Hail mary pass catching

[godspeedthunder]

I'm a bit confused with the catch success that I experienced while trying to build a Hail mary team.

I threw a Hail mary to a gutter runner who has ag4 and the game text said I needed a 4+ to catch it. Is there a hidden penalty to catching a Hail mary pass? It doesn't say so in the skill text. Catching a normal pass with ag4 only requires a 2+ and so why was I needing a 4+?

I wasn't in a tackle zone and the weather was nice. I can't think of any other reason why I would need a different score to a normal pass catch other than there being a penalty to catching a HMP.

I will have to continue to try and land a HMP directly onto an unmarked payer again to see if this was just a one off or if you always need 4+ to catch it. Unfortunately it is not easy to get a HMP to land on top of a player and so it will probably take a long time to get it to happen again, but if the normal catching rules don't apply then I will be really sad as it seems like a waste of time if an ag4 player needs 4+ minimum to catch the ball.

Does anyone have any insight on this matter? It will be greatly appreciated

[DarthPhysicist]

Well its never accurate, so its a 3+ for ag4 not 2+. There must be something else you’re missing, but generally speaking, HMP is trash and skaven are far too good to pollute with such an awful skill.

[[PHNX]Kordarus]

is it raining? Also the 2+ only apply to an accurate pass, which is impossible on a HM pass. So if there is rain it would make it a 4+ catch. Otherwise it's a 3+

[sleepyjer]

Disturbing presence?

[godspeedthunder]

Thanks for the replies guys, especially darth, I didnt realise that the pass gets +1 to catch if it's accurate so that would explain at least 1 modifier that I didn't know.


And I'm only doing a HMP build for a bit of fun, not because I think it is better in any way, I've just never used it before and I've also never used Skaven before that's why I am doing that combo.

I like to try and choose a unique skill and build a team around it just for a bit of fun and variety, and also to help me to understand the skill better.

I had no idea that the game automatically saves replays so I'm just going to go and watch it now to see if I can find what the other modifier was.

Ah I see i just watched it and it was my mistake. It wasn't 4+ it was 3+, but my Catcher had diving catch so I was expecting it to have +1 if it landed in the exact square I was in. I have since read the skill properly and DC says +1 on accurate pass and HMP says it is never accurate so that's where I was getting confused.

Thanks again for pointing out that ag4 is only 2+ on accurate pass though as I had not seen that explained anywhere and it makes much more sense now.

Cheers guys!

Does anyone know approx when BB3 is coming out?

[Kejiruze]

Re BB3: Big Ben announced it, then quickly deleted all reference to it.

They got slapped by GW for stating they'd be a new rule set.

We have no idea when it's out other than "2020"

[DarthPhysicist]

A proper teaser

[godspeedthunder]

Oh yeah I heard about that, can't wait!

[holy-death]

Question: Why Hail Mary Pass for a Skaven Gut Runner? I can understand Diving Catch (+1 for catching a pass is good), but wouldn't Accurate be better for your designated thrower? I always thought Hail Mary Pass is better suited for teams that have inherent issues catching passes due to their low agility, not for teams that can catch a direct pass with a high degree of success.

[godspeedthunder]

it was purely because i wanted to test how the skill worked and it just so happened i had never used skaven before so i wanted to test them out too, so there was no real reason tbh. i tell you what though it is extremely fun trying to get it to work and so satisfying when it does. ive only tried it vs AI offline so far but i managed to catch 3 direct HMP passes in one game, so freaking awesome. and from what i can tell it works well with skaven, as the gutter runners can get into position really quickly and can dodge easily out of a tackle zone if they manage to catch the HMP and are obviously good at catching the HMP in the first place.

needless to say there are much more efficient ways to use skaven but its great for a bit of fun, similar to trying to get orks to work with the throw team mate skill, its not efficient but its fun and satisfying when it works.

also HMP is a good option to have available both offensively and defensively and only costs 1 skill point to have. in a team like skaven that have 2 throwers its probably a good idea to have this on one of them and leader on the other. again its not the most efiicient but its nice to have a new mechanic to work with.

im using dwarves at the minute and i just tried out multiple tackle for the first time with the deathroller, its really cool skill to have available, but unfortunately you cant follow up with it. what ive found useful with it is to have it in front of their main big guy on the kick off and then muliplt block 2 other opposition that are standing next to you so you still tie up the big guy while getting to attack the big guys 2 supporters. its gets less helpful after kick off but i always try it get the deathroller in contact with 3 opposition so you can do this same method again.

this might all be old news to experienced players but ive not had the game long so its all new to me trying out all the different skills

[holy-death]

Originally posted by godspeedthunder:

needless to say there are much more efficient ways to use skaven but its great for a bit of fun, similar to trying to get orks to work with the throw team mate skill, its not efficient but its fun and satisfying when it works.

Right now I am trying to get off my Human Team going, but when I will want to take a break from them a Throw Teammate + Hail Mary Pass Orc Team is what I had in mind.

About Throw Teammate - somebody said that probably the only time when he'd consider armor increase skill is when using Goblin as a living projectile to knock out the corner of the cave. Makes it more likely for the Goblin to remain standing and helping with the Blitz that comes after. Also, Pro was suggested as a potentially better skill to take over Block, considering how much you have to roll in order to get the Goblin flying (works for scoring with the Goblin, too). Interesting stuff.

Originally posted by godspeedthunder:

im using dwarves at the minute and i just tried out multiple tackle for the first time with the deathroller, its really cool skill to have available, but unfortunately you cant follow up with it. what ive found useful with it is to have it in front of their main big guy on the kick off and then muliplt block 2 other opposition that are standing next to you so you still tie up the big guy while getting to attack the big guys 2 supporters.

Dauntless is worth considering, if you are going for Multiple Block for your Big Guy. You can knock people down without support that way. Although it makes using Big Guy a real risk-fest, considering how many times you have to roll, so having Block (if possible) is a great way to complement this skill choice.

Originally posted by godspeedthunder:

this might all be old news to experienced players but ive not had the game long so its all new to me trying out all the different skills

Same. I have thrown myself into more interesting builds, instead of going for the "tried and true" route. I am thinking about having Stand Firm Human Blitzers, so they can hit enemy back on their turn when they are pushed back. Makes breaking the cage harder too. I am wondering about Grab too, but I must think some more about that one.

[godspeedthunder]

im not sure if you meant HMP to use throwing a team mate but if so then i dont think you can use these skills at the same time, you can only throw a team mate at a maximum of short pass i think.

ive not tried this yet but i think the best way to use a gobbo thrower is to have nerves of steel on the troll, obviously this is unlikely as you will need to throw doubles but you may get lucky sooner or later, then have a gobbo standing directly behind him ready to be picked up, then pick up the ball with someone else and pass it to the gobbo that standing behind the troll, then pick him up and throw him with nerves of steel and then run with the gobbo as far as possible as he has yet to have been moved that turn. this is all done on the first turn when your on the attack.

i havnt got any of that stats in front of me but if you manage to throw the gobbo as far as you can i think that is 4 spaces or something for a short pass, and then run as far as you can, i think they have about 8 movement or something, and then do one GFI and you can get a 1 turn touchdown. bearing in mind that im a noob and none of these stats may be accurate but the theory is definitely accurate. also i have never used orcs yet so i havnt got a clue what the success rate of this would be. probably highly unlikely, but i bet it is very satisfying if you pull it off. im gonna boot up the game now and take a look at the orc stats to see if i can do the maths a bit.

i think the most fun in this game is trying to pull off crazy stuff instead of just playing safe all of the time with the boring but best skills.

[godspeedthunder]

ok so ive had a game using gobbos and this is what ive learned so far.

1. even if your pass is successful it is never accurate. i found this pretty odd as i cant find any text that tells you this in either the throw team mate skill or the right stuff skill, unlike the HMP skill skill where it clearly states that the pass is never accurate.

2. the gobbo have MA 6 and the short pass has a range of 6, so thats max 12 movement which gets you 1 GFI away from a touchdown on turn 1.

3. because the pass is never accurate then there is a 1 in 3 chance that you will end up 1 space closer to the touchdown line which means you wont have to roll for a GFI. theres 1 in 3 chance that you will be the same distance away meaning you will have to do 1 GFI (assuming you can actually land in the space you are aiming for, not sure if this is possible yet as the 3 passes i made all scattered 1 space away). and theres a 1 in 3 chance of landing 1 space further away and so you will need to roll for 2 GFI.

4. i assume you only scatter 1 space away from targeted square as this is what happened in my 3 attempts but i have not confirmed this yet as there is no game text to confirm this and ive had no experience to prove this wrong yet.

5. nerves of steel is great as you dont have to knock defenders out of your way first before making the pass, but it is not essencial as you can bash them away with black orcs pretty successfully. id still take this as my first choice though.

6. the only 3 skills that seem to help the gobbo himself are these- AG+ to help with the landing, MA+ to help getting to the touchdown line, pro to give the chance of a free reroll, altough if you can afford it the team rerolls are much better to use as they are 100% successful as opposed to the 50% of pro.

7. the best skills to take with the troll other than NOS are pro, pass, accurate and strong arm, unfortunately all of these require doubles apart from strong arm and so its unlikely you will get more than 1, in which case i would choose NOS, but pass and pro are definitely my second and third choices depending on your preference and how many team rerolls you have.

i think thats all ive got so far after 1 game of trying it, although i did score a 1 turn touchdown in that game which was sweet so i know it works if your lucky. ill let you know if i learn anything else in the future.

i'd like to hear anyone elses experiences of using the throw team mate strategy if anyone actually tries it :)

[DarthPhysicist]

Bloaty gobbos...

[holy-death]

Originally posted by godspeedthunder:

im not sure if you meant HMP to use throwing a team mate but if so then i dont think you can use these skills at the same time, you can only throw a team mate at a maximum of short pass i think.

Hail Mary Pass is for Orcs. Throw Teammate is for Goblin and Troll.

Originally posted by godspeedthunder:

ive not tried this yet but i think the best way to use a gobbo thrower is to have nerves of steel on the troll [...] nerves of steel is great as you dont have to knock defenders out of your way first before making the pass, but it is not essencial as you can bash them away with black orcs pretty successfully. id still take this as my first choice though.

Nerves of Stell can be used for a sneaky throw outside of the turn 1 or 16, when your Troll will be usually based by more than 2 enemies. Otherwise I'd go for Pro, to make sure you have an emergency re-roll if needed (outside of team re-roll).

Originally posted by godspeedthunder:

i havnt got any of that stats in front of me but if you manage to throw the gobbo as far as you can i think that is 4 spaces or something for a short pass, and then run as far as you can, i think they have about 8 movement or something, and then do one GFI and you can get a 1 turn touchdown. bearing in mind that im a noob and none of these stats may be accurate but the theory is definitely accurate. also i have never used orcs yet so i havnt got a clue what the success rate of this would be. probably highly unlikely, but i bet it is very satisfying if you pull it off. im gonna boot up the game now and take a look at the orc stats to see if i can do the maths a bit.

Someone already did the math:

It's a Hail Mary type of play that's really only used at the end of turns. Just think of the number of rolls you need to do:

Hand Off (3+), Really Stupid(2+), Always Hungry(2+), Short Pass(5+, or hope the goblin doesn't get thrown behind the target square), Land(4+), maybe GFIs(2+ x2).

Originally posted by godspeedthunder:

i think the most fun in this game is trying to pull off crazy stuff instead of just playing safe all of the time with the boring but best skills.

I think that with the right skills you can make "crazy stuff" happen more often, which is precisely why teams have access to all sorts of skills (consider a Beastman with +AGI, Big Hand and Dodge, for snatching a ball out of multiple tackle zones and running for the score).

Originally posted by DarthPhysicist:

Bloaty gobbos...

It's a good thing you mention this, because I am of opinion that "bloat" shows a significant flaw in the game design. You should want your players to level up. Not fire them right away once they get "too many skills" (or injury of any kind).

[DarthPhysicist]

Originally posted by holy-death:

It's a good thing you mention this, because I am of opinion that "bloat" shows a significant flaw in the game design. You should want your players to level up. Not fire them right away once they get "too many skills" (or injury of any kind).

No, you should want your team to be as effective as possible at winning. I can also grant the premise that some people like to theme a team and that's their prerogative, but that doesn't mean that themed teams should have just a good a chance as an efficient team. "Bloat" is when you don't understand the rules well enough to know when adding a skill is a bad thing. If you think of it as a salary (which is what TV is supposed to kind of represent), and some players are expected to take it in the face and maybe die, you wouldn't want to pay someone alot to simply get punched in the face now would you?