What is the point? End game feels impossible.

[ahoboman]

Hi, I am fairly new. Well I played way back in late 2013 of Dec to early 2014 Feb. I dropped it since then but now I have returned since the Diablo failed. Upon my return, I was basically a noob. I had a buddy who helped me get back into this game and we grind my characters all the way pass the stories. But now he says once I get here, I am on my own. So he left me with parting advices and tips. For these things called map, were end game contents.

I have only reached up pass T5 maps and now heading into T6's. That is still very early in tier maps as far as I was informed by my mates. I am well aware. I capped out my elemental resist like I was advised to. Invested in past 5k survivability. I have roughly 3800 Health and 1200 ES on my assassin, and roughly 4000 Health and 1000 ES on my Necromancer. I do decent damage and clear the mop maps consistently. I can take on these early bosses and do fine. I invested in good flask such as remove bleeding, poison or any elemental blight that I might come across, and always have them on stand by in my inventory should I need them. I think of every possible scenario and prep for it just in case. Did everything as I was told to by my experienced mates.

But now then all of the sudden, I run into a group of units that would one shot me. Like literally obliterate me in one to two seconds flat. I don't even have time to react and know what the hell just happen. My mate said it was probably a mod that I had on my map that killed me? Such things as reflected damage, crit multipliers, elemental pen, etc. And he says every once in awhile you come across a rare or unique enemies that will one shot if you don't try to dodge them. He especially warn me about syndicate members and man he was not lying. Last night I ran across this Janus dude. There was literally nothing I can do. He obliterate all my minions and just one shot me. My other character I run as an assassin just melts in second.

At this point I am starting to feel like this game is putting me off. What am I even suppose to do? These enemies are stronger then the bosses themselves on the very same map? A lot my death feels really cheap. Like I should of dodge that, or that should have not killed me. Or why did that even do that much damage or why wont this thing die? I even took my buddy advice and wordship the Brine King or whatever so I won't get stun lock to death, but I still manage to die? If its not stun, its probably reflected damage. If its not that, then the mob probably hitting like truck because of extra crit. It just ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ man. It is so frustrating! I invested so much into this game. I even buy skins and cosmetic. But I just want to give up right now.

It feels like everything is impossible deal with. Something just keeps getting add on top of something else. And if I don't have protection for that, I will die. How is that even fair or balance? Like why are these minions stronger then the actual boss? It makes no sense! Why is one shot even a thing? I mean sure if it is a boss I get it but come on one mobs? Why am I force to have my tree so heavily invested into health and defense that I it gets so dull and boring. My mate says that if I don't build some what into meta, I won't make it far. Ugh this is even more off putting! Should I just give up? Because my cyclone assassin isn't doing so well, and my necromancer skeleton mages is on her their last limp.

[Mindtroverted]

Messaggio originale di ahoboman:

Yet, there is barely any skills that utilize daggers.

Blade Flurry, Cyclone, Dominating Blow, Double Strike, Dual Strike, Elemental Hit, Flicker Strike, Frenzy, Frost Blades, Lightning Strike, Molten Strike, Puncture, Reave, Reckoning, Riposte, Shield Charge, Static Strike, Vengeance, Vigilant Strike, Viper Strike, Whirling Blades, Wild Strike. All these skills can be used with daggers. If you're referring to skills that actually do an animation with daggers then it's still most of these since most of these work by doing a basic attack with an added effect of some sort. I don't understand what you mean by saying "barely any".

[TemjinGold]

Messaggio originale di ahoboman:

TemjinGold

Meta means the "Most Effective" during or at the moment. Sure if I suck at the game then I will lose no matter what. The problem isn't because I suck, it is because the game is so off putting. It doesn't matter what I build, if I have below 3000 in health or ES combine or not, I won't make it far. No matter how much dodge and evasion, crowd control stun, blind or aliment, or damage I have, their will come a point where their mobs or a boss by pass that period! We both know it is mandatory and meta to have a high pool of health. Now investing in health and defense is one thing but isn't even why the game feels like it does't matter in the end.

It is because I cant build remotely close to the way i would to, literally and figuratively! I am not saying the game prevents me from having all damage nodes or go the path I want to. It is because I am force to play the assassin in a way that doesn't feels like an assassin. I carry daggers but guess what? I don't even use them because I am throwing magical knives or trap instead! I am shooting fireballs out of my bare and casting ice wave by screaming the in air! How the ♥♥♥♥ is this even an assassin? I look more like a mage.

So I might as well go a two handed spinning cyclone Assassin because clearly they want me to build a mage assassin or some ♥♥♥♥. Well guess what? Nah you can't have a spinning cyclone because with that is not the way we want assassin to be and you die in end game content? News flash assassin don't be shooting fire balls and ♥♥♥♥ okay. They are suppose to be using weaponry and doing sneaking stuff. Not the ice hiyah thing okay? I mean the trhowing traps and knives are cool but again nothing to do with the actual hand weopon!

Go read some build guides. There are PLENTY of effective ways to build the character you are describing.

If you are lamenting that no amount of skill can make below 3000 HP work in this game, check out this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLCkEb5ZFLs

[+|A.O|+]

Messaggio originale di ahoboman:

[MNI] +|A.O|+

That is the problem. The game forces you to play too much in a particular fashion.

Ooh boi.. You are in for some surprises..

I use Frost blades with double daggers to get the range.. And that is really neat!
One can also use Blade Flurry or reave to get range..

Else you can also use the blind aura (Flesh and Stone: Sand stance) to keep yourself safe as you jump into packs and use a slow aura (Temporal chains) to prevent mobs to attack you before you clean them up in 1-2 hits.

Every character has an inherent style. Yes Path of Exile is about creating your own path. But you would want to respect the inherent benefits of the character since not everybody has a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ of in-game currency and OP items to transform any character to any style.

I'm not discrediting the true gameplay motto though, I'm just saying it is better/easier to make use of inherent abilities of a character to make it crazy powerful rather than fighting against the game.


Also, since you mentioned cyclone, I automatically know that you are not aware of potent gems and combinations. You might wanna read up on damage multipliers and skill types to really get a feel for what you lack and might need.

[ahoboman]

Mindtroverted

Again you are not understanding. First of skills like Lighting Strikes, Molten Strike or Frost Blade isn't exactly using the the dagger themselves. The dude is literally firing some projectile magically from out of thin air, his hands or body that makes no sense with the daggers. Only skills like cyclone and Viper Strikes sort of counts because it is the actual hit from the daggers that and not the special projectile effect that comes out of no where. All other skills that the dagger uses isn't the the daggers themselves. It is the magical or elemental part does the actual damage now.

And again it does not really make sense makes for a dagger to be firing projectile okay. I can understand a mace or hammer causing a shock wave when slamming the ground or a sword firing a sonic wave due to sheer sizes between a dagger, but a dagger shooting ices, fireball and lighting? Okay its just not fitting for an assassin class my man. It make no sense! Unless its magical then okay but not every dagger should magical like that. That is just dumb! Where are the back stabs? Where are the sneaky stuff like telporting attacking beside flicker strike?

Speaking of flicker strike, the only skills that looks assassin worthy, requires too much investment to build for assassin with daggers. You need frenzy charges! And the only two ways generate frenzy effective as far as I am aware, is to use Terminus Est with a crit build, or Oro's Sacrifices with an Ignite build. Both are great swords! How am I even suppose to feel like an assassin? You see what I mean when this game is just stupid limit! I don't feel like an assassin at all! I feel some magical caster, or a dagger wielding mage warrior or something? But not a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ assassin. Far far from it! It is just so dumb and off putting!

[ahoboman]

[MNI] +|A.O|+

Again you are not understanding where I am coming from. I am playing the assassin class and yet I do not feel like an assassin all. That is probably the most off putting and frustrating part about this game for me. There isn't a single skill in the game that makes me feel assassin worthy except maybe some of the traps but they get way magical for me that it feels almost as if I am an alchemist or bard instead, or the range throwing stuff like the knives and spectral throws but I am really not here play range assassin. Everything else feels like I am a up front melee class like warriors, knights or brutes, or an magical caster of some sort like mages, mage hybrid or gadget masters.

The only skill that makes me truly feels like an assassin is flicker strike. But we both know it is impossible to build an effective flicker strike build with daggers and without frenzy charges. And guess what/ The only two effective way to generate frenzy is to use Terminus Est or Oro's Sacrifices, both are greatswords with a specific build. This in itself already frustrating and now I am force to play not feeling like assassin even more because I am not allow spin or bounce around the map effectively as a assassin class, using assassin looking melee moves like cyclone or flicker strike. I am force to invest so much more into defense and stuff that I longer feel like an assassin.

[Mindtroverted]

Well, wait a few more days and try out some of the new gems that are coming and are specifically meant to be used by assassins. I think you might like Cobra Lash and Pestilent Strike especially. As far as sneakyness is concerned, you could try using Smoke Bomb, items and flasks that give you Phasing, etc. This isn't a stealth game and it's very hard to see how a lone assassin could slay legions and legions of monsters with just two short daggers. Are you saying that it would be more natural for you to be able to backstab AN ARMY?
Cobra Lash might be interesting to you although it is a projectile attack because the skill throws out copies of your weapon and Pestilent Strike is literally an attack with your weapons with an added effect. It's pretty similar to Viper Strike, but more suited for pack clearing. I think a build with VIper strike vs bosses and Pestilent Strike for packs would work just fine and you won't get any more assassin-y than that.

[Singrave]

gam impossibru!!11

[ahoboman]

TemjinGold

Again you seem missing the point in what I am talking about. The way the shadow assassin tree is set up, is impossible to build a effective true melee assassin looking character. Skills like blade furry or frost blade do not count because they magical in nature and to me are considered range attack. I mean the dude fires ices blades and ethereal blade from his bare hands? If that is not magical and then a fireball might as be consider a melee skill. Look all I am saying is that I want to look and feel like an true physical dagger using melee assassin. And the only skills that will make me look like that is Cyclone, Viper Strike, and Flicker Strike.

I can't play Assassin dagger cyclone because I won't get the range and consistence damage. I might as go Slayer or Berserker instead. Slayer getting range and damage while Berserker gets the damage and crit while near the attack range nodes. I can't play Assassin dagger flicker strikes because the only way to generate frenzy charge effectively is with Terminus Est or Oro's Sacrifices! Both are great swords. The only skill left is viper strike. And this skill isn't exactly exciting okay. I mean I might respec my character and go Viper Strike at the moment because it is the only skill left that looks and feels like and assassin given its poison by default.

[ahoboman]

Mindtroverted

Now were discussing. Thank you for understanding. Yeah I saw the new stuff. I do like some of of it. Very assassin looking. Especially the Cobra Lash and the new poison dash looking move. I am not a big fan of the range stuff because I want more of an melee assassin. But it does look good for an range assassin. My buddy told me that it is the first time they shown love for assassin classes in a long time. Guess I came back at the right time back to POE.

As from as back stabbing goes, I think Grinding Gear Games can come with some good ideas. There is AOE right. Why not create a skill where the character is require to use only a dagger or claw, short weapons by ways, instantly teleport behind an target and does X amount of damage and spread X amount of of converted chaos damage to near by enemies. Or maybe instead of chaos damage, when teleport behind a target, strike target X amount of times per power charges consuming the charges.

How about dash and slash, dash in a arch, kinda like a C shape slashing all enemies along way dealing physical damage. Cast speed is on attack speed. This way the character is mobile while doing some area melee damage that isn't magical, ground pound or flying ethereal weapons. Or maybe something more simple? Thousand needles. Just straight up start stabbing in front in a cone rapidly. Kind of like a short range version of Barrage.

All these skill can be supported with melee splash, ancestral call or mutilstrike etc.

[Brian9824]

Messaggio originale di ahoboman:

TemjinGold

Again you seem missing the point in what I am talking about. The way the shadow assassin tree is set up, is impossible to build a effective true melee assassin looking character. Skills like blade furry or frost blade do not count because they magical in nature and to me are considered range attack. I mean the dude fires ices blades and ethereal blade from his bare hands? If that is not magical and then a fireball might as be consider a melee skill. Look all I am saying is that I want to look and feel like an true physical dagger using melee assassin. And the only skills that will make me look like that is Cyclone, Viper Strike, and Flicker Strike.

I can't play Assassin dagger cyclone because I won't get the range and consistence damage. I might as go Slayer or Berserker instead. Slayer getting range and damage while Berserker gets the damage and crit while near the attack range nodes. I can't play Assassin dagger flicker strikes because the only way to generate frenzy charge effectively is with Terminus Est or Oro's Sacrifices! Both are great swords. The only skill left is viper strike. And this skill isn't exactly exciting okay. I mean I might respec my character and go Viper Strike at the moment because it is the only skill left that looks and feels like and assassin given its poison by default.

You wanting to make a thematic charachter doesn't mean the game is limited, it just means your limiting yourself. Some skills work better with others, if you chose to ignore those for a theme you are making things harder for the sake of cosmetics. That being said your lack of knowledge is extensive. There are SOOOO many ways to generate frenzy charges.

1. Use blood rage gem - its a great melee buff
2. Use frenzy
3. Use poachers mark debuff
4. Use green gem or green nightmare jewel
5. Use blood dance boots
6. Use Doedre Elixer flask
7. Use one of dozens of other items that can grant frenzy charges
8. Corrupting a dagger for instance can grant you (9-11)% chance to gain a Frenzy Charge on Kill
9. Shaper/Elder items can grant frezny charges
10. Keystones can grant frenzy aka Brutal Blade, Disciple of the Slaughter, Swagger, etc

There are sooo many ways to do it

[+|A.O|+]

As an assassin.. There must be some item in game that gives you frenzy charge on hit rather than on kill. Else you can't really go end-game with that.

Something like %chance to gain frenzy charge on crit/hit or on poison or something

I like the idea of flicker strike too, I've not found a way to do it on assassin yet. Also, since the assassin gains a heapload of power charges, I wonder if flicker can instead use power charges or if there's a mod somewhere that says %age chance to gain a flicker charge when you gain a power charge (or plain - gain a frenzy charge when you gain a power charge when <some negative thing>)

as for other pure melee, I wonder if viper strike will go crazy with melee splash + ancestral call (end-game links). I tried it with melee splash, but it was bad back in 3.5.0. After Legion, it should get better.

[Brian9824]

Messaggio originale di MNI +|A.O|+:

As an assassin.. There must be some item in game that gives you frenzy charge on hit rather than on kill. Else you can't really go end-game with that.

Something like %chance to gain frenzy charge on crit/hit or on poison or something

I like the idea of flicker strike too, I've not found a way to do it on assassin yet. Also, since the assassin gains a heapload of power charges, I wonder if flicker can instead use power charges or if there's a mod somewhere that says %age chance to gain a flicker charge when you gain a power charge (or plain - gain a frenzy charge when you gain a power charge when <some negative thing>)

as for other pure melee, I wonder if viper strike will go crazy with melee splash + ancestral call (end-game links). I tried it with melee splash, but it was bad back in 3.5.0. After Legion, it should get better.

Doedre Elixer flask
Frenzy Skill gem

I mean use the damn frenzy skill gem and build up all the charges you need. Many people will socket it in an off hand weapon w/ faster attack support, switch weapons, generate frenzy charges on boss as needed and quickswap back if they don't have space for it in their build.

Most frenzy generation is on kill which is fine, you can use stuff like the flask or skill gem to maintain it on a boss for instance. On maps you will be killing more then fast enough to maintain full frenzy charges.

No issue at all with frenzy end game.

[TemjinGold]

Messaggio originale di ahoboman:

Mindtroverted

Again you are not understanding. First of skills like Lighting Strikes, Molten Strike or Frost Blade isn't exactly using the the dagger themselves. The dude is literally firing some projectile magically from out of thin air, his hands or body that makes no sense with the daggers. Only skills like cyclone and Viper Strikes sort of counts because it is the actual hit from the daggers that and not the special projectile effect that comes out of no where. All other skills that the dagger uses isn't the the daggers themselves. It is the magical or elemental part does the actual damage now.

And again it does not really make sense makes for a dagger to be firing projectile okay. I can understand a mace or hammer causing a shock wave when slamming the ground or a sword firing a sonic wave due to sheer sizes between a dagger, but a dagger shooting ices, fireball and lighting? Okay its just not fitting for an assassin class my man. It make no sense! Unless its magical then okay but not every dagger should magical like that. That is just dumb! Where are the back stabs? Where are the sneaky stuff like telporting attacking beside flicker strike?

Speaking of flicker strike, the only skills that looks assassin worthy, requires too much investment to build for assassin with daggers. You need frenzy charges! And the only two ways generate frenzy effective as far as I am aware, is to use Terminus Est with a crit build, or Oro's Sacrifices with an Ignite build. Both are great swords! How am I even suppose to feel like an assassin? You see what I mean when this game is just stupid limit! I don't feel like an assassin at all! I feel some magical caster, or a dagger wielding mage warrior or something? But not a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ assassin. Far far from it! It is just so dumb and off putting!

Did you even read my post? I made no mention of any of this.

If you are looking for backstabs and sneaking around, you are playing the wrong game. No ARPGs have this kind of assassin because this kind of playstyle suits killing things 1 on 1. This game has you killing hordes. If they built in a backstab and sneaking around no one would play it because it would be horribly ineffective in this type of game.

[+|A.O|+]

TemjinGold

Hey, you don't get to decide how one should play an RPG. It's an RPG dude, one is always free to play in the way they want!

[Brian9824]

Messaggio originale di MNI +|A.O|+:

TemjinGold

Hey, you don't get to decide how one should play an RPG. It's an RPG dude, one is always free to play in the way they want!

Path of Exile is an online Action RPG

From store page.

An Action RPG is not an RPG. ARPG's are not built for the playstyle your describing. It's build to clear maps, and wipe out tons of mobs. They are not like RPG's where you can make a stealthy rogue who sneaks into camps and assassinates bosses. They are a sub class of RPG's that are more loot based and farming based.

The goal is to kill everything.

You are free to play it however you want, but its not going to be designed for it at all and you are just neutering yourself.