Relays Not Working

[Lawh]

They worked for a while, but now it seems they don't.

I have a normal antenna, and a relay on my satellites. If I turn the antenna off, I lose control of the probe. But either way, my relays don't seem to be working.

I have two relay satellites orbiting kerbin, but still the connection is direct to kerbin rather than through the satellites. I also have three relay satellites with antennas orbiting the sun.

[Elementus]

If you have line of sight with kerbin the signal will not go to a relay

[Lawh]

Not even if the relays would make the signal better?

[Elementus]

Originally posted by Lawrence H:

Not even if the relays would make the signal better?

Very rarely, also what relay antenna are you using

[Toastie Buns]

An upgraded tracking station has 250G
The best relay has 100G

Unless you have 4 relay dishes on each relay, the signal will go directly to KSC.

However, if you use the connections tab an enable the full display, it will show you that they're connected to relays....they just won't use them, because it will dimish the return on science. You *CAN* force this, but you'll be shooting yourself in the foot.

Edit: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/152117-how-does-relay-work/

This might explain more for you.

[maj.solo]

Originally posted by Elementus:

If you have line of sight with kerbin the signal will not go to a relay

not in my relay network the signal goes to the closest relay.

[maj.solo]

Originally posted by Toastie Buns:

Unless you have 4 relay dishes on each relay, the signal will go directly to KSC.

Well I got 4 RA100 on each relay.

Anyways I am building up a relay ring at 55G and another ring at 150G. I also have overkill 4xcom88-88 on each relay. So .... it should talk to kerbin directly. Instead the signal jumps through 15 relays ... they are all on their way out to their final position but fun to see how the game engine works.... lots of bouncing throug relays.

[Toastie Buns]

It picks the best one. So if your best relay is at Jool, it'll path through that regardless. (unless blocked of course)

Edit: This is simply so you don't get 'less' science when beaming back your findings.

Double Edit: Equatorial rings are kinda silly. You want to talk around planets and since they're all mostly in the 90 degree plane, it's much better to loft them into highly elleptical polar orbits. (like Molynia orbits)

[Lawh]

So you mean 4 relay disks on a single ship?

[maj.solo]

Originally posted by Toastie Buns:

it's much better to loft them into highly elleptical polar orbits. (like Molynia orbits)

Yeah I seen that video and those diagrams. 2 relays in sharp elipses with different orbit rotated a little so their elipses are not identical to minimize the chance of a hit. Also their AP is diametrically opposite to the other satellites AP. The AP is also very very high and the relay will spend its time out there near AP most of the time.

Yeah I seen those examples and I might do it that way for a planet without a moon or for a planet with one moon. But I definitely will not do it that way for a planet with 6 moons.

For that entire system I would use only 4 relays with big ears. Cause then you place them in equatorial orbit outside the outermost moon orbiting the central planet. That way they can see the dark side of any of the moons at any time regardless of where the moons are.

If the central planet have a large SOI you can let the relays orbit even further out and might make it with 3 satellites. If the outermost moon is very near the edge of planet SOI you migh need 5 relays. And depite that there might still be a radio shadow for a short period in some situations.

I think 4 relays for the entire system in equatorial orbit is better then 2 relays in polar orbit around both the planet and the moons.

I still think 4 relays for the entire system is good enough. They can ofcourse be in polar orbit as long as they are outside the moon that is furthest out. But if they are that they could just as well be in a equatorial orbit cause nothing matters then.

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Then the ring of relays in equatorial orbit around the sun is because of the rescue kerbal missions. And you have no idea beforehand what weird orbit he will be in. If the relays are bound to planets it is possible the planets be on the other side of the sun ! compared to where he is.

And I want to be able to steer probes around in deep space where the planets >are not<. :)

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Still in the Earth system the little Voyager coasted far out and NASA had no problems hearing it AFAIK.

I hope no angry aliens come to earth asking to get paid cause they smashed into Voyager at light speed.

"A interstellar beacon is mandatory !!!!!
The instructions have been posted at your local interstellar traffic office
at Alpha centauri for the last 1 billion of your earh year for crying ut loud !!!
PAY US or ELSE !!!"

"...... what you want .... "

"125 Kg of anti-matter you fools ... that is what yo cost us!!!"

[Toastie Buns]

Nah, you're misunderstanding.

First, the relays can never hit each other. As Probe A is at apsis, Probe B is at periapsis. When Probe B hits its apsis, Probe A is at periapsis.

These probes are taken to within sneezing distance of exiting the system, their orbital speed at apsis is so low that they spend the majority of their time there, before whipping around the planet at stupid speeds and returning to the low and slow orbital speed. This way, if Probe A can't talk over things, Probe B can.

Key word here is OVER.

Now, if KSC itself can't form a direct line to let's say, Jool Probe A, then Probe A or B can. If they can, then they already have line of sight to the things that Jool Probe A and B can't see. But since Jool Probe A and B are in the same eccentric orbits as Probe A and B, they're probably able to talk over local moons to begin with, unless you're super low and obscured by said moon. Even then, you probably have LOS to Probe A and B.

Failing this, putting that very same system in place around every planet will insure that you have practically no downtime, it's so small that it's probably less than 1%. Unless you're someone who needs a 100% link at all times (which is highly, highly, highly unlikely) you can simply wait until one comes into LOS a few moments later.

Equatorial however, will be constantly out of commission thanks to moons and planets passing in front of it. You start to need ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ more relays to talk AROUND celestials.

Providing you set up something simple like this, you'll never be in a situation where you cannot talk around the sun. Eve's orbital speed is quick, Duna's slightly slower, Jool even more so. You'll always have a path around the sun for relays.

Now, let's cover inverse square and KSC being ♥♥♥♥. KSC only boasts 250G. You can match that with 4 relays on one probe, or you can double it with 8. This is a small cost to do and allows you to range much further than KSC can pull off. 8 direct antennas therefore, will then double communication range for transmitting data. You could, for all purposes, use 8 direct antennas and simply talk to KSC regardless, without a relay network at all.

Hope this was helpful/cleared things up.