Not a fan of Interest (Gain X cash per unspent $) in games

[Falcon]

See title: I can't think of a single game where having a 'don't spend your money so you can get more money' is a fun choice. TD and other genres use it a lot and I think it's kind of universally a pretty awful mechanic.

First, it's a 'win-more' mechanic, which...just aren't very fun. If you're doing well, then great, you get extra cash! But it means that early mistakes snowball into bigger problems because of the opportunity cost of not getting early cash cards to start getting passive income.

It's also just un-fun. Having to go 'oh I'd like to get this card or whatever, but I better save up so I am setup in round 3' is, at least to me, not a fun mechanic, and I really hate losing a run because I oversaved.

Curious what others think, but it's kind of the main thing I dislike about this game right now.

[malogoss]

Originally posted by Falcon:

Curious what others think

Not the same as you. At least in my case, I won't speak for others.

Building a bankroll early for interest can be risky. It is not required to do so to beat the game. Deciding to build a bankroll of $25 as soon as possible by not buying anything is a great way to lose most runs very quickly.

An early investment in Golden Joker (previous demo) or Trading Card, for example, can generate more money than simple interest would. Cards like Joker (the basic +4 mult) or Popcorn early on can provide safety for a while, save you hands played and generate more money that way.

I see interest more like a mechanic to counter badluck, at least early on. You wanted a joker, none were available at the shop and a reroll was too expensive. Then what? Wait, keep your money, generate some interest with it. That interest is some form of compensation for having to possibly play more hands than you hoped for against the last blind.

Later on, say maybe ante level 3, interest is a way to reward good risk management. If you exit every shop with $3, that's on you. You're not managing risk, you're just spending everything you can. Which can be a real strategy, with a little help from Vagabond and Fortune Teller, but that's another story.

[Zubon]

My first winning run relied on interest. The combo was getting the Voucher that increases the interest cap to $10 and the bull Joker that gives 2*cash in chips. That rather changed the mental math on "worth it?"

I generally don't favor "win more" mechanics, but it also provides an incentive to consider that "worth it?" math rather than buying whatever is available immediately.

Compared to other games with similar mechanics, the oddity I see here is that everything is in the shop, rather than a mix of free/random and shop upgrades. I am used to seeing the shop as a way to smooth the edges off the random drops; here, what appears in the shop *is* your random drop, and you spend your $ in the shop the way you would pick your reward from a treasure chest elsewhere.

[Melodia]

One thing I like about the game (in the comparatively little I played) is that it seems like there's a lot of potential for experimenting in how to approach playing it.

[Björn]

I disagree. Essentially the mechanic allows you to trade off short term weakness for long term strength. In my opinion this makes decision making more interesting and enhances strategic depth.

[Kumori]

Personally I can see it both ways. I think the better way of thinking of it is that "There's nothing really good or game changing, or just outside of my price range." So getting interest is just to counter bad luck early in the game. But yea, bank rolling early is just a way of making extra cash when you don't have another way of generating money aside from normal blinds.

[Goblin]

It pairs with the way you actually get paid at the end of a round, in case you hadn't noticed.
You get $1 per hand you still could have played. You get $1 per $5 you had stockpiled. Most Jokers cost around $5.

So yes, if you buy a joker you lose $1 in interest. But if that makes it so you only have to play one hand instead of two, you lost zero income, gained strength for future rounds, and even gained a dollar or two worth of sell value in case it was a temporary buy to scrape by. Interest is a lot weaker than you seem to think.

[Falcon]

Alright, fair to see that there's other views on it. Was curious what other people thought, but I think a fair amount of this is all reasonable, even if I still don't like it.

[Blurrg]

Interest is fine as long as there are mechanics that interact with it. I saw a few jokers that say "as long as you are under X gold" and other cards that benefit from more money. This makes it okay.

However, I do think interest is too strong in this game. You are very heavily incentivized to get to $25 ASAP because the $5 interest per round makes up close to 50% of your income, which is where I think a problem lies. I haven't played a single game where I don't just rush to $25 off the first 3 blinds outside of picking up one cheap joker if its flexible enough.

Just look at the numbers. You win a round with max income for ~$13-15. A reroll in the shop is $5. If you didn't have income you'd be at $8-10. So a single reroll costs most of your money.

If you don't go income, you are pretty much forced to take more tags, but if you take tags to gain more money you get access to the shop less. It just feels off. I think you should still get access to the shop when you skip blinds (maybe a slightly worse shop).


The money + length of game balance just feels *off*. You spend 20% of the game garnering income, the game isn't long enough to really pop off on a build, and the combination of money + time + small shop leaves you with a bit too heavy of an RNG component whereas you'll spend loads of money only to end up with nothing in the end.

[Von Herbst]

Originally posted by Falcon:

First, it's a 'win-more' mechanic [...]

Disagree here. Interest isnt a "win-more" mechanic, it can act like one. Its a "risk-reward" mechanic and isnt this more or less the core of this genre?

[Ronald Brain]

Originally posted by Blurrg:

The money + length of game balance just feels *off*. You spend 20% of the game garnering income, the game isn't long enough to really pop off on a build, and the combination of money + time + small shop leaves you with a bit too heavy of an RNG component whereas you'll spend loads of money only to end up with nothing in the end.

Full game is twice as long as demo + endless, so I don't see this as an issue.

[Iggy]

Interest captures the risk v reward of the game.

When the game is 10-15 levels and not a demo you'll see a lot of times you have to decide how much you will need to commit I feel.

It could be $s or quarters or cards, the whole point of resource management games is to attenuate your use of resources to win both now and later. So I think interest accomplishes that.

[Gravitysuitguy]

My experience is that interest adds a lot to my early game decisions. I've found over a lot of runs that both ignoring interest and rushing to 25 dollars both have problems associated with them and that the game asks me to balance early purchases with saving money. I like how it works currently

[Open Faced Club Sand Wedge]

Nah, building up an account at the risk of skipping early deck development is part of what makes the early game interesting. Imo the interest feature is a really good one

[Daytake]

My man said "make it easier im mad"

[Austin<3]

counterpoint: I do like it and want it in more games.