Need explanation how Adepts work

[ArchAngel]

Hi, I am trying to do a Very Hard playthrough with an unarmed Adept and the skill descriptions ingame are a bit confusing. So if anyone who played with Adept could enlighten me I would be grateful.
What I am confused about is hit chance and damage. Should I only raise Chi Casting to have more hit chance with Adept skills? Does Strength or Close Combat have any effect?
What about damage, is there any point in raising Strength and Close Combat and Unarmed skills to get more damage when using Adept attacks?

[Dorok]

You could try check some of your questions with multiple karma points available before a fight, and try various options and quote the percentage chance to hit and damages. And compare. And put results here. :-)

[ArchAngel]

Yes I was thinking about that, but that is only if nobody that visits these forums plays Adepts :D
I started playing this char already but only put points into both skills in low numbers and now I need to find out how it really works before I start spending larger Karma amounts.

[Dorok]

I honestly didn't check carefully but I don't see how close combat skills couldn't work with chi, and chi is for close combat. Some chi skills even adapt if you use hands or a close range weapon. Same goes for Strength and training in hands or close range.

I haven't check but it would be illogical that all those stats aren't used.

The alternate option for close combat is cyber or neither chi nor cyber, but clearly Chi is tempting.

[Dorok]

archangel님이 먼저 게시:

Yes I was thinking about that, but that is only if nobody that visits these forums plays Adepts :D
I started playing this char already but only put points into both skills in low numbers and now I need to find out how it really works before I start spending larger Karma amounts.

Really try cumulate some Karma points to test a little, few tests would allow know.

I really got the feeling of what I wrote in my previous post ie yes all training works but I forgot check carefully. :-)

[Kalon]

Read the description of each attribute. If you are an unarmed fighter and not pumping up your strength and close combat, you are an idiot. Chi casting has nothing to do with unarmed combat. Killing hands is a chi ability to temporarily adds damage AND THAT IS ALL IT DOES. Strength+Close Combat = more damage+higher chance to hit in hth. Chi casting makes your CHI abilities more potent like mana fist etc. The makers of the game spelled out how each attribute affects the game. There is no mystery.

[IlluminaZero]

y4uhittaz님이 먼저 게시:

Read the description of each attribute. If you are an unarmed fighter and not pumping up your strength and unarmed combat, you are an idiot. Chi casting has nothing to do with unarmed combat. Killing hands is a chi ability to temporarily adds damage AND THAT IS ALL IT DOES. Strength+Unarmed Combat = more damage+higher chance to hit in hth. Chi casting makes your CHI abilities more potent like mana fist etc. The makers of the game spelled out how each attribute affects the game. There is no mystery.

While you want Strength for damage scaling with unarmed, it's questionable whether investing in unarmed combat is worthwhile due to killing hands disabling unarmed skills and not offering ANY bonus damage. Not certain if it even increases critical chance with Killer hands active.

If you want a physical combat adept, you are better off investing in melee weapons. Cleave + Katana == Either a group of death enemies, or enemies that have 0 AP.

This is also due to Quick Strike and Mana Fist (Might have names wrong) being horrible skills.

[ArchAngel]

y4uhittaz님이 먼저 게시:

Read the description of each attribute. If you are an unarmed fighter and not pumping up your strength and unarmed combat, you are an idiot. Chi casting has nothing to do with unarmed combat. Killing hands is a chi ability to temporarily adds damage AND THAT IS ALL IT DOES. Strength+Unarmed Combat = more damage+higher chance to hit in hth. Chi casting makes your CHI abilities more potent like mana fist etc. The makers of the game spelled out how each attribute affects the game. There is no mystery.

Yes, but any Chi skill that adds bonus damage or gives special attack disables your Unarmed Strike skills. And it says in Chi skills description that raising this skill increases your hit chance with Chi skills.

[Kalon]

Fine, did some empirical testing and GUESS WHAT! Chi casting HAS NO BEARING whatsoever on chance to hit with a punch EVEN IF YOU CAST KILLING HANDS!
Even with maxed chi casting, killing hands adds 10 to your FISTS damage because its a FIST!
No mystery here lads. If you wanna punch people, pump your strength, close combat and unarmed combat up. And my troll adept made harlequin look weak so unarmed is viable through the whole game.

[ArchAngel]

OK I just done a bit of testing and this is what I found out. I tested with bare hands, mana fist and killing strike.
Base Value:
bare hands 86% hit chance, 5 damage
Mana fist 88% hit chance, 10 damage
killing hands 86% hit chance, 14 damage

Strength +1
bare hands 94%, 6 damage
mana 88%, 10 damage
killing 94%, 15 damage

Close Combat+1
bare hands 96%, 5 damage
mana 88%, 10 damage
killing 96%, 14 damage

Willpower+1
bare hands 86%, 5 damage
mana 96%, 10 damage
killing 86%, 14 damage

Willpower+1 AND Chi Casting+1
bare hands 86%, 5 damage
mana 99%, 10 damage
killing 86%, 14 damage

So as we can see Strenght and Close Combat work with unarmed and Chi powers that improved your base strike. For Adepts raising Unarmed skill does nothing.

[Kalon]

Specifically, Strength raises HIT and DMG. Close combat raises HIT. Unarmed seems to raise CRIT. Interestingly, this is exactly what the skills say they do.

[Kalon]

My experiment was run with 200 karma to blow on a brand new character thanks to the underground fight club content available in the workshop.
This means I was able to go from teasting with minimal stats to max stats. Maxing willpower and chi didn't affect my hth at all. Strength raised hit % and dmg, Close combat ONLY raised hit %, and unarmed raised crit %. Now I am going to drink to forget this thread ever happened.

[HunterZ]

y4uhittaz님이 먼저 게시:

Fine, did some empirical testing and GUESS WHAT! Chi casting HAS NO BEARING whatsoever on chance to hit with a punch EVEN IF YOU CAST KILLING HANDS!
Even with maxed chi casting, killing hands adds 10 to your FISTS damage because its a FIST!
No mystery here lads. If you wanna punch people, pump your strength, close combat and unarmed combat up. And my troll adept made harlequin look weak so unarmed is viable through the whole game.

harlequin sucks. Compare to Iron Liz.

[Kalon]

Concur with HunterZ.

[IlluminaZero]

y4uhittaz님이 먼저 게시:

Specifically, Strength raises HIT and DMG. Close combat raises HIT. Unarmed seems to raise CRIT. Interestingly, this is exactly what the skills say they do.

This is what people are analyzing:

y4uhittaz님이 먼저 게시:

Read the description of each attribute. If you are an unarmed fighter and not pumping up your strength and unarmed combat, you are an idiot...

With the current system, the only attribute that is worth raising is STR and maybe close combat if you are having accuracy problems. +CRIT is nice, but as a karma sink Hell No.

Or better yet, just use melee.

[NeVeRLiFt]

The Adept abilities don't work for unarmed do they?
Except Killing hands? all the rest are for melee attacks right?

So like Killing hands does nothing for the special attacks you get in unarmed like roundhouse kick and disarming strike for example.