I am "Woke" and I Get the Reaction Here

[Huckleberry]

I would likely be considered "woke" by many here. I believe that diversity and representation are valuable as goals of their own.

Diversity: In any arena, be it work, school, or on a team, diversity of backgrounds and experiences only brings strength to a group. Having people from different communities in a group broadens the thinking of the group as a whole and, ultimately, will strengthen the result for all.

Representation: I am learning, as my now 6-year-old daughter is growing up, how important this is. I grew up in a family of brothers. We are all white. I never thought about representation. Now, seeing how much my daughter identifies with the female characters in movies and books, I think about it a lot.

Having people that look/act like you in movies, games, books, music, etc. is very powerful and meaningful. I want my daughter to know that she can be anything she wants to be. The way she truly knows that is to see herself in others and learn by example. I believe everyone's sons and daughters should feel like they can be/do anything. I want all people to look at the world and see hope and joy, not fear and shame. Seeing others like you in art/media is a powerful way to create that hope and, therefore, I believe representation is vital to a world I believe most of us want for our children.

All that being said, I now understand why this forum is so filled with Anti-woke threads.

Between the review code embargoes and the ScreenRant review, there is a lot of stuff that is odd here.

I will say that, as much as I believe in what I wrote above, when I got to the part of the ScreenRant review where the author brought up representation I thought, "What?! This is video game based on a Chinese tale about demons, gods, and shape-shifting animagi." It immediately felt weird...even to my liberal brain. Certainly it is not my place to tell someone when or how they should feel represented, but this one felt strange even to me.

Additionally, the list of Do's and Dont's that the publisher game to content creators ahead of release, and have supposedly been confirmed, are also weird. Though, honestly, I still do not know if they are true.

Anyway, just wanted to throw in my two cents and say I can at least understand where the other side is coming from here. Not seeing much of that sentiment and thought the forum could use it.

Thanks.

[Huckleberry]

Originally posted by Xafron Chi:

Originally posted by Megatron has fallen:

This is me. Even in games with character creators I make characters that look nothing like me.

This exactly. Never understood the desire to open up a character creator and make what I live as every day.

This is true of me too...I almost always make characters that are different than me in character creators (though, not always)

[Powercrank]

Originally posted by Moffle:

Originally posted by Huckleberry:

Yeah, this is why I am still confused on this. Seems to be a lot of differing opinions on whether or not this is actually true. Also, Xafron's comment immediately following AlexUbels is important context as well. But all of it just adds to the weirdness around the game and helps me to understand the posts on this forum (as I stated in the OP).

It would be trivial for the developer to make a statement saying "We didn't send those mails, we didn't ask anyone to censor their speech, and we fully support people's right to say anything they want".

Why do you think they aren't doing that?

It's very easy to pull the "journalists are always lying when they say things I don't like hearing" card, but the fact of the matter is that the developer has the ultimate power to shut this down, if they did indeed not send those emails. I know that it has become the new trend to just cover your ears and go "lalalalalalalalalala" whenever something pops up that is inconvenient for one's personal beliefs, but try to take a good look at what the people who claim that all this is fabricated are basing their statements on. I'm not going to tell you ahead of time, since I don't want to bias you, but personally I spent a few hours reading the different discussions between people who agree that this is all a hoax, and I did not come away convinced.

because they aren't in the west and aren't familiar with western media and don't really care?

Is everyone automatically guilty any time someone accuses them of something and they just ignore it or aren't aware of it instead of denying it?

[Huckleberry]

Thanks for the reply, Kanashi. There are two things to which I would like to reply:

Originally posted by Kanashi:

here's the harsh truth, no. you cant be anything or anyone you want to be, cause reality doesn't allow us to. forcing society to accept us despite our incapability of beeing "that one exceptional person" leads to frustration and outrage by society.

I just sort of disagree with you here (cordially). I understand not everyone feels the same about human potential or the ability to achieve, but I do. Although...I do recognize I am saying that from a place of relative privilege.

Originally posted by Kanashi:

also its not like there aren't other media out there that dosen't allow your daughter to be a badass strong and incredible female character, there are tons of games out there that allow you to do so. heck even female only protagonist games. (portal,tomb raider,dishonored 2,nier automata,bayonetta,a hat in time,any game with a character creator... the list goes on).

TL:Dr - its a monke game, the game dosen't need to be what YOU want it to be, just let it be, and enjoy it for what it is.

I just want to be clear that I was, in no way, suggesting that every piece of art/media must include representation of all. I was just trying to articulate, in a general sense, why I feel representation is important. You are right about those other games (and they are GREAT games with GREAT protagonists). And...I agree with you wholeheartedly about Wukong. That is why I also found the ScreenRant review a bit odd (though not triggering).

[TESUPREMOS]

Finally someone with common sense

[GroovyHobo]

Honestly I feel like OP is trolling. In my mind I don't want to believe that any male is soft and squishy like this but this is 2024. And as a previous poster said, NO you cannot be just anything you want. We all learn that the hard way. Sometimes it is better to have someone tell us NO rather than to enable our delusions. And OP, if you're genuine and not trolling, you need to go to places where life is HARD and that the least you have to worry about is some sort of diversity quota. And when life is HARD, you'll quickly realize that nobody is an angel which means NOBODY.

[IceWord]

sign...

DEI itself is a perversion of meritocracy, a company doing well with meritocracy not the other way around with forced DEI and expecting a company gonna be better.

If you making a game that have very specific theme, then try force your way in with DEI and see what is gonna happen. I can still hear the whinning from those pathetic EA investors about BFV reports, that was such fun time.

[Ravenbones]

DOnt care, still bought the game.

[Huckleberry]

Originally posted by GroovyHobo:

Honestly I feel like OP is trolling. In my mind I don't want to believe that any male is soft and squishy like this but this is 2024. And as a previous poster said, NO you cannot be just anything you want. We all learn that the hard way. Sometimes it is better to have someone tell us NO rather than to enable our delusions. And OP, if you're genuine and not trolling, you need to go to places where life is HARD and that the least you have to worry about is some sort of diversity quota. And when life is HARD, you'll quickly realize that nobody is an angel which means NOBODY.

Thanks for the reply, Groovy. I assure you this is not a troll.. My post comes from a genuine place.

As to your other point, I readily admit that my assertion to my daughter being that she can achieve anything come from a place of relative privilege (as I stated in my previous post). she has many advantages that others do not. Though I have not traveled all around the world I am very aware that life is much, much harder than mine in other places (hence my statement about my privilege). I lived in Sao Paulo for two years and have been to the favelas there and in Rio and you are right, there is a lot more to worry about than representation for a lot of people.

But, as I stated in another post, both things can be true at the same time. Not everybody can be whatever they want all the time. That is true. But what a great goal to strive for that everyone's kids could feel that way. At least, I think so. And representation is a small, but meaningful, step toward that world.

I understand, though, if you feel like that is the same as giving false hope. You wouldn't be alone in feeling that way. But I think there is a world where that kind of hope isn't false myself.

[Kraxen]

The woke crowd (or whatever label you prefer) operate on a cult mentality. It's the cult mentality people hate, not so much being 'woke' itself.

[Ting]

You're a normal 2010's liberal who still retains common sense. You're not 'woke.' You probably think free college and healthcare are reasonable and are fine with black people in games, like literally 99% of gamers. Difference is, you're starting to see how incredibly damaging it is to this medium to attack art with modern day sensibilities -- especially sensibilities that, frankly, a lot of people are not okay with.

[Udin]

Originally posted by Huckleberry:

I would likely be considered "woke" by many here. I believe that diversity and representation are valuable as goals of their own.

Diversity: In any arena, be it work, school, or on a team, diversity of backgrounds and experiences only brings strength to a group. Having people from different communities in a group broadens the thinking of the group as a whole and, ultimately, will strengthen the result for all.

Representation: I am learning, as my now 6-year-old daughter is growing up, how important this is. I grew up in a family of brothers. We are all white. I never thought about representation. Now, seeing how much my daughter identifies with the female characters in movies and books, I think about it a lot.

Having people that look/act like you in movies, games, books, music, etc. is very powerful and meaningful. I want my daughter to know that she can be anything she wants to be. The way she truly knows that is to see herself in others and learn by example. I believe everyone's sons and daughters should feel like they can be/do anything. I want all people to look at the world and see hope and joy, not fear and shame. Seeing others like you in art/media is a powerful way to create that hope and, therefore, I believe representation is vital to a world I believe most of us want for our children.

All that being said, I now understand why this forum is so filled with Anti-woke threads.

Between the review code embargoes and the ScreenRant review, there is a lot of stuff that is odd here.

I will say that, as much as I believe in what I wrote above, when I got to the part of the ScreenRant review where the author brought up representation I thought, "What?! This is video game based on a Chinese tale about demons, gods, and shape-shifting animagi." It immediately felt weird...even to my liberal brain. Certainly it is not my place to tell someone when or how they should feel represented, but this one felt strange even to me.

Additionally, the list of Do's and Dont's that the publisher game to content creators ahead of release, and have supposedly been confirmed, are also weird. Though, honestly, I still do not know if they are true.

Anyway, just wanted to throw in my two cents and say I can at least understand where the other side is coming from here. Not seeing much of that sentiment and thought the forum could use it.

Thanks.

trying to response in discussion matter.
Diversity, equality, representation you mention is just "branding" in this context and political term. and YES theres TON on monies behind it.

the issue is they pushing it so hard and its look like if they are on some entity pay payroll and they got to meet their quota.
what the hell we have to remember pronounce this and that that in actual life 99.9% of people would never use, why not try remember your neighbor's name for instead as an example?

Also I hope your daughter grow up good and have a good life in the future, but it is you as the parent thats need to guide and educate her, if you relied on tv/movies to raise her I am not sure.

when a company have to DO's and DONT's it s not out of the blue, just like it used to be grocery plastic back "warning" not to put it on your head as is could cause suffocation and could kill or anyother caution warning.
In this specific case, possible from thats labeled good for mankind such as DEI rating or some BS like that.
I never been woke because in this case i never slept/passed out in the fist place.

[Keman]

It's just tiring, frankly.
There is good reason to discuss things like this email thing civilly.
But this cesspit of a forum will just dismiss it as faked and not engage more than calling you "woke" if you attempt to engage meaningfully with it.
People are much too busy attacking an imagined enemy in a culture war of their invention to actually discuss things, which is going to dilute this forum when the game is out and people come seeking potential solutions to inevitable technical issues, because no matter how good the port is we are still on PC and there will inevitably be people hitting some technical issues. So instead of finding solutions, they just get met with a deluge of "dEsTrOy ThE wOkOiDs" instead of discussion about technical issues and potential workarounds.
This is why I can't stand Steam forums, all the legitimate discussion is drowned out by culture war diarrhea.

[Starscream]

Originally posted by Keman:

It's just tiring, frankly.
There is good reason to discuss things like this email thing civilly.
But this cesspit of a forum will just dismiss it as faked and not engage more than calling you "woke" if you attempt to engage meaningfully with it.
People are much too busy attacking an imagined enemy in a culture war of their invention to actually discuss things, which is going to dilute this forum when the game is out and people come seeking potential solutions to inevitable technical issues, because no matter how good the port is we are still on PC and there will inevitably be people hitting some technical issues. So instead of finding solutions, they just get met with a deluge of "dEsTrOy ThE wOkOiDs" instead of discussion about technical issues and potential workarounds.
This is why I can't stand Steam forums, all the legitimate discussion is drowned out by culture war diarrhea.

On the contrary, I think Steam forums are one of the last and best places to discuss things like this. This thread here so far is a shining example of everyone getting an equal voice without the heavy handed one sided censorship of places like reddit or what Youtube comments have become.

[Houstonheart]

The problem is we had a bunch of add tai. Woke, anti-gay, anti-women. I'm a anti diversity. People taking over the form trying to get award gestures by creating division a distraction in the forum, which is counterproductive to the game.

It is also a violation of the steam term of service. I've flagged those and they have been cleaned up and it needs to stay off this in all forms on steem, so productive game discussion could be done in relationship to the actual game, it's performance , things they joy or have Problems with.

[Corobanto]

Diversity is a weakness. Unity is a strength. People for thousands of years up until recently knew this.