Kerbal Space Program

Kerbal Space Program

Pyrrhic 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 10:23
How to build a decent craft?
Hey guys, I've been playing this game for a few weeks now, and I have yet to build a craft that can reach the mun without making it in sandbox, and making it rediculously huge. What am I doing wrong? Is there a better way to get things to the mun?
< >
目前顯示第 1-15 則留言,共 36
strask 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 10:27 
Can you post a couple screenshots of your recent attempts? That would help us figure out what you are doing wrong. There are a LOT of possible causes for having trouble, as it's a complex problem.

Also there is no shame in starting in Sandbox if that's easier for you, whatever game mode feels best for you is the right one.
Nooblets 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 10:31 
Try this it will and just scale the parts up ;)
http://youtu.be/2JLR5dELZl4
SievertChaser 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 10:32 
Yes, please just be specific in your complaints. Off the top of my head I can guess you're either bad at gravity turns, or use the authentic tandem staging of Saturn V (the worst thing you could do in KSP), or don't like to rendezvous in Munar orbit.
Pyrrhic 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 10:52 
This is the rocket I've been using. By the end of the 2nd stage I can have it in orbit. That leaves 2 more stages for it to zip around...I can make it to the mun but never land, and I'm also very near to out of fuel.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=398813313

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=398813412

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=398813583

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=398813773
Camulorix 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 10:53 
You could try something like this:
http://youtu.be/QI-b5OdRxmA

And this might help you too:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYu7z3I8tdEmqpOkQZCl5SZB5t0vXuxE0

Edit: Your rocket is far too big. Each ton of weight you add, you need far more fuel to get it up there. Here's a "map" for dV you need to reach certain bodys:
http://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/wiki/File:KerbinDeltaVMap.png
最後修改者:Camulorix; 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 10:55
hipno 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 10:56 
This should get you to mun (or minmus, which is easier to land on):
Stage 1: Jet Engines, mk1 fusalarge intake, with xm-g50 intakes around it, conected to main craft with fuel lines
2: skipper enguine, rokomax x200 tank
3: LV T45, fl-T8-- tank
4: nuke enguine, fl-t8 tank
5: LV909 enguine, Fl200 tanks
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=398813870
strask 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 11:13 
Wow, Zenon, you weren't kidding when you said it was big. :KSmiley:

Ok, here's what I suggest.

1) Start by using the "Kerbal X" stock rocket, just hit "load" in the vehicle assembly building and select it.

2) Try flying that until you can get it to minmus and land (minmus is far easier to land on than mun).

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=355387998

3) I'm not certain but I think the same rocket is capable of a Mun landing.

4) Once you have some practice under your belt, try making a similar rocket but designed for just one kerbal instead of three. By removing weight from the top, you can make the whole thing smaller. See how small you can get it while still having enough fuel to go to Mun and/or Minmus.

Keep posting here to let us know how you are doing!
St3amfails 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 11:20 
smaller is almost always better man. Overengineering makes it harder, not easier to get to the mun. As stated, after a certain point, you are just adding more weight to lift unnecessary weight.

There is no actual need to achieve Kerbin orbit unless the mun is badly out of optimal position.

Try this a time or two to get a feel for what you need to do -
Start with the mun at about 3 ockock to you. Fly straight up, letting your flight path follow its natural inclination along the 90 degree line and you should reach 12 oclock in the muns orbital path at almost exactly the same time it does. This method is almost fool proof and requires suprisingly little fuel and little to no manuevering. It also has the added advantage, since your AP is very near the mun and on a relatively up and down flight path, of having you intercept with little or no momentum, meaning less wasted fuel in killing velocity.
Note, this isn't the most efficient way to reach a specific location on the mun, but it is the easiest way to simply land/return for someone who has never done it before.

If you don't have enough fuel, don't add more. Strip parts off. Its counterintuitive that smaller goes farther, but less weight while sitting on the ground means exponentially less fuel needed in space. To be honest, a quick glance looks to me like the part of your design above the orange tanks would be enough all by itself. Slide those solid fuel trash cans up there and you would almost definitely be good, especially if you used a lighter cockpit.
As Hipno said, Minmus is actually easier to land/return than the mun, but its a little harder to hit if you are still working out rendevous, basic design, etc.
最後修改者:St3amfails; 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 11:29
Keeper of the Groove 2015 年 2 月 25 日 下午 1:08 
引用自 Zenon
This is the rocket I've been using. By the end of the 2nd stage I can have it in orbit. That leaves 2 more stages for it to zip around...I can make it to the mun but never land, and I'm also very near to out of fuel.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=398813313

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=398813412

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=398813583

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=398813773

jezus christ that is huge.

try to keep it much more simple. just place a medium fuel tank with a small engine below your capsule and place a decoupler beneath it. then at that decoupler you attach1.5/2 longer fuel tanks with a bigger engine. then on the sides of these longer fuel tanks you can either attach solid fuel boosters or liquid fuel enginges with which you might want to use onion staging.

but the thing is you most likely tried this already but you probably just totally suck at setting a proper course for your rocket. what you probably do is just keep the rocket pointed straight up for the entire time and fire up all your fuel, which should obviously be quite rediculous. you gotta watch vids of scott manley hes a great teacher on ksp. i dont rly want to explain it all lol, but u just gotta make the gravity turn and then burn prograde once you reach your apoapsis which should then be at around 80-120 thousand km if im correct
SievertChaser 2015 年 2 月 25 日 下午 1:24 
It's completely possible to do Apollo recreations (i.e. three-seat ship, two-seat lander, albeit single-staged - gonna rectify that next time - all 2.5 m, plus rover, and a fully functional Escape System tower) while using a single three-stage stack with a quad engine at the bottom, and still have fuel to burn.

Here's Manley doing that, except his launcher is a bit like a Proton instead because he's been doing it since before 3.75s:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdtpfushCr4
最後修改者:SievertChaser; 2015 年 2 月 25 日 下午 1:33
Dandyman 2015 年 2 月 25 日 下午 1:56 
引用自 dennis.danilov
It's completely possible to do Apollo recreations (i.e. three-seat ship, two-seat lander, albeit single-staged - gonna rectify that next time - all 2.5 m, plus rover, and a fully functional Escape System tower) while using a single three-stage stack with a quad engine at the bottom, and still have fuel to burn.

Here's Manley doing that, except his launcher is a bit like a Proton instead because he's been doing it since before 3.75s:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdtpfushCr4
Something like this? Simple and easy to fly and build yourself. Completely beginner friendly with deltaV to spare for launch and orbit. Lander over built with extra deltaV as well. Uses two stage design to dock with command module.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=362895814
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=362896258
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=362892295
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=362891947
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=362891753
And an older version before the recent parts additions.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=194265495
Yawzheek 2015 年 2 月 25 日 下午 2:38 
That is a ridiculously overly complicated rocket. It's nothing against you, but everything about that is very, very poorly designed.

May I offer you a bit of advice that I learned the hard way that helped me greatly? Too bad; doing it anyway:

When you build your rocket, try to think of the stages for utility purposes. By that I mean, "what do I want/need to accomplish at this stage of my rocket?" And by THAT I mean, "What function is THIS particular stage supposed to accomplish?"

Planning is the first thing you need to do, so ask yourself (assuming you're not in full career mode and can ignore cost/technology): what do I need to do to accomplish my Mun landing? I need to:

Achieve orbit
Transfer to the Mun
Orbit the Mun
Land on the Mun
Escape the Mun, and land back on Kerbin

No specifics are really needed when you sit down and think about this. First step is achieving orbit, so you're likely to want a nice solid fuel stage to gain you some altitude before you jettison it for liquid fuel to hit achieve that goal.

The second step is transferring. The hope is you'll only be 2-3 stages in at this point on your initial orbit stage, so you may utilize the same stage to begin your transfer, and hopefully get it by then. Ideally, you don't want to jettison a stage mid maneuver, because more than likely you'll be using a different engine with different thrust values, but sometimes you must. Work with what you have.

At this point, you'll want to think about achieving your Mun orbit, because the other alternative is slamming directly into it. In KSP, it can probably work, but... I wouldn't recommend it. Luckily it's not too fuel-intensive to do, assuming you set up your transfer even half well. Tip: approaching from behind, while not always possible with the nodes available, is generally the best approach.

After that is the critical moments: landing on the Mun, and LEAVING the Mun. Plan well for this stage, since anyone can land on the Mun, but landing on it and RETURNING will likely be the most fuel intensive aspect outside of orbit. This is the part where you probably should overcompensate (just a bit,) because as I'm sure you know, you can't simply deploy a parachute, plant a flag, and fly away. You need to land, which will cost quite a bit of fuel, and you need to (probably) orbit the Mun again, then transfer back to Kerbin, which will also cost quite a bit of fuel. Nobody wants to strand a Kerbal on the Mun.

That's the basics, which are also the fundamentals for design: build your ship according to what you need/want it to do when you need/want it to do it. With Kerbal Engineer it becomes ridiculously simple to plan these stages out, and I would highly advise you use it it tandem with the Wiki. Overcompensate a bit (10% was the standard I was always told) with fuel/velocity, and you should probably double that for a first Mun landing to ensure success.

You can do this. Just remember: bigger isn't always (and often isn't) better. You WANT to jettison stages when you can, since the mass of the ship (under atmospheric conditions) will likely only hinder you severely, and also make for an incredibly poorly responsive ship. The LV-909 is your best friend when you achieve orbit, because you don't need extreme amounts of thrust when you're operating under Newton's first law, and I would highly recommend those weak but extremely powerful rockets for everything outside an atmospheric planet: they're very efficient for the cost, and much easier to fine tune.
The_Mell 2015 年 2 月 25 日 下午 3:37 
引用自 Stalinator
Planning is the first thing you need to do, so ask yourself (assuming you're not in full career mode and can ignore cost/technology): what do I need to do to accomplish my Mun landing? I need to:

Achieve orbit
Transfer to the Mun
Orbit the Mun
Land on the Mun
Escape the Mun, and land back on Kerbin
Yes, planning is an important thing even though there are different approaches to it.

I for example tend to start at the end. I build a lander and test it on Kerbin making several thousand meter of altitude. It's overpowered for Mun but thats ok and i know that it works. The extra power can be used for return.
Then i think of a transfer stage to bring it from Kerbin orbit to Mun orbit. One 800er and a LV-N should do the job for a 1 Kerbal lander.
Those things need a lifter which have 2 parts, one to bring it into a stable orbit and the launch stage to get it moving up to around 10km.
Result: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=335520485
And if something doesn't work out go back and change if possible only the part/stage of your rocket that failed. (Of course, if upper stages grow signifcantly, lower stages might compensate that extra weight.)

Overall:
Think small!

A small lander means a lot smaller rocket overall. My first Mun landing was done by a little rover in a box.
Empiro 2015 年 2 月 25 日 下午 4:15 
There are many things that can be going wrong: design, and piloting.

Download the Kerbal Engineer mod (http://www.curse.com/ksp-mods/kerbal/222685-kerbal-engineer-redux-v1-0). This gives you vital statistics on things like delta-V and TWR, and will allow us to give you suggestions on how to improve your design.

In flight, Kerbal Engineer also gives you remaining Delta-V, which lets you discover at what part of your flight are you wasting fuel.

My general design advice: start from your final stage. Decide what that stage should do (e.g. land and then take off from the Mun, and return home), and design it, keeping it as small as possible. Then design the stage above it (e.g. transfer to the Mun and start the de-orbit burn), and go from there.
最後修改者:Empiro; 2015 年 2 月 25 日 下午 4:18
Camulorix 2015 年 2 月 25 日 下午 4:18 
引用自 Empiro
There are many things that can be going wrong: design, and piloting.

Download the Kerbal Engineer mod (http://www.curse.com/ksp-mods/kerbal/222685-kerbal-engineer-redux-v1-0). This gives you vital statistics on things like delta-V and TWR, and will allow us to give you suggestions on how to improve your design.

In flight, Kerbal Engineer also gives you remaining Delta-V, which lets you discover at what part of your flight are you wasting fuel.

He has MechJeb installed. I think it shows these information too.
But I also prefer Kerbal Engineer because then I don't tend to click only a few buttons to do all the hard work, like intercepting and docking :Khappy:
< >
目前顯示第 1-15 則留言,共 36
每頁顯示: 1530 50

張貼日期: 2015 年 2 月 25 日 上午 10:23
回覆: 36