Remove Denuvo

[GloriousZote]

Your game is very exciting, but Denuvo is known to cause more problems than it prevents, and it's a pretty bad anti-piracy program, too.
Besides, most people will buy a game they like out of goodwill.

[Arion]

Such naivety Klikard. You think Denuvo works? It delays the crackers by like a week or so, maybe.

I mean, these people get off on cracking games. It's their passion. Denuvo is like an extra layer of challenge to them, more fun to be had. And they break it, they always do.

You can invent 1000 DRMs, they will break them all. Nothing will stop them.

Meanwhile, paying customers refuse to buy games that have Denuvo now. The cat is out of the bag, we know how ♥♥♥♥♥♥ this program is and how it screws over paying customers who buy the game. I'm not paying to be made a fool of, no thanks.

The deal is this: Remove Denuvo, I buy. Don't, I don't.

Also, one look at GloriousZote's profile and you can see he buys games. Alot of games. Meanwhile your profile is private. Hidden. He's got nothing to hide, but you do.

So you accusing him of piracy? Please. Who are you kidding here man?

[MROOD]

3 WEEKS LEFT !!!

[Jack ❱•❰]

Just to remind everyone...
Empress break DRM per cash not for passion or challenge and currently she is the only person who is cracking DENUVO, so good luck to everyone waiting for this game to be cracked.

[min3r95]

Escrito originalmente por Jack ❱•❰:

Just to remind everyone...
Empress break DRM per cash not for passion or challenge and currently she is the only person who is cracking DENUVO, so good luck to everyone waiting for this game to be cracked.

Not being cracked does not mean unpirated.

The thing is, unfortunately the pirates have moved on to different means of playing the game for free which do not require cracking the game.

It won't necessary take weeks, it gonna be day one.

[ダミ]

Regarding Denuvo, I think devs should implement it to deter cracking of their game and then remove it after 1 year. That way, they get their sales and after the year everyone benefits from a Denuvo-less version of the game. But this is just my opinion. Devs are entitled to safeguard their games in any manner they want. We vote with our wallets whether we support that or not.

[Klikard]

Escrito originalmente por Arion:

Such naivety Klikard. You think Denuvo works? It delays the crackers by like a week or so, maybe.

I mean, these people get off on cracking games. It's their passion. Denuvo is like an extra layer of challenge to them, more fun to be had. And they break it, they always do.

You can invent 1000 DRMs, they will break them all. Nothing will stop them.

Meanwhile, paying customers refuse to buy games that have Denuvo now. The cat is out of the bag, we know how ♥♥♥♥♥♥ this program is and how it screws over paying customers who buy the game. I'm not paying to be made a fool of, no thanks.

The deal is this: Remove Denuvo, I buy. Don't, I don't.

Also, one look at GloriousZote's profile and you can see he buys games. Alot of games. Meanwhile your profile is private. Hidden. He's got nothing to hide, but you do.

So you accusing him of piracy? Please. Who are you kidding here man?

Of course it works, do some research and you'll see how many games still are uncracked to date after many years.

There is no problems associated with Denouvo itself, i haven't had any issues at all. So ideally you should back your statement to why Denouvo is such a huge problem instead of pulling nonsense out your a**.

Complaining about Denouvo is like saying you are a pirate. I did never accuse anyone of being a pirate but why else would you complain about a functioning DRM then.

I don't have anything to prove to you, i already own the game. You can't know if he bought the games or got them through giveaways anyway as an example, also it don't mean anything.

Also if it only took a week to crack then Denouvo have managed to done one of the more important things with game releases. I would be really suprised if that happened.

[min3r95]

Escrito originalmente por Dami:

Regarding Denuvo, I think devs should implement it to deter cracking of their game and then remove it after 1 year. That way, they get their sales and after the year everyone benefits from a Denuvo-less version of the game. But this is just my opinion. Devs are entitled to safeguard their games in any manner they want. We vote with our wallets whether we support that or not.

Would be a lot better without it, we never have any proof that it does improve sale number, so why bother using it in the first place?
That said I still agree with you.

[Klikard]

Escrito originalmente por min3r95:

Escrito originalmente por Dami:

Regarding Denuvo, I think devs should implement it to deter cracking of their game and then remove it after 1 year. That way, they get their sales and after the year everyone benefits from a Denuvo-less version of the game. But this is just my opinion. Devs are entitled to safeguard their games in any manner they want. We vote with our wallets whether we support that or not.

Would be a lot better without it, we never have any proof that it does improve sale number, so why bother using it in the first place?
That said I still agree with you.:LeViada_normal:

As a consumer why would you need proof it works or not, so why bother approacing the case from that side since you are a consumer not a developer of the game?

I do suggest doing some research on the topic though.

[min3r95]

Escrito originalmente por Klikard:

As a consumer why would you need proof it works or not, so why bother approacing the case from that side since you are a consumer not a developer of the game?

I do suggest doing some research on the topic though.

I did some research and couldn't find any evidence that Denuvo improves sales numbers. My concern is that without proof of effectiveness, it's hard to justify its use. As a consumer, it's important to question whether such features actually provide value or impact sales, even if we're not the ones developing the software.

Denuvo implemented mean the game have to rely on a server to function.

Forced online authorization and DRM like Denuvo in single-player games are problematic for a reason. When we buy a physical copy of a game, we own it outright and can play it without any restrictions. Digital games should offer the same level of ownership. Implementing similar policies in games is unnecessary and limits our ability to use the product freely after purchase. Even with the allowance of 5 activations per 24 hours, it doesn’t justify the inconvenience and restrictions imposed on us as consumers.

[min3r95]

Denuvo implemented games rely on 3rd party DRM server to generate authorization tokens in order for the games to be launchable(forced online authorization). These tokens are expirable and can be break under circumstances(reinstalling/update OS/driver,switching Proton(Linux), changing hardware) render the games useless.
The tokens won't be automatically acquired by themselves, you need to launch the games in online mode for them to be acquired.
The tokens can only be acquired for a limited number of times(usually 5)per 24 hours, once you reach the limit for whatever reason, you will be blocked out of your games, and will need to wait until the next day to be able to "activate" the game again.You need to ask for permission to play the game you paid for.
You can play Denuvo implemented games in offline mode, but it won't be indefinitely.
In fact you can't play the games at all if there's no token or for some reason it's cannot a token(server outage) regardless of whether you're online or offline.

[icantsee]

Escrito originalmente por Arion:

Such naivety Klikard. You think Denuvo works? It delays the crackers by like a week or so, maybe.

I mean, these people get off on cracking games. It's their passion. Denuvo is like an extra layer of challenge to them, more fun to be had. And they break it, they always do.

You can invent 1000 DRMs, they will break them all. Nothing will stop them.

Meanwhile, paying customers refuse to buy games that have Denuvo now. The cat is out of the bag, we know how ♥♥♥♥♥♥ this program is and how it screws over paying customers who buy the game. I'm not paying to be made a fool of, no thanks.

The deal is this: Remove Denuvo, I buy. Don't, I don't.

Also, one look at GloriousZote's profile and you can see he buys games. Alot of games. Meanwhile your profile is private. Hidden. He's got nothing to hide, but you do.

So you accusing him of piracy? Please. Who are you kidding here man?

lol 1 week? you must be delusional. Only one person is cracking and she is insane and has stopped cracking for awhile.

[Klikard]

Escrito originalmente por min3r95:

Escrito originalmente por Klikard:

As a consumer why would you need proof it works or not, so why bother approacing the case from that side since you are a consumer not a developer of the game?

I do suggest doing some research on the topic though.

I did some research and couldn't find any evidence that Denuvo improves sales numbers. My concern is that without proof of effectiveness, it's hard to justify its use. As a consumer, it's important to question whether such features actually provide value or impact sales, even if we're not the ones developing the software.

Denuvo implemented mean the game have to rely on a server to function.

Forced online authorization and DRM like Denuvo in single-player games are problematic for a reason. When we buy a physical copy of a game, we own it outright and can play it without any restrictions. Digital games should offer the same level of ownership. Implementing similar policies in games is unnecessary and limits our ability to use the product freely after purchase. Even with the allowance of 5 activations per 24 hours, it doesn’t justify the inconvenience and restrictions imposed on us as consumers.:rdora:

What does it matter from a consumer side of the game if it actually provides value or impact sales? Makes no sense, you still looking at it as you are developer trying to figure out if it's worth licensing it or not.

This entire discussion is a joke, also just potential pirates complaining about DRM hoping for day 1 crack if it's removed.

[min3r95]

Escrito originalmente por Klikard:

What does it matter from a consumer side of the game if it actually provides value or impact sales? Makes no sense, you still looking at it as you are developer trying to figure out if it's worth licensing it or not.

This entire discussion is a joke, also just potential pirates complaining about DRM hoping for day 1 crack if it's removed.

I understand your perspective, but I believe there’s merit in discussing the impact of DRM like Denuvo from a consumer standpoint. As consumers, our concerns go beyond mere piracy prevention. DRM can impose significant restrictions on how we use the games we purchase, such as requiring online activation or limiting the number of installations. These measures can inconvenience legitimate users and restrict their ability to enjoy games offline or after a certain number of activations.

The issue isn't just about developers assessing the value of DRM for licensing; it’s about ensuring that consumers retain fair use and ownership rights over the products they buy. When we purchase a game, whether physical or digital, we expect the freedom to use it as we see fit within reasonable boundaries. DRM policies that overly restrict this freedom can undermine the overall consumer experience and trust.

Moreover, dismissing these concerns as irrelevant to consumers or attributing them solely to pirates overlooks the legitimate rights and expectations of paying customers. It’s important to advocate for consumer-friendly DRM policies that balance anti-piracy measures with user convenience and rights.

Therefore, discussing the impact of DRM on consumer rights and usability is not only valid but essential for fostering a fair and transparent gaming environment. It’s about finding a balance that respects both developers' needs and consumers' rights to fully enjoy the products they purchase.

[Arion]

Meh. I admit when i'm wrong. Yes, I have no clue about the cracking community. I have now read about it and it does seem like Denuvo is tough to crack. So, it does it's "one job", unless a group of people pool money to pay Empress to crack it.

It's still a bad DRM, and I don't believe it increases sales for the companies using it's service. Whatever small increase might happen is offset by the decrease in sales of people who refuse to buy it with Denuvo. In short, devs are losing money by paying Denuvo most likely.

So how does Denuvo keep convincing companies to buy it? Must be black magic.

Klikard, there is always a point in discussion. Take a look at my profile, you can't call me a pirate man.

Why complain about a DRM? When it's intrusive, heavy, requires you to be online to play a single player game, and might one day completely prevent you from playing the game you purchased.. It's a damn good reason to complain.

Point being: We customers are not the ones cracking or pirating the games, but we're the ones being punished for that. It's a collective, unfair punishment.

We buy a product, and they dictate how we use it. Like we're little children who cannot be trusted.

Imagine you buy a car. It's yours, you own it. But, the company that sold you the car can remotely shut you down from using it whenever they please. Generally they won't do it, but the fact that they can is the problem. It's not really yours then, is it?

[iamgeorge82]

Escrito originalmente por Arion:

Meh. I admit when i'm wrong. Yes, I have no clue about the cracking community. I have now read about it and it does seem like Denuvo is tough to crack. So, it does it's "one job", unless a group of people pool money to pay Empress to crack it.

It's still a bad DRM, and I don't believe it increases sales for the companies using it's service. Whatever small increase might happen is offset by the decrease in sales of people who refuse to buy it with Denuvo. In short, devs are losing money by paying Denuvo most likely.

So how does Denuvo keep convincing companies to buy it? Must be black magic.

Klikard, there is always a point in discussion. Take a look at my profile, you can't call me a pirate man.

Why complain about a DRM? When it's intrusive, heavy, requires you to be online to play a single player game, and might one day completely prevent you from playing the game you purchased.. It's a damn good reason to complain.

Point being: We customers are not the ones cracking or pirating the games, but we're the ones being punished for that. It's a collective, unfair punishment.

We buy a product, and they dictate how we use it. Like we're little children who cannot be trusted.

Imagine you buy a car. It's yours, you own it. But, the company that sold you the car can remotely shut you down from using it whenever they please. Generally they won't do it, but the fact that they can is the problem. It's not really yours then, is it?

Someone on the Steam forums admitted they were wrong and engaged in a reasonable discussion? Take my points sir, award heading your way.