How is Quake 3 Arena vs Bots still more fun than many multiplayer games

[ChubbiChibbai]

Maybe i'm biased because i played the crap out of this against bots in the days before i even had internet at home, but i picked this up in the sale with the quake bundle for nostalgia sake and it still feels incredible.

What is the best way to play these days though? Is there a better sourceport i should be using or is vanilla pretty much the way to go.

Also what is Quake Live? I missed that one when it came out - but am i right in saying its an upgraded version of Quake 3 or not?

And from my understanding Quake Champions is pretty much dead / abandoned so not worth picking up and getting into?

[SecretAgentKiiN 特务健]

Originally posted by dirtyCAT:

Also what is Quake Live? I missed that one when it came out - but am i right in saying its an upgraded version of Quake 3 or not?

Short answer:
Yes, better.

Long answer:
Might not entirely better, depending on personal needs & expectation. Here is the comparison list:
https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198087794419/recommended/282440

[ChubbiChibbai]

Thanks. That was very useful.
Having now tried both i think i prefer Quake 3 Arena. It just feels better even though it looks a little more dated - but playing with a sourceport it feels fine.

I love the singleplayer missions and the bots feel fantastic.

[Perfection]

Originally posted by dirtyCAT:

Maybe i'm biased because i played the crap out of this against bots in the days before i even had internet at home, but i picked this up in the sale with the quake bundle for nostalgia sake and it still feels incredible.

What is the best way to play these days though? Is there a better sourceport i should be using or is vanilla pretty much the way to go.

Also what is Quake Live? I missed that one when it came out - but am i right in saying its an upgraded version of Quake 3 or not?

And from my understanding Quake Champions is pretty much dead / abandoned so not worth picking up and getting into?

Quake3e is the source port worth checking out.
Quake Live is kinda more polished, but it definitely lacks in terms of singleplayer. Can be good for MP fun though.
Quake Champions isn't dead, although I wait for it to die since the release. Well, it has it's flaws, starting from the lack of dedicated server support and online-only model (when they pull the plug, you won't be able to even play with bots). Nevertheless, I would say try playing it while you still can. It's still the unique experience.

[Phoenix]

To answer your original question, here's a list of my thoughts on the matter.

The bots were programmed by Mr. Elusive, so they're pretty good for the time. Not perfect, but they navigate well and are programmed to provide a pretty fair fight based on the chosen skill level.

Quake-style movement physics are just awesome. Most games are lacking in this department. I have yet to see this improved on in any FPS.

Best network code of any multiplayer game ever made. This applies to the internal snapshots if you're playing a local game against bots.

Quake bots aren't modern toxic trolls that cheat, hack, and then call you names on message boards after the fact.

Q3A has a fantastic balance between visuals and game play. It's detailed enough to look good but not so overly detailed as to detract from the actual combat.

Excellent weapon balance (with the exception of the BFG10K...)

Feedback. That is, Doom, Quake, Quake 2, and Quake 3 are all excellent at letting you know exactly what is going on at any given moment. Player animations, gunshots, impacts, damage sounds, and weapon visuals are all distinct and useful. Some games can feel "muddy" when it comes to keeping the player informed of what just happened.

Quick load time. You don't have to spend 15 minutes waiting for a match just to play against some bots. You load Q3A, you select a level, you get to fragging.

[ChubbiChibbai]

Originally posted by Phoenix:

To answer your original question, here's a list of my thoughts on the matter.

The bots were programmed by Mr. Elusive, so they're pretty good for the time. Not perfect, but they navigate well and are programmed to provide a pretty fair fight based on the chosen skill level.

Quake-style movement physics are just awesome. Most games are lacking in this department. I have yet to see this improved on in any FPS.

Best network code of any multiplayer game ever made. This applies to the internal snapshots if you're playing a local game against bots.

Quake bots aren't modern toxic trolls that cheat, hack, and then call you names on message boards after the fact.

Q3A has a fantastic balance between visuals and game play. It's detailed enough to look good but not so overly detailed as to detract from the actual combat.

Excellent weapon balance (with the exception of the BFG10K...)

Feedback. That is, Doom, Quake, Quake 2, and Quake 3 are all excellent at letting you know exactly what is going on at any given moment. Player animations, gunshots, impacts, damage sounds, and weapon visuals are all distinct and useful. Some games can feel "muddy" when it comes to keeping the player informed of what just happened.

Quick load time. You don't have to spend 15 minutes waiting for a match just to play against some bots. You load Q3A, you select a level, you get to fragging.

Thanks for this reply. Really great info.
Very good point about the feedback as well. I recently just played Doom classic and it feels so satisfying when you shoot enemies in that game despite it being so simple.

Actually after playing through a bunch of the early ID games i really feel that most modern games have become far too cluttered and busy both visually but also with overly complicated gameplay mechanics at the expense of all the things that made these earlier games feel so good to play. Even Doom classic with its lack of movement in the x-axis (at least that's how i prefer to play it) feels great once you get used to it.

[xenon]

Whoever said that QL is a better Q3 basically lied to you... It's not, it's basically a different game.

Especially if you plan playing vs bots. QL bots are worse than Q3 bots.

If you want to play Q3 multi, here are some servers:
http://q3msk.ru/

[ChubbiChibbai]

Originally posted by xenon:

Whoever said that QL is a better Q3 basically lied to you... It's not, it's basically a different game.

Especially if you plan playing vs bots. QL bots are worse than Q3 bots.

If you want to play Q3 multi, here are some servers:
http://q3msk.ru/

Thanks!
Also i was reading Masters of Doom and it says how the guy Carmack had assigned the bots to dropped the ball so he found some modder in Sweden to do the job! Pretty crazy that this guy made some of the best bots in the biz to this day.

[xenon]

Originally posted by chubbichibbai:

Originally posted by xenon:

Whoever said that QL is a better Q3 basically lied to you... It's not, it's basically a different game.

Especially if you plan playing vs bots. QL bots are worse than Q3 bots.

If you want to play Q3 multi, here are some servers:
http://q3msk.ru/

Thanks!
Also i was reading Masters of Doom and it says how the guy Carmack had assigned the bots to dropped the ball so he found some modder in Sweden to do the job! Pretty crazy that this guy made some of the best bots in the biz to this day.

Yeah the bots were good....for its time. When you learn their patterns, they hardly provide a challenge and basically can only kill you with built-in aimbot.

I know Q3 is a good game but I don't wear rose-tinted glasses. Especially when I read nonsense like this: "Best network code of any multiplayer game ever made. ". Q3 has some of the worst netcode, where anything about 50 ping is basically unplayable. You'd get hit behind walls, your hitscan weapons like LG will require you to lead a lot, you'll get constantly pushed by ridiculous pushback that makes no sense, simultaneous item pickups are all about who has the lowest ping. You can screw around with the console commands but it hardly makes a difference.

Meanwhile in a lot of modern games, 50-100 ping is more than playable.