How overcharge support works

[76561198411658231]

Let's assume that my melee weapon deals 1000 damage. After 4 hits I inflict 4000 damage. Now I have overcharge support gem which reduces damage by 25% but also applies shock to enemy as though dealing 500 more damage (with 50% probability). So 2 unaffected by shock hits deal reduced 1500 damage, while the rest hits deal increased 7500 damage. Eventually I got 9000 damage instead of 4000. Did I understand correctly how it works?

[Cr@zY-$HeeP]

To understand Overcharge Support, you need to understand how Shock works in-game.

https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Shock

Basically, Overcharge Support is *lowering the threshold* required to apply larger amounts of Shock to enemies. It does this by causing supported Skills to apply Shock to enemies "as though dealing 500% more damage".

Also, to clarify, Shock is not a guaranteed 50% increase in damage to a target, nor is it a per-hit effect. Rather, you are *applying* a percentage of Shock to an enemy (up to 50%), and the Shock status may linger on the enemy for a certain amount of time (base duration is 2 seconds). This means multiple hits within that 2 second window can apply damage at the increased rate.

I'm fairly confident that Overcharge Support requires being linked to a Skill Gem that applies Lightning Damage. Otherwise, no Shock will be applied, considering 500% of 0 is still 0.

[Tenzek]

Not lightning damage necessarily, but any damage that can apply shock. For example, if you had Starforge as your weapon, then your physical damage can shock and will work with overcharge support.

[76561198411658231]

But as I understood from poewiki shock increases damage from all sources, and some effects and modifiers can inflict shock without dealing damage

[The_Driver]

The gem doesn't force your chance to shock to be 50%. That would be a different wording (something like "chance to shock is 50%"). You can use other sources to get the chance to shock to 100% (or even higher) with this, so that you could shock with something linked to this on the first hit in cases where enemies have no reduced chance to be shocked, granted the type of damage can shock (by default lightning damage) and the shock effect is high enough (>= 5% inc dmg taken).

Basically, Overdrive is a support skill to support a setup that inflicts shocks. It's not really ideal to use in your main skill. You could use it on Orb of Storms and then reap the benefits (hopefully potent shock on enemy) with your main skill.

"Supported Skills deal 25% less Damage" is a significant drawback, 0.75*1.5 (for default-max best case) is still only 1.125, so 12.5% higher damage, and if you had shocks before, this is lower in practice as well. And other increases of "damage taken" reduce the effectiveness as well. A (damage number oriented) support gem that doesn't grant you 30% more damage isn't usually worth it.

[Noobgtx980]

pairing this with absolution is nice . You can go balls out on more links but frankly at casual level even 3 links abso overcharge then either spell echo or penetreation etc is a good extra dps for the rest of the team and thyself :D
edit. they get more sexy with more crit chance it seems.

[Cr@zY-$HeeP]

Originally posted by 76561198411658231:

But as I understood from poewiki shock increases damage from all sources, and some effects and modifiers can inflict shock without dealing damage

You are correct - Shock is a Status Effect that increases damage from all sources. You are also correct that some Skills can inflict Shock without dealing damage. However, your original example in your first post is an incorrect interpretation of how Shock works, and your calculations are not entirely correct either.

I'm bored at the moment, so please excuse me while I write a book about applying Shock to enemies - At least, how I understand it, based on the Wiki.

Consider the following -

You are about to hit an enemy that has 10,000HP. You are hitting them for 1,000 damage, with a Skill that has a 100% Chance to apply Shock.

First, we need to know the enemy's "Ailment Threshold".

According to the Wiki, every enemy in the game (with the exception of Pinnacle Bosses) calculates its Ailment Threshold as being *equal* to its Maximum Life. Therefore, we can assume that the Ailment Threshold for this enemy is 10,000, because it has 10,000HP.

A quick look at the formula, assuming a 1,000 damage hit, without increases to Shock Effect -
E = 1/2 * (1000/10,000)^0.4 * (1 + 0)
E = 0.199

I'm not entirely sure about this next part, so maybe someone with a better understanding can feel free to comment -

The minimum amount of Shock is 5%, and the maximum amount is 50%. Shock is rounded down (in the enemy's favor), so in this case, we are just shy of inflicting 20% Shock. Therefore, we consider the first hit to apply only a 15% Shock (rounding 19.9% down to the nearest 5% leaves us with 15%).

Finally, Shock effects do not stack. Only the highest value of Shock applied is considered valid, and subsequent Shocks (if they are lower) will not overwrite that highest value until it naturally expires.

All that being said, we can look at how damage would be calculated in this scenario (again, we are assuming 100% Chance to Shock) -

WITHOUT OVERCHARGE SUPPORT

1. You hit an enemy for 1000 damage
   
2. Shock gets calculated: 0.199 = 1/2 * (1000/10,000)^0.4 * (1 + 0)
   
3. The enemy now has 15% Shock (19.9% rounded down to 15%)
   
4. You hit them again for 1000 damage
   
5. 150 damage gets added, due to Shock. Total damage is 1150
   
6. Shock gets calculated: 0.210 = 1/2 * (1150/10,000)^0.4 * (1 + 0)
   
7. The enemy now has 20% Shock (21.0% rounded down to 20%)
   
8. You hit them again for 1000 damage
   
9. 200 damage gets added, due to Shock. Total damage is 1200
   
10. Shock gets calculated: 0.214 = 1/2 * (1200/10,000)^0.4 * (1 + 0)
    
11. The enemy still has 20% Shock (21.4% rounded down to 20%)
    
12. You hit them one last time for 1000 damage
    
13. 200 damage gets added, due to Shock. Total damage is 1200

TOTAL DAMAGE: 1000 + 1150 + 1200 + 1200 = 4550

WITH OVERCHARGE SUPPORT (500% increase to Shock damage)

1. You hit an enemy for 1000 damage, minus 250 from Overcharge Support = 750
   
2. Shock damage is considered to have a 500% increase, so: 750 * 5 = 3750
   
3. Shock gets calculated: 0.337 = 1/2 * (3750/10,000)^0.4 * (1 + 0)
   
4. The enemy now has 30% Shock (33.7% rounded down 30%)
   
5. You hit an enemy for 1000 damage, minus 250 from Overcharge Support = 750
   
6. 225 damage gets added, due to Shock. Total damage is 975
   
7. Shock damage is considered to have a 500% increase, so: 975 * 5 = 4875
   
8. Shock gets calculated: 0.375 = 1/2 * (4875/10,000)^0.4 * (1 + 0)
   
9. The enemy has 35% Shock (37.5% rounded down to 35%)
   
10. You hit them again for 1000 damage, minus 250 from Overcharge Support = 750
    
11. 263 damage gets added, due to Shock. Total damage is 1013
    
12. Shock damage is considered to have a 500% increase, so: 1013 * 5 = 5065
    
13. Shock gets calculated: 0.380 = 1/2 * (5065/10,000)^0.4 * (1 + 0)
    
14. The enemy still has 35% Shock (38% rounded down to 35%)
    
15. You hit them one last time for 1000 damage, minus 250 from Overcharge Support = 750
    
16. 263 damage gets added, due to Shock. Total damage is 1013

TOTAL DAMAGE: 750 + 975 + 1013 + 1013 = 3751

So, there you have it - This is a prime example of why you *would not* want to socket Overcharge Support in your main Skill Gem setup. It's exactly as The_Driver specified -

Originally posted by The_Driver:

Basically, Overdrive is a support skill to support a setup that inflicts shocks. It's not really ideal to use in your main skill. You could use it on Orb of Storms and then reap the benefits (hopefully potent shock on enemy) with your main skill.

"Supported Skills deal 25% less Damage" is a significant drawback, 0.75*1.5 (for default-max best case) is still only 1.125, so 12.5% higher damage, and if you had shocks before, this is lower in practice as well. And other increases of "damage taken" reduce the effectiveness as well. A (damage number oriented) support gem that doesn't grant you 30% more damage isn't usually worth it.