Tank that can penetrate Panther's Frontal armor

[Communist Flandre ☭]

I just wanted to share a little suggestion here, oh and im not whining about how tough Panther's frontal armor cuz i like it and because it's REALLY that tough

But still it's gun is outmatching those Shermans and all T-34 Variants, so a little suggestion: Add a tank that has the same armor as the Panther and same Power of it's gun on both Soviet and America,There's a lot of medium tanks out there to add :P, that will surely solve anything, including all those still whining about Panthers.

[Boink]

Don't hit the turret or the upper armor hit the low frontal armor. It is hard to do though when fighting from a far and when projectiles starts to curve but it can be done.

[PhoenixWing101]

Problem - what Medium tanks are there, historically, with similar armour to the Panther and similar guns? The Panther weighed 45 tonnes more than most Medium Tanks and similar to a lot of Heavy Tanks, like the Russian KV-1 and IS-2, both at around 45 tonnes. The devs can't (and won't) just invent a tank to match the Panther.

[⚡️Andromache⚡™]

Rule of thumb: never go frontal with any kind of tank (unless it is by accident. lol). So,
if I see your tank, you'll never get the chance to see me. By that, there is no need to recommend or suggest a tank that can go frontal with your panther. It is very easy to take down.

[Crazysoldier]

The only thing during the war that would remotely come close to the Panther in terms of being a medium tank is the Pershing, yet it was only re-designated from a Heavy Tank ot a Medium Tank after the war. Aside from that, the Panther was built to be the "perfect" medium tank and no nation really came up with anything new when it came to medium tanks.

The Russians stuck with their T-34s, but the 85mm gun is good enough to counter the Panther. Same goes for the American E8. Both the T-34-85 and the E8 does more damage than the Panther, which often needs 3 penetrating hits to kill, while it only takes 2 penetrating hits to take it down. So it has armour but it lacks in firepower.

[Dutch Plan Der Linde]

Originally posted by Crazysoldier:

The only thing during the war that would remotely come close to the Panther in terms of being a medium tank is the Pershing, yet it was only re-designated from a Heavy Tank ot a Medium Tank after the war. Aside from that, the Panther was built to be the "perfect" medium tank and no nation really came up with anything new when it came to medium tanks.

The Russians stuck with their T-34s, but the 85mm gun is good enough to counter the Panther. Same goes for the American E8. Both the T-34-85 and the E8 does more damage than the Panther, which often needs 3 penetrating hits to kill, while it only takes 2 penetrating hits to take it down. So it has armour but it lacks in firepower.

you forgot about e2 sherman jumbo armed with a 76 and mounted extra frontal armour able to bounce tiger and panther shots.

[Crazysoldier]

Originally posted by Tommy Slinger:

Originally posted by Crazysoldier:

The only thing during the war that would remotely come close to the Panther in terms of being a medium tank is the Pershing, yet it was only re-designated from a Heavy Tank ot a Medium Tank after the war. Aside from that, the Panther was built to be the "perfect" medium tank and no nation really came up with anything new when it came to medium tanks.

The Russians stuck with their T-34s, but the 85mm gun is good enough to counter the Panther. Same goes for the American E8. Both the T-34-85 and the E8 does more damage than the Panther, which often needs 3 penetrating hits to kill, while it only takes 2 penetrating hits to take it down. So it has armour but it lacks in firepower.

you forgot about e2 sherman jumbo armed with a 76 and mounted extra frontal armour able to bounce tiger and panther shots.

Yeah but it's considered a heavy tank and not a medium tank, but even then its armour isn't quite enough to stop the Panther. While it's armour is good, heck nearly 180mms thick turret armour it still won't stop a Panther shell, especially not an APCR one. But then again, Reto's way of doing numbers with any of the rounds in game are... Weird, to say the least.

[PhoenixWing101]

Originally posted by Crazysoldier:

Originally posted by Tommy Slinger:

you forgot about e2 sherman jumbo armed with a 76 and mounted extra frontal armour able to bounce tiger and panther shots.

Yeah but it's considered a heavy tank and not a medium tank, but even then its armour isn't quite enough to stop the Panther. While it's armour is good, heck nearly 180mms thick turret armour it still won't stop a Panther shell, especially not an APCR one. But then again, Reto's way of doing numbers with any of the rounds in game are... Weird, to say the least.

Found here that the Sherman Jumbo weighed approximately 38 tonnes, whereas the Panther, another Medium Tank, weighed around 44 tonnes. So, the E2 is definitely a Medium - a Heavy Medium but a Medium nonetheless.

It would share the same frontal weakspots as the Panther - commander's hatch, machinegun port and lower plate, with the upper plate being vulnerable if you can fire down onto it. Also, it would be much slower and less maneuverable, comparable to a Pershing due to the extra armour, but against Heavies it would struggle a lot, possibly more than the E8 due to it being less mobile.

It's a possibility at best.

[Crazysoldier]

Originally posted by TheWingedKuriboh:

Originally posted by Crazysoldier:

Yeah but it's considered a heavy tank and not a medium tank, but even then its armour isn't quite enough to stop the Panther. While it's armour is good, heck nearly 180mms thick turret armour it still won't stop a Panther shell, especially not an APCR one. But then again, Reto's way of doing numbers with any of the rounds in game are... Weird, to say the least.

Found here that the Sherman Jumbo weighed approximately 38 tonnes, whereas the Panther, another Medium Tank, weighed around 44 tonnes. So, the E2 is definitely a Medium - a Heavy Medium but a Medium nonetheless.

It would share the same frontal weakspots as the Panther - commander's hatch, machinegun port and lower plate, with the upper plate being vulnerable if you can fire down onto it. Also, it would be much slower and less maneuverable, comparable to a Pershing due to the extra armour, but against Heavies it would struggle a lot, possibly more than the E8 due to it being less mobile.

It's a possibility at best.

Well that is very true yes. But then again, what about the Soviets? I am unsure of the penetrating capabilites of the 85mm gun on the T-34-85, but I know that the armour will be inferior to both tanks. But we must not forget that the Jumbo can, potentially, have the same gun as the E8. But this still makes the Panther the best armour wise of the 3 tanks, since the Panther can and should go through both the turret armour and frontal armour somewaht decently. At least with APCR.

[PhoenixWing101]

Originally posted by Crazysoldier:

Originally posted by TheWingedKuriboh:

Found here that the Sherman Jumbo weighed approximately 38 tonnes, whereas the Panther, another Medium Tank, weighed around 44 tonnes. So, the E2 is definitely a Medium - a Heavy Medium but a Medium nonetheless.

It would share the same frontal weakspots as the Panther - commander's hatch, machinegun port and lower plate, with the upper plate being vulnerable if you can fire down onto it. Also, it would be much slower and less maneuverable, comparable to a Pershing due to the extra armour, but against Heavies it would struggle a lot, possibly more than the E8 due to it being less mobile.

It's a possibility at best.

Well that is very true yes. But then again, what about the Soviets? I am unsure of the penetrating capabilites of the 85mm gun on the T-34-85, but I know that the armour will be inferior to both tanks. But we must not forget that the Jumbo can, potentially, have the same gun as the E8. But this still makes the Panther the best armour wise of the 3 tanks, since the Panther can and should go through both the turret armour and frontal armour somewaht decently. At least with APCR.

The armour penetration values of the Panther has been considerably nerfed compared to real life - with APCR it should go through the mantlet of an E8 or T-34-85. which it doesn't.

As for the Soviets, I don't know. Possibly use the T-44?

[Viur]

The Germans suffered from medium tank imballance since release. The PzIV simply wasn't a match for E8s. With the Bauer update, they finally got a tank that is on par with the T34-85 and the Sherman E8. It's frontal aromor is strong but not impenetrable. Every medium tank can penetrade its lower glacis and the commanders cupola on the turret, even light tanks can get through these weakspots. The high tier mediums can penetrate a Panthers turret cheeks and TDs like the M18 go through the mantlet.
As far as the 75 mm cannon goes, it's high velocity makes it good for long range shots but due to it's small caliber it deals less damage than the US 76 mm or the Soviet 85 mm. In fact, German medium tanks usually take 3 hits to destroy other mediums (with the exception of the PzIII). Sometimes a Panther gets a lucky roll and blows up a tank with the second shot but the other factions high tier mediums get 2 shot kills much more reliable.
The upper glacis is only 80 mm thick. It's sloped to increase its effective thickness but from the right angle a tank shell should go through. Try to engage Panthers from a hill and you should be able to penetrate it anywhere (at least in theory). But as others already mentioned, you should always try to get around enemy tanks and shootthem in their weak side or rear armor. When up against a Panther, aim for its hull. The turret can be angeled to bounce shots even from the sides.

Sorry for this wall of text but I'm sick of all those OP threads lately. In fact, medium tanks are pretty well balanced. E8s have a very strong frontal armor that can bounce Panther shots if angled right. T34-85 has a big cannon that can kill apcs and other armored infantry or recon vehicles in one shot and it always destroys mediums with two successfull penetrations. The Pathers biggest strenght is its frontal armor and high velocity cannon that makes it an excellent sniper tank.

[PhoenixWing101]

Originally posted by Nephilim:

The Germans suffered from medium tank imballance since release. The PzIV simply wasn't a match for E8s. With the Bauer update, they finally got a tank that is on par with the T34-85 and the Sherman E8. It's frontal aromor is strong but not impenetrable. Every medium tank can penetrade its lower glacis and the commanders cupola on the turret, even light tanks can get through these weakspots. The high tier mediums can penetrate a Panthers turret cheeks and TDs like the M18 go through the mantlet.
As far as the 75 mm cannon goes, it's high velocity makes it good for long range shots but due to it's small caliber it deals less damage than the US 76 mm or the Soviet 85 mm. In fact, German medium tanks usually take 3 hits to destroy other mediums (with the exception of the PzIII). Sometimes a Panther gets a lucky roll and blows up a tank with the second shot but the other factions high tier mediums get 2 shot kills much more reliable.
The upper glacis is only 80 mm thick. It's sloped to increase its effective thickness but from the right angle a tank shell should go through. Try to engage Panthers from a hill and you should be able to penetrate it anywhere (at least in theory). But as others already mentioned, you should always try to get around enemy tanks and shootthem in their weak side or rear armor. When up against a Panther, aim for its hull. The turret can be angeled to bounce shots even from the sides.

Sorry for this wall of text but I'm sick of all those xxx OP threads lately. In fact, medium tanks are pretty well balanced. E8s have a very strong frontal armor that can bounce Panther shots if angled right. T34-85 has a big cannon that can kill apcs and other armored infantry or recon vehicles in one shot and it always destroys mediums with two successfull penetrations. The Pathers biggest strenght is its frontal armor and high velocity cannon that makes it an excellent sniper tank.

Panther isn't OP. Strong, yes, especially when hull-down, but not overpowered. If the only allied Mediums were the T-34-76 and M3/M4A1 then yes, but the E8 and -85 are very good also, and do more damage if they penetrate. The main thing is that the Panther's upper plater is almost impervious to fire, whilst the E8 and 85's upper plates can be penetrated relatively easily, especially with APCR, which is why people want the Jumbo or T-44.

Also, since when could the Hellcat go through the mantlet?

[Viur]

Originally posted by TheWingedKuriboh:

Panther isn't OP. Strong, yes, especially when hull-down, but not overpowered. If the only allied Mediums were the T-34-76 and M3/M4A1 then yes, but the E8 and -85 are very good also, and do more damage if they penetrate. The main thing is that the Panther's upper plater is almost impervious to fire, whilst the E8 and 85's upper plates can be penetrated relatively easily, especially with APCR, which is why people want the Jumbo or T-44.

Also, since when could the Hellcat go through the mantlet?

Hellcat + APCR can get through the mantlet. I haven't tested it out but I saw it on one life stream from Kotton. I do own a Hellcat with APCR and I will test it myself the next time I play with it to confirm it.
And as far as the T-44 goes, it never saw combat and only about 150 were produced during WWII so it's unlikely that it gets added. And the Jumbo Sherman is classified as a heavy tank.

Update: I tried it right now and I could not penetrate its mantlet so maybe its some randomness involved or the mantlet has some weakspot I don't know as I have seen KottonGamer penetrating a Panther through its mantlet from point blank range with his hellcat.

[PhoenixWing101]

Originally posted by Nephilim:

Originally posted by TheWingedKuriboh:

Panther isn't OP. Strong, yes, especially when hull-down, but not overpowered. If the only allied Mediums were the T-34-76 and M3/M4A1 then yes, but the E8 and -85 are very good also, and do more damage if they penetrate. The main thing is that the Panther's upper plater is almost impervious to fire, whilst the E8 and 85's upper plates can be penetrated relatively easily, especially with APCR, which is why people want the Jumbo or T-44.

Also, since when could the Hellcat go through the mantlet?

Hellcat + APCR can get through the mantlet. I haven't tested it out but I saw it on one life stream from Kotton. I do own a Hellcat with APCR and I will test it myself the next time I play with it to confirm it.
And as far as the T-44 goes, it never saw combat and only about 150 were produced during WWII so it's unlikely that it gets added. And the Jumbo Sherman is classified as a heavy tank.

Update: I tried it right now and I could not penetrate its mantlet so maybe its some randomness involved or the mantlet has some weakspot I don't know as I have seen KottonGamer penetrating a Panther through its mantlet from point blank range with his hellcat.

It might be a 1 in a large number chance of it penetrating the mantlet.

For the T-44, it would be the only Medium from WWII with good enough frontal armour and a good enough gun to be equivalent to the Panther. The devs have added in several rare weapons/vehicles - the M2A2, for example, which was never used in combat, like the T-44.

And where does it say the E2 Sherman is a Heavy Tank?

[Madhir Fakhr]

Originally posted by Jamie:

I just wanted to share a little suggestion here, oh and im not whining about how tough Panther's frontal armor cuz i like it and because it's REALLY that tough

But still it's gun is outmatching those Shermans and all T-34 Variants, so a little suggestion: Add a tank that has the same armor as the Panther and same Power of it's gun on both Soviet and America,There's a lot of medium tanks out there to add :P, that will surely solve anything, including all those still whining about Panthers.

m36 jackson for US, that TD can penetrate panther frontally

[Sir Whiskers]

Originally posted by Noob™:

Originally posted by Jamie:

I just wanted to share a little suggestion here, oh and im not whining about how tough Panther's frontal armor cuz i like it and because it's REALLY that tough

But still it's gun is outmatching those Shermans and all T-34 Variants, so a little suggestion: Add a tank that has the same armor as the Panther and same Power of it's gun on both Soviet and America,There's a lot of medium tanks out there to add :P, that will surely solve anything, including all those still whining about Panthers.

m36 jackson for US, that TD can penetrate panther frontally

No. 90mm gun. No.