go as far as you can.

2. Use a cookie cutter build to try out a certain build that sounds interesting to you for a second character.

3. Profit.

This is basically the progression I followed. When you are new to the game, the skill tree can be daunting. Making a character without looking up a build, and then making a common build, helped me to understand the core mechanics better, and how to create a build from scratch.

I highly disagree with Energist that most builds 'are based on exploits'. That is just not true. Some of the most popular builds like EK, summoner, or dual totems can be really powerful, but they are not exploiting anything; they are simply well thought out and end up being powerful from creative design.

[Striderxdj]

I dont see how going cookie cutter detracts from gameplay, point in fact when I looked at some builds online they were very similar to the one I had started. this isn't WoW where you only have 3 viable builds or you're just gimping yourself completely, there are many different routes you can go that may bump up your dps but cut back on your defense, or vice versa... playstyles can change the necessity and efficiency of your build. The game doesn't suck because a lot of people choose the same builds, that's just a sign that people all have the same idea about what talents are good.

That being said, I don't get why people think you should play through the game and ruin a char (or several) before going with something more streamlined and tested.. I'd consider spending 50-100+ hours on one char that ended up useless at endgame content infuriating and a complete waste of time.

[Energist]

Originally posted by Ulfric the Handsome European:

Originally posted by Energist:

It's a build that is generally known to the community to be effective and well used.

Personally, I recommend against following any of those builds if you're a new player for the following reasons:

1) many of the "popular" builds are based on fad set ups that are likely exploitative in nature

2) they often expect/lead to unrealistic gear requirements that are driven more by greed and less by enjoyable gaming

3) if the build is generally exploitative, it will nullify all sense of challenge and reward from playing the intended way.

4) Often leads to or follows from a Min/Max philosophy which I think is extremely destructive to gaming overall because it replaces creativity and enjoyment with obsession over optimization.

5) A good part of the game is making builds. Letting someone do that for you will remove a very rich and rewarding character development system from you.


Make a character that you want to play. Build it around your own concept, and you will enjoy the game far more.

Thank you for your explanation of both the terminology and issues with the builds in question. The points you made are thought provoking and make perfect sense. Thank you to everyone else too. :)

You're very welcome. Gaming should be about fun not serious business. I hope that information helps you. Feel free to pm me on steam for more info on PoE if you'd like.

[Xtorma]

Originally posted by jpem:

Originally posted by Energist:

4) Often leads to or follows from a Min/Max philosophy which I think is extremely destructive to gaming overall because it replaces creativity and enjoyment with obsession over optimization.

So true. Min/Maxing seems to just rip the soul out of games and their communities.

If the developers did not want this to happen, they would not make respeccing so expensive. There is noting more disheartening than to male it to merciless on your first character , only to find out your build is not good enough, and you have just wasted all the time you spent leveling the last two difficulties.

I killed dominus with no deaths and no problem to advance to merciless, and some exile guy just one shots me in the mud flats. So now I have to either farm up enough money to redo my spec, ( with the prices ive seen we are taking weeks if not longer here) or start over.

If you want viable, variety in builds , then don't make the game so hard, that it forces people to use what is proven to work. This is EXACTLY how the game is designed.

[Energist]

Originally posted by Xtorma:

Originally posted by jpem:

So true. Min/Maxing seems to just rip the soul out of games and their communities.

If the developers did not want this to happen, they would not make respeccing so expensive. There is noting more disheartening than to male it to merciless on your first character , only to find out your build is not good enough, and you have just wasted all the time you spent leveling the last two difficulties.

I killed dominus with no deaths and no problem to advance to merciless, and some exile guy just one shots me in the mud flats. So now I have to either farm up enough money to redo my spec, ( with the prices ive seen we are taking weeks if not longer here) or start over.

If you want viable, variety in builds , then don't make the game so hard, that it forces people to use what is proven to work. This is EXACTLY how the game is designed.

Merciless is supposed to be hard. Normal isn't hard at all and cruel is quite managable. If Merciless were so easy that all specs could do it then what's the point? That's what Normal is for. The OP is no doubt bombarded with people saying what to do and how to do it, but what fun is that? Is "endgame" the only goal? What happend to having fun and getting as far as you can with what you have?

The whole mentality about everything or nothing is a result of the entitlement problem the internet has helped foster within people. No amount of good is ever enough because there is always an optimal route that leads to better performance and everyone knows it is there. They want it because they don't have it, and they know it exists.

If people played PoE without looking up anything in a forum or a wiki, they would not think in such a way. They would not be chasing some phantom build or item or anything. They would simply play and have fun. Before the internet, that's how it worked. That's when gaming was about fun. The internet has really changed everything and everyone. In some ways it's good, but in others it's bad. It's been years since I've seen a game appreciated for what it was rather than what it should/could/would be if x,y,z where done. Games today are beaten before they're played. The bosses are known, the story is given away, the expectations are literally omniscient. What's left after all of that is just constant let down. It's downright unnatural IMO.

[Warlord]

Originally posted by Ulfric the Handsome European:

^

Since you don't live on planet earth I'll describe what a "cookie cutter" is.

It's a predefined template used in making identical cookies out of dough each time.

Do you get it now?

[Jemne Perlivá]

Thanks again for the various perspectives and mature/respectful discussion everyone (with the obvious exception of Warlord). I will likely take you up on your offer very soon thanks Energist. =)

[Warlord]

Originally posted by Ulfric the Handsome European:

Thanks again for the various perspectives and mature/respectful discussion everyone (with the obvious exception of Warlord). I will likely take you up on your offer very soon thanks Energist. =)

MY answer is the most legit unbiased in the thread.

Go pound sand, Troll.

[Sealsploot]

Simple builds rule, Ice Witch ftw.