SERIOUS DISCUSSION about STORY TELLING

[kcnue]

THIS IS AN OLD POST! MY CURRENT THOUGHTS:

i found a book in the meantime, it's a retelling of the original and is much shorter, from a translator called julia lovell. it's a very easy to read book, unlike the original novel.

i can definitely see how the game was made to be full of interesting refferences for people who know the story before playing! because, from what i've heard, everybody in china and much of asia knows the story since childhood.

thinking back on it, it's actually great storytelling. the game more so "shows" the story, rather than "tells" the story.

after finishing it, i think that extensive exposition would've hurt the overall presentation and atmosphere alot. the game was so expertly crafted that in the end i didn't really mind that i didn't understand much of the story, because the atmosphere alone was enough to keep me immersed.

next time i play it again, i will read the book while playing it, to get a better understanding of the story.



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ORIGINAL POST:



Hey everyone!

I'm so sorry but i HAVE to throw in a couple of opinions here!

I've been playing the game for 29 hours now and i am in the middle of the 3rd chapter. First of all i'd like to say that i have NOTHING BUT PRAISE for this game. I have enjoyed it and still very much do so, and i will probably enjoy it till the end! The setting alone, the music, the atmosphere and the boss fights are enough for me to enjoy this game!

Now... I've never been a big supporter of story, i don't necessarily need a story to play a game, and i NEVER played i game for its story! That's why i played all of darksouls 1,2,3 and loved them.

However... darksouls HAS no story, at least it has no prior story to the game, hence it really doesn't matter. Well... that's where the downside of this game and the downfall of it's exposition comes from: this very fact that it HAS a story prior to the game, in the novel. And so because it has a prior story, the devs just assumed that the players would be familiar with it. And i guess that holds true to the chinese / even the broader asian audience. But that also means the game does not stand on its own when it comes to storytelling.

Why do i say this? Because it hinders the enjoyment that you get out of the game! It diminishes the experience by quite a bit! I mean there's this GRAND story behind it but you are left wanting for it but it never reveals itself! And that's so frustrating! First two chapters i didn't notice it! I was waaaay too amazed by the scenery, the gameplay, that guy in the desert also was such a vibe, and everything was awesome!

But now... in chapter three, the lack of exposition is really starting to show it's face and it's just so frustrating. I constantly find myself felling the following:
- idk where i'm going
- idk why i'm going there
- idk who any of the characters are
- idk ANYTHING really

And this makes me feel frustrated and dazed and confused and it really hinders the enjoyment sometimes!

In conclusion, i would like to understand the story from WITHIN the game! Now that's a lot to ask. What exactly would that even entail? How could that be implemented?

A couple of ideas would be:
- maybe, as you pass through an area have an old voice narrate the story of that area
- also, when you meditate a story could also be told by a voice
- or maybe have a guy, an old monk (maybe the gourd guy from chapter one) that gives you a map that is all foggy until you get to a the locations, then as you get to that location have a prompt that prompts you to the map and a story is told by a voice with beautiful traditional chinese painting style cartoon in it!

IDK JUST SOME THOUGHTS! PLEASE TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION! WHO'S WITH ME?

[kcnue]

noone else feels like this? am i missing something?

[wboson]

As the boss fights take most of the attention and time I don´t remember anymore what I might have read about certain Kings 20h ago. And I feel like most of the storytelling is lost in translations, bc most of it is given in the "anecdotes". So when the big picture is presented I´m alos wondering what was actually going on.

My question would be if anybody fluent in chinese and whos reading all the "anecdotes" would have the same issues?

[Adam__86]

Unfortunately the game does a terrible job at explaining the Journey to the West

[kcnue]

Originally posted by wboson:

As the boss fights take most of the attention and time I don´t remember anymore what I might have read about certain Kings 20h ago. And I feel like most of the storytelling is lost in translations, bc most of it is given in the "anecdotes". So when the big picture is presented I´m alos wondering what was actually going on.

My question would be if anybody fluent in chinese and whos reading all the "anecdotes" would have the same issues?

that's what i was thinking too, about the chinese players! are they as lost? i don't think they are because they most likely know the story from the novel, which is super popular in china as i've heard.

[kcnue]

Originally posted by Adam__86:

Unfortunately the game does a terrible job at explaining the Journey to the West

it is implied that you already know the story, but for the people who don;t know, everything just feels so cryptic and even without aim at points

[Cokonaut]

*Spoiler*


It already told you at the end of intro, the old monkey said go find 6 relics in 6 different regions in order to bring back Wukong. at the end of each of chapter you get a relic at the end. also read the journals and actually listen to all the dialogues. voice acting in this game is really really good both Chinese and English.

Also this game takes place AFTER Journey to the West. So it just assumes you already know the story about Journey to the West.

[kcnue]

again, dark souls did that too in a way, but in this game the fact that there's this GRAND story behind it just worsens the feeling of frustration

[Baron01]

I do not play these types of games for story moments. I play them to kill stuff, get better gear and kill more stuff faster. I enjoy those story moments, end-of-chapter cut-scene and some monologues here and there but I'm not bothered they are not making much sense and are not building some cohesive story line I can follow. I smash stuff good!

I agree that chapters do not have a connecting story thread and early in each chapter, you are left wondering what is going on.

Originally posted by Cokonaut:

...
Also this game takes place AFTER Journey to the West. So it just assumes you already know the story about Journey to the West.

I think this observation is correct. Developers simply assumed players will be familiarized with the source material but that might be solid assumption for Chinese player but I doubt many western players even new this novel existed let alone read it. :P

[kcnue]

Originally posted by Cokonaut:

*Spoiler*


It already told you at the end of intro, the old monkey said go find 6 relics in 6 different regions in order to bring back Wukong. at the end of each of chapter you get a relic at the end. also read the journals and actually listen to all the dialogues. voice acting in this game is really really good both Chinese and English.

i know about the relics, i understood that, but the journal is sooooooooooo boriiiiing. but i really want to know, from what you are saying, is the journal eye-opening with regards to the story? does it actually make you "get it"?

[kcnue]

Originally posted by Baron01:

I do not play these types of games for story moments. I play them to kill stuff, get better gear and kill more stuff faster. I enjoy those story moments, end-of-chapter cut-scene and some monologues here and there but I'm not bothered they are not making much sense and are not building some cohesive story line I can follow. I smash stuff good!

I agree that chapters do not have a connecting story thread and early in each chapter, you are left wondering what is going on.

i too don't play these game types for story, but this one HAS a story, and i really wanted to have this experience, like i'm a kid and someone reads me a tale!

[kcnue]

also for example sekiro is a souls-like game too, but there's a very comprehensible story behind it

[REhorror]

The story is sorta like a Souls game.

You retrace the path of the hero that has gone before (Wukong) to gradually succeed/become THE hero/Wukong.

Most of the bosses in the games are direct references to specific story arcs in JttW, namely Elder Jinchi and the Black Bear who steal Sanzhang's Kashar, the Yellow Wind mouse that keeps the oil for Jingli Boddhivasta, the seven spiders and Centipede Daoist and the Bull Demon King and his family. I dunno about the Yellowbrow stuff tho.

but these events have already happened in the original JttW, you just happen to see similar events with some changes (like Elder Jinchi is already dead and becomes a wight, Ping Ping is the daughter of Bull King and the fox princess that Zhu Bajie slayed during the journey, and Red Boy is actually a demon Yasha race).

Damn, the more I speak, the more it really sounds like Souls.

But don't worry OP, the story is weakest part of the game, chinese players hope for a more traditional story instead of the gather MacGuffin plot right now.

[kcnue]

i'm just saying this: lack of cohesive story-telling kills the vibes in this game

[REhorror]

It is what it is, hopefully the devs improve upon the storytelling in the sequel.

[someoneproud]

The story is almost completely lost on me tbh, some of the posts here have helped with an overview but moment to moment I don't know why a lot of this stuff is happening.

I don't really see it as a negative though, it's encouraged me to start reading the novel and watching the '86 series. I don't mind missing some story when the gameplay and setting are enough to carry for the first playthrough. When I'm more familiar with the source material I can play again and get a better perspective on the game story.

People get really into DS lore, beyond what they find when actually playing. Lore is a draw and I think of the original works as lore to the game, as well as a fun and interesting cultural reference.