Future Propulsion

[FurioRosso]

i dont really follow the news from the devs much but does anyone know if there is any mention of future propulsion technologies in the works for future DLC/updates?

the ion propulsion we already have in game is pretty much useless even for small probes as theyre so weak theyre not worth using, and many of the mods on curseforge are needing updates badly (i think the mod creators are burning out now and wont be long before theyre completely unsupported), or other mods for alternate types of propulsion add-in way too many other parts i just dont need/want to use, or they just look bad and buggy

just seems insane that after all this time KSP was released, the only form of propulsion other than standard rockets and jets is ONE tiny little ion engine thats practically useless

[desrtfox071]

Ironically, the ion engines are much more powerful than their real life counterparts. Also, did I miss the part where KSP is described as a scifi adventure game? As far as I know, every system in KSP is, at least roughly, based on a real world example.

Maybe look at the Mod Near Future Propulsion. Also, for the mods that add "too much stuff", you can just choose to not use the stuff you don't want.

[XLjedi]

I would enthusiastically support a sci-fi DLC with new airplane/helo and spaceplane parts!

I never thought I'd see propellers, rotors, and robotics in a stock DLC. ...but there they are!

[FurioRosso]

Originally posted by desrtfox071:

Ironically, the ion engines are much more powerful than their real life counterparts. Also, did I miss the part where KSP is described as a scifi adventure game? As far as I know, every system in KSP is, at least roughly, based on a real world example.

Maybe look at the Mod Near Future Propulsion. Also, for the mods that add "too much stuff", you can just choose to not use the stuff you don't want.

considering a lot of KSP's content is tweaked to make the game more functional and fun im not really bothered by how realistic certain parts are to real life designs. im more interested in building more elaborate and interesting ships that arent purely rocket fuel powered.

still doesnt answer my question though and suggesting a mod ive known about since it was first uploaded is just dumb (considering i did mention mods that implement future propulsion, guess you ignored that bit)..... i wanna know if theres a vanilla developer made version of these mods in the works...

[FurioRosso]

Originally posted by XLjedi:

I would enthusiastically support a sci-fi DLC with new airplane/helo and spaceplane parts!

I never thought I'd see propellers, rotors, and robotics in a stock DLC. ...but there they are! :KSmiley:

yeah took them long enough, need some more spending money before i can get these dlc anyway, pretty overpriced if you ask me though

[desrtfox071]

Originally posted by Jaytheg0d:

Originally posted by desrtfox071:

Ironically, the ion engines are much more powerful than their real life counterparts. Also, did I miss the part where KSP is described as a scifi adventure game? As far as I know, every system in KSP is, at least roughly, based on a real world example.

Maybe look at the Mod Near Future Propulsion. Also, for the mods that add "too much stuff", you can just choose to not use the stuff you don't want.

considering a lot of KSP's content is tweaked to make the game more functional and fun im not really bothered by how realistic certain parts are to real life designs. im more interested in building more elaborate and interesting ships that arent purely rocket fuel powered.

still doesnt answer my question though and suggesting a mod ive known about since it was first uploaded is just dumb (considering i did mention mods that implement future propulsion, guess you ignored that bit)..... i wanna know if theres a vanilla developer made version of these mods in the works...

Certainly didn't ignore that bit. Considering you didn't mention any mods specifically, you could have been talking about anything, I dunno, like Interstellar perhaps.

So, Near Future propulsion adds only engines. And only near future scifi engines. To me, this sounds exactly like what you're looking for.

Also, I didn't make a comment regarding realism per se, just that every part in KSP has a real world counterpart, thus, no entirely fictional engines in KSP. I would have thought that was reasonably obvious.

Anyway, you can certainly solve your need in one of two ways: 1)Install a mod that adds the engines you like and ignore any other parts you do not. 2)Make your own mod.

[XLjedi]

Originally posted by Jaytheg0d:

Originally posted by XLjedi:

I would enthusiastically support a sci-fi DLC with new airplane/helo and spaceplane parts!

I never thought I'd see propellers, rotors, and robotics in a stock DLC. ...but there they are!

yeah took them long enough, need some more spending money before i can get these dlc anyway, pretty overpriced if you ask me though

I'd wait til they go on sale... the Making History DLC can even be skipped IMO. Just adds more rocket parts that I don't find add anything to the game. The Breaking Ground DLC adds a lot in terms of parts and robotics have been missing for too too long.

[SirBob]

Originally posted by Jaytheg0d:

i dont really follow the news from the devs much but does anyone know if there is any mention of future propulsion technologies in the works for future DLC/updates?

the ion propulsion we already have in game is pretty much useless even for small probes as theyre so weak theyre not worth using, and many of the mods on curseforge are needing updates badly (i think the mod creators are burning out now and wont be long before theyre completely unsupported), or other mods for alternate types of propulsion add-in way too many other parts i just dont need/want to use, or they just look bad and buggy

just seems insane that after all this time KSP was released, the only form of propulsion other than standard rockets and jets is ONE tiny little ion engine thats practically useless

I think its meant to be mildly realistic. Everything in the game is moddled on something that exists in real life (Well other than the nuclear engine, russian news claimed they built a submarine with a nuclear engine but it hasnt really been confirmed, other than that lock heed martin has made some prototypes but they were all way to heavy to be used in reality). What you are proposing I assume is things that dont exist in reality.

Honestly, I like it being grounded in fact and not science fiction, what exactly would you propose which isnt in the game? Anything else would be way to cheesy like most science fiction. Like there really arnt any other propulsion technologies that exist in reality, unless your thinking of something like solar sails, though I really dont know how that would be moddled in game since an object under acceleration cant be sped up very much.

[Azunai]

the nerv nuclear engine and whiplash/rapier ramjets are already a bit of a stretch to be honest. we don't actually have that sort of stuff IRL.

the nuclear engines we have are already kinda OP and trivialize a lot of content that would be a decent challenge. add more sci-fi technology and it will likely remove the challenge of interplanetary space travel altogether.

[Effixel]

I think that the mod OP is looking for is called Elite Dangerous

[Chibbity]

I stopped taking the OP seriously when he said the ion engine is useless.

Rofl.

[FurioRosso]

Originally posted by Chibbity:

I stopped taking the OP seriously when he said the ion engine is useless.

Rofl.

it is when it comes to building certain ships that require more powerful/larger engines using alternate fuel sources... and my point im trying to make is that we're restricted to using just one tiny ion engine using xenon gas only, no hydrogen, argon, laser etc. propulsion systems... cos you know, some of us dont play the game in the same way YOU do....

and if this is gonna be your comment... just scroll on by instead of needing to put in your cents for a cheap laugh....

Originally posted by Azunai:

the nerv nuclear engine and whiplash/rapier ramjets are already a bit of a stretch to be honest. we don't actually have that sort of stuff IRL.

the nuclear engines we have are already kinda OP and trivialize a lot of content that would be a decent challenge. add more sci-fi technology and it will likely remove the challenge of interplanetary space travel altogether.

yes i am aware that what we have already is more than enough to play the game in career mode and accomplish all the contracts but thats just one way the game can played... other ppl play KSP for many different reasons not just completing the career mode using what we are currently restricted to in the current vanilla version. regardless if the ion and nuclear engines are OP and trivialise many of the contracts, many ppl like myself are more interested in building stuff and seeing what we can do with it with the game physics and mechanics. Fine yeah limit propulsion technology to current real life technology for career mode but when it comes to sandbox we should be given more content so we can build and fly/drive to our hearts content.....

i genuinely feel you lot are getting the completely wrong idea and assuming s**t thats completely irrelevant to my question.... WHICH STILL HAS NOT BEEN ANSWERED... my god... *faceplam*

[XLjedi]

Originally posted by Chibbity:

I stopped taking the OP seriously when he said the ion engine is useless.

Rofl.

It is pretty useless...

[Chibbity]

Originally posted by XLjedi:

Originally posted by Chibbity:

I stopped taking the OP seriously when he said the ion engine is useless.

Rofl.

It is pretty useless...

I can understand that it doesn't fit some players playstyle, but used correctly; it's exceptionally useful.

You can do a lot with just a little. Or if that's not good enough, bring dozens of them.

It's a niche engine sure, so are nukes; but it's far from useless.

[Chaotic Harmony]

Originally posted by Vipic:

Originally posted by Jaytheg0d:

i dont really follow the news from the devs much but does anyone know if there is any mention of future propulsion technologies in the works for future DLC/updates?

the ion propulsion we already have in game is pretty much useless even for small probes as theyre so weak theyre not worth using, and many of the mods on curseforge are needing updates badly (i think the mod creators are burning out now and wont be long before theyre completely unsupported), or other mods for alternate types of propulsion add-in way too many other parts i just dont need/want to use, or they just look bad and buggy

just seems insane that after all this time KSP was released, the only form of propulsion other than standard rockets and jets is ONE tiny little ion engine thats practically useless

I think its meant to be mildly realistic. Everything in the game is moddled on something that exists in real life (Well other than the nuclear engine, russian news claimed they built a submarine with a nuclear engine but it hasnt really been confirmed, other than that lock heed martin has made some prototypes but they were all way to heavy to be used in reality). What you are proposing I assume is things that dont exist in reality.

Honestly, I like it being grounded in fact and not science fiction, what exactly would you propose which isnt in the game? Anything else would be way to cheesy like most science fiction. Like there really arnt any other propulsion technologies that exist in reality, unless your thinking of something like solar sails, though I really dont know how that would be moddled in game since an object under acceleration cant be sped up very much.

NERVA Engines were developed, built and tested for multiple-hour durations by the United States in the 60's; with proposed upper stage upgrades for the Saturn V and Nova C-8.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NERVA

These are what the KSP nuke engines are based on.

As for limited options? I wouldn't say so; ion technology has come a long way since Dawn. There could be 2 more ion engines representing these platforms; then you could literally throw a bunch of extent engine designs in a hat and pick several.

But tbh i think KSP stock is fine; if you want more than the base game offers then it's rather trivial to find mods which add exactly what you're wanting.

[XLjedi]

Originally posted by Chaotic Harmony:

But tbh i think KSP stock is fine; if you want more than the base game offers then it's rather trivial to find mods which add exactly what you're wanting.

I won't touch mods related to parts or changes to stock physics/aerodynamics.

As for interplanetary drives for larger-sized craft...

The ion engines are useless. Even if they could be grouped together for a 16-32 cluster ion drive (which I've done) they still don't produce enough thrust to do anything significant. They also have no ISRU option for refueling xenon gas. So they're pretty much a slave to kerbin. If they did have sufficient thrust, I wouldn't mind this though. The thought of deploying an SSTO with a fresh xenon fuel core for an ion drive ship in LKO would be pretty cool. Provided the ion-drive orbital command vessel had enough xenon on board for round trips to the furthest planet/moons.

I've tried em though, they don't really work for larger ships. I think I had a cluster of like 4 or 5 of these things on one ship, just to see what if anything it could actually do.
http://xl-logic.com/KSP/craft/screenshots/Ion_Drive.jpg
Then at some point, you add 100 of these things to a design and the kraken comes calling on the part count.

Nuke engines are probably the most viable right now. The Wolfhounds were pretty good there for a bit with like 400+ ISP. Alas... the community whined about some inconsistencies and they got nerfed. Now it's OK, if not a bit mediocre and we don't have any higher thrust engine above 380 ISP. So nukes are pretty much it. I use em... It's just annoying at times waiting on that orbital arc to grow. The wolfhound let me just "punch-it" there for a bit to get from planet to planet with a pretty decent sized ship.

If any of you actually have some larger-sized ship designs that run on Ion engines, I'd love to see them. If you're response is, "Meh, not my play style" then just stay off the thread.

I use ion drives for fire-and-forget small ordinance jobs. I made a low-grav ion lander once that could put down on the mun; but these were all dinky ships. My ion lander fits in a Mk2 cargo bay. I ultimately scrapped the ion lander for mission use in favor of a more conventional small vernier design used in the craft I posted below. This was due mostly to the lack of xenon refueling options outside of kerbin. I suspect any ion drive space tug is going to be painfully slow and easily dismissed in favor of nukes.

I've got one wolfound-based design...
https://kerbalx.com/XLjedi/OCV-101-Explorer

It was better of course pre-nerf, but I guess it's still OK. I may add a nuke-drive only space tug to my OCV line now. Would be nice to have another future propulsion DLC option that pushes maybe into the 500-ish ISP range with some decent thrust. Kinda bridging the gap between the wolfhound 380 ISP and the nuke 800 ISP.

And for a near future DLC, I have no problem with EM drives or even Alcubierre drives. I think managing the orbital mechanics of something that could move at near FTL speeds would be an interesting new challenge. You could screw up real quick and shoot yourself right out of the solar system.