Lords of shadow 2 dracula is EVIL

[Shin Dan]

With the second developer diary came the quick glimpse of the bestiary, and boy, does it not paint dracula's influence on his servants in any decent light.
to start with the "castle dwellers" section has a bestiary on dungeon minions,
the details are as follows
"it wasn't long before the first humans, from nearby regions, paid homage and swore allegiance to the prince of darkness. in exchange for their pathetic lives, they agreed to kill anyone who did not join the cause, whether stranger, acquaintance, or relative"
To further drive this point home, the following bestiary which deals with the bigger version of the dungeon minion, the dungeon jailer, goes even further with how extreme things became.
the entry is as follows
"some of the jailers were especially violent and unscrupulous, dismembering their own during the "flesh tournaments" held under the castle.
as a reward for their exploits, they earned the right to keep the cadaver and the armor of those they defeated."
these are taken from the first half of the entries, they go on to describe how these people became the monsters you see in the bestiary, but wow.
that's brutal, i mean- these were PEOPLE, ordinary human beings who ultimately became monsters, just villagers, commonfolk, not warriors, just innocents.
like...the innocents at wygol....

[Shin Dan]

Okay, I want to further this topic with my own opinion of los's take on dracula.
now officially, dracula made his first appearance in the resurrection dlc (yes, I consider that the first appearance) his first appearance as a vampire overlord is actually in the post credits cutscene, but I digress.
the first moment of him being dracula, he is gabriel belmont transitioning his reason, changing within. he starts discussing how he no longer cares about those he has wronged, he doesn't feel anything for them now and walks over the path to his fate paved with their bodies with relish.
doesn't sound too heroic does it? it's at this point that we can tell gabriel has well and truly snapped, he's not insane per say, he's just no longer human, and his mind changes to adapt to this new extreme to his reality.
being a vampire isn't some fun thing that all the kids want to do, it's damning, you can no longer exist in the sunlight, you become a creature that drinks blood to survive, and not only do you have to watch your loved ones grow old and die, you're the one who might actually kill them due to your hunger, but it's more than that.
becoming a vampire changes the perspective to suit the new predatory nature of the vampire blood within you, and it also carries with it the power of the one who gave it to you, in this case laura, who was incredibly powerful to the point that gabriel didn't stand a chance against her.
Now what gabriel did here was a threefold break to his sanity, let's get the obvious out of the way first, he's a vampire now, he's not going to heaven, he's not going to die of old age, there is nothing left in the afterlife for this man, he won't rejoin marie when he dies, he'll probably go to hell.
second, he had to kill a child, okay so laura technically isn't a child, but the killing was the same, he drank the blood of a vampire with the body of a little girl, a man doesn't just enjoy doing that, this really helped drive home how bad gabriel was about to become.
third, up until this point, gabby got absolutely NO sleep.
no,
♥♥♥♥♥♥♥
sleep
we're talking none, this guy was battling werewolf armies, overpowered vampires, legions of the undead and SATAN himself.
with zero nods after being tricked into killing claudia.
HOW THE ♥♥♥♥ DOES ANYONE DO ALL THAT?!
seriously, logically, gabby would NEED some kind of sleep, yet here he is, with no sleep, TAKING DOWN EVIL ARMIES OF MONSTERS
it should come as no surprise to us then when gabriel looks tired during the events of reverie, HE IS BLEEDING TIRED! laura could have at least let the man sleep.
not to mention that a lack of sleep, coupled with the increasingly traumatic experiences of the countless battles he had to endure, MUST HAVE WORN AT HIS SANITY CONSIDERABLY.
now let's consider the forgotten one.
the forgotten one isn't just the sovereign over the elemental plane of darkness.
he's also technically dracula's first hunt as a vampire.
dracula's first prey was an all powerful demon overlord who USED to rule the elemental plane of shadow, not only in a technical sense, but a literal one as well.
how does dracula defeat him? by stealing his power, or, by draining it after tearing him apart and finally finishing him off by cutting him in half.
this moment with the forgotten one was heavily symbolic of a vampire's first hunt and is literally dracula belmont's first prey in resurrection.
so we get that he's a badass who went insane for logical reasons (no hope for peace in death because he's a vampire, no sleep while single handedly wiping out armies of monsters, actually died at one point and came back to life, killed a vampire with the appearance of a child to become a monster.)
now let's look at mirror of fate.
mirror of fate commits one very serious sin with dracula, it doesn't make his attack on the brotherhood seem all that important.
okay so you got one village of people who get killed by his werewolves. whoopdeedoo.
but how does this make him the ultimate evil? the PRINCE OF DARKNESS-
honestly, while playing mirror of fate, i felt more connected to the BELMONTS than i did dracula himself, hell, during the first fight my initial issue was "Is this guy supposed to be the ultimate evil? because...he's just sitting here while the toymaker plays house with his...well...home."
The issue I had was. despite the presence of scrolls, dracula didn't seem particularly threatening, you knew who he was, and that painted him in a biased light, even though you saw the atrocities he'd been commiting, in the back of your head you're just ticking them off.
"brotherhood guys died, meh, village of innocents died because of the brotherhood, meh, werewolves joined dracula because he's dracula, meh, harpies are...there....meh, witches want to rebel against dracula, maybe they think he's weak because he's acting heroic? meh,"
because you knew of him and his history with the brotherhood, nothing he did felt so much, evil as it was a by-product of his vengeance and his rulership over the monsters, most of which came to him of their own accord, he never forced them to join.
a lot of the events in mirror of fate made dracula feel downright relatable and heroic, and i suppose given the alucard twist theme they had going, that was the point.
you wouldn't feel anything for that scene had you thought him the ultimate evil, the belmonts were the focus here, not dracula himself, he was just....a sideline focal point, his history as gabriel clouded your view, and honestly? past the village, you seldom saw dracul hurting any innocents that weren't related to the brotherhood in some way, for the most part he didn't seem evil as in malevolently ultimate evil, it just felt like his was a perspective of situation forced on him by his status as a powerful vampire.
and besides, the brotherhood had it coming.
they REALLY had it coming, i mean, THEY KNEW ABOUT GABRIEL'S FATE AND STILL SENT HIM TO GO BECOME DRACULA? ♥♥♥♥ those jerks.
so most of mirror of fate you spend your time sympathizing with dracula and wondering if he'll ever reconcile with the belmonts, he doesn't feel evil because he wasn't the focus, just his relationship with the belmonts.
and boy, WHAT a relationship, it leaves absolutely no room for reconciliation in this game, the belmonts will not only hate dracula, they won't even know who he is to them, and the only one who does, won't tell them because he's too ashamed of being a vampire and wants to stop them.
so yes, I find los2's take on dracula a bit refreshing, if he's actually evil instead of "forgivably evil" or "evil because the circumstances demand it" then i'll love the character all the more.
dracula in mirror of fate just didn't feel right, you heard he was evil, but you never really saw it overmuch, even the vampire's tower level with all the maidens being fed upon felt more like an excuse to keep his servants alive, vampires have got to feed, right? and dracula himself only fed on combatants that were taken out by his pet succubus, so it paints him in a somewhat positive light, despite the obvious evil nature of the character at this point, we see a more reluctant dracula than anything else.

[Lykan]

^Actually, in the original Dracula (the book), the sun only weakened his power, it did not kill him. That's the thing about original vampiric lore. The sun did not melt nor made vampires explode or anything. It just weakened them. I find Blood Starvation to be the honest killer of vampires but that's just me.

Anyway, i loved reading this. It's spot on and I cannot wait for Mirror of Fate and LOS2 to hit PC. I'll be buying Mirror of Fate on PSN soon as well. :3

[Rohsiph]

Just finished playing MoF, after finishing LoS1 last night (second time through except for the LoS DLC). I love Iga's take on Castlevania, but, despite some major flaws in these games, I've come to love this take as well.

I'm interested to see how much (or little) they fill in gaps as far as the traditional "cycle of Castlevania" (as in the castle itself), reappearing every hundred years so a Belmont could kill Dracula again and again. MoF showed the castle crumbling away to nothing, and the LoS2 dev diaries have suggested the main portion of the game takes place in the castle that has now appeared in the middle of a modern city--presumably that had been built around. The teaser at the end of vanilla-LoS1 suggested Dracula had bowed out a long time before Zobek returned; I hope they do a good job contrasting this with the insane power he once commanded--perhaps he succeeded in all but murdering every trace of the Brotherhood, minus the last of his bloodline?

In a perfect world Mercury Steam would have accepted Konami's offer to let Michiru Yamune compose the soundtrack--but minus that I'm really, really excited for LoS2.

[kiwi]

...Was that supposed to be a bump...?

...Why?

[An Irate Walrus]

Originally posted by kiwi towel:

...Was that supposed to be a bump...?

...Why?

I have my suspicions--but given my track record in discerning the intent behind posts this evening, I shall refrain from elaborating.

Suffice it to say that I hope TBAA's post was simply erroneously edited.

Edit: Because evenign =/= evening.

[SoulAssassinXT]

Castlevanica: Lords Of Shadow 2. Best.

[kiwi]

Originally posted by SoulAssassinXT:

Castlevanica: Lords Of Shadow 2. Best.

Wow.
Such Shadow.
Many Lords.
Much of.
Wow.

[Shin Dan]

Originally posted by kiwi towel:

Originally posted by SoulAssassinXT:

Castlevanica: Lords Of Shadow 2. Best.

Wow.
Such Shadow.
Many Lords.
Much of.
Wow.

Dude, mocking other steam users is NOT cool.
Edit: Quit dat.

[commander]

Just a thought, some of the sanity lost in Gabriel was probably do to a lack of sleep, from fighting armies of werewolves and undead.
Which made him have a loss in good decisions along his way, the choices he made, might have been better/well thought of, if he had got sleep.
If it could have been in between safe moments, even know he was short on time in some cases.
But just as the trailer said in the LoS 2 official story trailer, be warned.. and something about the more monsters you take on, you become one yourself. I don't remember exactly what was said, but it is actually true, the more demons you fight, the more you become one, as you lose your sanity when fighting monsters, but sometimes people don't have a choice in that category, as everyone has demons of their own, for some... those demons mean playing games ever so often and fighting and endless war. lol
But then gaming is therapy for many people, which is a good thing.
And it brings the world together.

I'll find the video later on what was said... lol
Also I have no idea why it went from dracula not sleeping and his battles to therapy... lol =)
lol Dracula therapy.

[kiwi]

Originally posted by TBAAGamer:

Originally posted by kiwi towel:

Wow.
Such Shadow.
Many Lords.
Much of.
Wow.

Dude, mocking other steam users is NOT cool.
Edit: Quit dat.

I wasn't mocking them. You don't need to start that whole lecture again. What He/She said just reminded me of doge comments is all.

[Shin Dan]

Originally posted by kiwi towel:

Originally posted by TBAAGamer:

Dude, mocking other steam users is NOT cool.
Edit: Quit dat.

I wasn't mocking them. You don't need to start that whole lecture again. What He/She said just reminded me of doge comments is all.

*looks back at comments*
Holy christmas you're right!
wow
such stupid
i am moron
need to stop drinking dew
wow

[kiwi]

Originally posted by commander:

Just a thought, some of the sanity lost in Gabriel was probably do to a lack of sleep, from fighting armies of werewolves and undead.
Which made him have a loss in good decisions along his way, the choices he made, might have been better/well thought of, if he had got sleep.
If it could have been in between safe moments, even know he was short on time in some cases.
But just as the trailer said in the LoS 2 official story trailer, be warned.. and something about the more monsters you take on, you become one yourself. I don't remember exactly what was said, but it is actually true, the more demons you fight, the more you become one, as you lose your sanity when fighting monsters, but sometimes people don't have a choice in that category, as everyone has demons of their own, for some... those demons mean playing games ever so often and fighting and endless war. lol
But then gaming is therapy for many people, which is a good thing.
And it brings the world together.

I'll find the video later on what was said... lol
Also I have no idea why it went from dracula not sleeping and his battles to therapy... lol =)
lol Dracula therapy.

Nah I sincerely doubt it's about lack of sleep. I believe it has more to do with how black he began to see the world the more he interacted with it's darker aspects (I.E monsters) it's kind of like that old saying; "Stare into the abyss and it stares back into you" or "Eventually after a while of staring into the pit you become just as black." It also had to do with his motives. At the end of the game he quite literally had nothing left to live for. That entire quest that brought him so much misery turned out to be yet another manipulation, followed by the fact that it was revealed that he killed his own wife, and that there was no resurrection and she would leave him behind. He saves the world, TWICE and still he is used and betrayed by everybody. He was used by the brotherhood who hid the existence of his own son and later sent him to kill him, he was used by zobek who forced him to kill his wife and lied to him the entire time, he was used by laura who tricked him into becoming a vampire and freeing her from the curse of immortality. Really, I find Gabriel's cruelty as Dracula perfectly normal. He fought monsters for the benefit of all but himself only to have the one thing in the world he wanted taken from him and later becoming a monster himself. He saw first-hand how cruel and vile the world was and thus wanted to remake it, albeit from his own perspective. Gabriel Belmont died when Marie ascended to Heaven without him. It's like he says in the trailer; he is the Dragon now...

[kiwi]

It's also suggested that Gabriel really is gone, that the Dracula we see now is his Lord of Shadow and his good half ascended to Heaven when he killed Satan

[Shin Dan]

Originally posted by kiwi towel:

It's also suggested that Gabriel really is gone, that the Dracula we see now is his Lord of Shadow and his good half ascended to Heaven when he killed Satan

Clearly, somebody hasn't finished the terribad DLC otherwise you would not have made that assumption.
Edit: Actually, I also covered this in my post. he became a vampire due to laura.
another thing as well, gabriel did not ascend to heaven via the ritual, though the theory is popular, he was still a good guy greg during the events of reverie, so much so that he sacrificed the remainder of his humanity just to save a world he no longer cared about.
The vampirism pretty much stamped out what was left of his good side, but it's still there, his love for his son pretty much proved that one in mirror of fate.

[commander]

Originally posted by kiwi towel:

Originally posted by commander:

Just a thought, some of the sanity lost in Gabriel was probably do to a lack of sleep, from fighting armies of werewolves and undead.
Which made him have a loss in good decisions along his way, the choices he made, might have been better/well thought of, if he had got sleep.
If it could have been in between safe moments, even know he was short on time in some cases.
But just as the trailer said in the LoS 2 official story trailer, be warned.. and something about the more monsters you take on, you become one yourself. I don't remember exactly what was said, but it is actually true, the more demons you fight, the more you become one, as you lose your sanity when fighting monsters, but sometimes people don't have a choice in that category, as everyone has demons of their own, for some... those demons mean playing games ever so often and fighting and endless war. lol
But then gaming is therapy for many people, which is a good thing.
And it brings the world together.

I'll find the video later on what was said... lol
Also I have no idea why it went from dracula not sleeping and his battles to therapy... lol =)
lol Dracula therapy.

Nah I sincerely doubt it's about lack of sleep. I believe it has more to do with how black he began to see the world the more he interacted with it's darker aspects (I.E monsters) it's kind of like that old saying; "Stare into the abyss and it stares back into you" or "Eventually after a while of staring into the pit you become just as black." It also had to do with his motives. At the end of the game he quite literally had nothing left to live for. That entire quest that brought him so much misery turned out to be yet another manipulation, followed by the fact that it was revealed that he killed his own wife, and that there was no resurrection and she would leave him behind. He saves the world, TWICE and still he is used and betrayed by everybody. He was used by the brotherhood who hid the existence of his own son and later sent him to kill him, he was used by zobek who forced him to kill his wife and lied to him the entire time, he was used by laura who tricked him into becoming a vampire and freeing her from the curse of immortality. Really, I find Gabriel's cruelty as Dracula perfectly normal. He fought monsters for the benefit of all but himself only to have the one thing in the world he wanted taken from him and later becoming a monster himself. He saw first-hand how cruel and vile the world was and thus wanted to remake it, albeit from his own perspective. Gabriel Belmont died when Marie ascended to Heaven without him. It's like he says in the trailer; he is the Dragon now...

Oh I know he missed his wife very much when she went to heaven without him, I'm just saying along the way when he was still feeling strong but nieve about the situation, he was feeling betrayed later as well as along his path, he lost some sanity from lack of sleep and what he was going through, such as missing his wife, and alot of other aspects.

But you are right though, he said he is the Dragon now, as he can't take back the pain of the burdains on his shoulders from what he has done just to try and get his wife back, and how he grew doubt and despair over finding out he couldn't get her back as well, so much of this took him down over time, and so much pain has lead him to the wrong direction, he held off on it for so long during his path, and ended up becoming the prince of darkness, but this is only one thing, he has gone through so much as you explained as well.

You are right though, he wanted to help everyone and had to fight off alot of monsters just to save the world, although in the LoS 2 trailer, it does say something about beware, for he who fights monsters, will become one himself, this means that sanity is lost slowly over time, and he was mainly wanting to find a way to get his wife back, but he did this for both reasons, which is understandable in the old classic castlevania games as well.

And I know that I am not covering everything, I am aware of that. =P
There is alot to think about, I just don't want to post it.