Grim Dawn

Grim Dawn

View Stats:
Meister_Ente Nov 8, 2022 @ 11:13am
Skills useless?
I'm playing the game for the first time because Diablo 3 gets kind of boring after 500 hours.

I've now defeated Warden Krieg after 11 hours and so far have only used Buffs, Fire Strike and Briarthorn. The other abilities seem totally pointless to me because I do more damage with one attack. Am I misunderstanding something?
< >
Showing 1-15 of 15 comments
FlamingX21 Nov 8, 2022 @ 12:05pm 
u are playing right except going hybrid way (pets + yourself) is not effective proven many times in past.

focus on 1 main skill or two and temporary buffs and auras itself and u will dominate the game.
tvance52 Nov 8, 2022 @ 12:14pm 
You're super early in the game. Pretty much anything works at that point and what you're using doesn't really matter. Just picking up a club and bashing things works at that point.

As you go on, the game will get tougher, especially once you jump up in difficulty. Just bashing things won't work anymore (unless you build your character for it, obviously).

If you're going for a pet build (Briarthorn), I'd focus on pet skills. Otherwise, that Briarthorn is going to be worthless before long. Pets need pet skills, and bonus to pet gear and devotions, to be useful long term. Those same items, gear, and devotions will not help your character do any damage, though. There are exceptions to everything, but in generally most pet builds will turn the player into a "caster" of some sort, usually a "debuff caster", but there are some builds that allow the player to survive endgame combat.

I don't know if you've played Titan's Quest, but similar to Titan's Quest I (personally) don't really think Grim Dawn starts until you complete the first difficulty and move up to "Elite" difficulty. Enemies start getting their resistances, gear gets a lot better, and the game really start to take shape with what you can expect the rest of the way.

I had played a lot of Diablo 3 on console when I didn't have a computer for a while, I know the game and it's expansions pretty well. D3 really simplified the genre's gameplay and mechanics, Grim Dawn really evolves as you play through and things that used to work will stop being effective, and skills will really change as you get the points to build synergies, add devotions, and pick up gear designed for very specific types of gameplay.
Last edited by tvance52; Nov 8, 2022 @ 12:19pm
DirtyMick Nov 8, 2022 @ 2:28pm 
Yeah that's how it goes. Obviously there's some variation... GD still has "piano builds". But most of the time, especially during leveling phase, you can just focus on one ability and maximizing it as much as you can. Like when I level anything with soldier mastery in it, I always just focus on forcewave completely.
I will say though, briarthorn is gonna fall off hard. Hell, even fire strike might fall off depending on how well you keep up with your gear. Theres a lot of items in this game to help prevent that though, that you may find very useful. Mainly, I'm talking about Monster Infrequents. Look into those and how to find em to make elite and ultimate a little easier/faster. Remember, you're still on tutorial mode lol. Normal difficulty is pretty brainless.
[MOSS]-BurningUp Nov 8, 2022 @ 4:33pm 
Probably depends on the class, level and build I guess. My Paladin uses a lot of different things already and it's only like level 30. I have a high level Warlock that uses like 12 different things if I remember right.

I figure accounting for cooldowns you should be at least rotating 4 damage attacks/spells and some sort of a buff or 2..... just spamming a LMB skill and a RMB skill isn't going to be good enough in tougher parts of the game.
Last edited by [MOSS]-BurningUp; Nov 8, 2022 @ 4:38pm
tvance52 Nov 8, 2022 @ 4:51pm 
Originally posted by MOSS-BurningUp:
just spamming a LMB skill and a RMB skill isn't going to be good enough in tougher parts of the game.

mostly true, but it depends on the build. Some of the very best builds only use 1 or 2 active skills. My best build, a pet build, can use 0 skills and just walk around and be fine against anything but the special bosses. And some Deathknight builds are basically 1 or 2 button builds and are essentially immortal.

I agree that most builds need to use 3 or 4 active skills, and there are obviously some piano builds with quite a few skills, but you can definitely have characters as strong or stronger than any of them with very skills if you use the right build.

There are a few "drunk" pet builds, intended to be played with pretty much zero player input, and they are super strong as all the damage is passive.
DirtyMick Nov 8, 2022 @ 6:42pm 
Originally posted by MOSS-BurningUp:
...just spamming a LMB skill and a RMB skill isn't going to be good enough in tougher parts of the game.
Nah, there's actually a lot of builds where that's fine and can get you through sr75 ultimate.
DirtyMick Nov 8, 2022 @ 6:44pm 
Originally posted by tvance52:
Originally posted by MOSS-BurningUp:
just spamming a LMB skill and a RMB skill isn't going to be good enough in tougher parts of the game.

mostly true, but it depends on the build. Some of the very best builds only use 1 or 2 active skills. My best build, a pet build, can use 0 skills and just walk around and be fine against anything but the special bosses. And some Deathknight builds are basically 1 or 2 button builds and are essentially immortal.

I agree that most builds need to use 3 or 4 active skills, and there are obviously some piano builds with quite a few skills, but you can definitely have characters as strong or stronger than any of them with very skills if you use the right build.

There are a few "drunk" pet builds, intended to be played with pretty much zero player input, and they are super strong as all the damage is passive.
Ya my lightning retal warder didn't really have to press anything. I would of course still use abilities, but that's just cuz standing around while stuff dies from hitting me is pretty boring. Well, actually I did have to make sure overguard was always up, so yeah, hit that every 5 or so seconds lol.
tvance52 Nov 8, 2022 @ 6:55pm 
Originally posted by DirtyMick:
Ya my lightning retal warder didn't really have to press anything. I would of course still use abilities, but that's just cuz standing around while stuff dies from hitting me is pretty boring. Well, actually I did have to make sure overguard was always up, so yeah, hit that every 5 or so seconds lol.

the very best builds for clearing all content, SR and Crucible at extreme levels, are pretty much all going to be pet builds that use maybe 2 skills to buff/debuff pets or proc devotions. Or Deathknights, some of those builds are almost unkillable and really only use maybe 2 skills unless you really want to proc devotions for the optional super bosses in SR.

Piano builds need really, really good pilots who know their stuff to survive against that stuff. One wrong move and you're one-shot dead. Your panic button skill still on cooldown? Dead.

There are a few fun piano builds, but I honestly don't care for them much as it's just too much micromanagement and in my experience testing them they just aren't as strong in most cases (at level 100). Obviously there are exceptions.
Last edited by tvance52; Nov 8, 2022 @ 7:00pm
DirtyMick Nov 8, 2022 @ 7:26pm 
Originally posted by tvance52:
Originally posted by DirtyMick:
Ya my lightning retal warder didn't really have to press anything. I would of course still use abilities, but that's just cuz standing around while stuff dies from hitting me is pretty boring. Well, actually I did have to make sure overguard was always up, so yeah, hit that every 5 or so seconds lol.

the very best builds for clearing all content, SR and Crucible at extreme levels, are pretty much all going to be pet builds that use maybe 2 skills to buff/debuff pets or proc devotions. Or Deathknights, some of those builds are almost unkillable and really only use maybe 2 skills unless you really want to proc devotions for the optional super bosses in SR.

Piano builds need really, really good pilots who know their stuff to survive against that stuff. One wrong move and you're one-shot dead. Your panic button skill still on cooldown? Dead.

There are a few fun piano builds, but I honestly don't care for them much as it's just too much micromanagement and in my experience testing them they just aren't as strong in most cases (at level 100). Obviously there are exceptions.
Ya I like a nice in between. Not piano level activity, but not pet build level inactivity lol. I've tried leveling pet builds a few times and the furthest I got was level 60 before I got too bored to continue and make a new char lol. And I play hardcore, so I gotta be careful about my builds. My best char, the storm totem ludrigans druid died on the way to crate cuz I went in blind and didn't know about the maggots lol. Saddest death ever. He was my crate killer and he died before I even got to crate :/
Last edited by DirtyMick; Nov 8, 2022 @ 7:27pm
tvance52 Nov 8, 2022 @ 8:00pm 
Originally posted by DirtyMick:
Ya I like a nice in between. Not piano level activity, but not pet build level inactivity lol. I've tried leveling pet builds a few times and the furthest I got was level 60 before I got too bored to continue and make a new char lol. And I play hardcore, so I gotta be careful about my builds. My best char, the storm totem ludrigans druid died on the way to crate cuz I went in blind and didn't know about the maggots lol. Saddest death ever. He was my crate killer and he died before I even got to crate :/

wow, that's funny in a sad way. That's one reason I don't play hardcore.

One type of pet build you might try would be a psuedo-pet build like this: https://forums.crateentertainment.com/t/1-1-9-6-bloodbound-pseudo-pet-skater-bleed-dervish-cr-sr80-ravager-of-minds-mogdrogen/110838

All those pets scale with player bonuses instead of pet bonuses. It's a gear based build, obviously, since all the pets are coming from the gear or getting their summon limit increased by gear.

But it's a skater build with unkillable pets that give RR:
2 Celestial Guardians
3 Blade Spirits
3 Living Shadows (devotion)
1 Lord Nazaran (Blood Knight set)
1 Deathstalker (relic)
4 Bloodbathed Servants (Blood Knight set)

The builder was getting up to 17 total.

As a skater, probably pretty bad for Hardcore...you're gonna skate yourself into trouble and not enough cooldown reduction to skate out if all your movement skills are on cooldown.
Last edited by tvance52; Nov 8, 2022 @ 8:00pm
DirtyMick Nov 8, 2022 @ 8:59pm 
Originally posted by tvance52:
Originally posted by DirtyMick:
Ya I like a nice in between. Not piano level activity, but not pet build level inactivity lol. I've tried leveling pet builds a few times and the furthest I got was level 60 before I got too bored to continue and make a new char lol. And I play hardcore, so I gotta be careful about my builds. My best char, the storm totem ludrigans druid died on the way to crate cuz I went in blind and didn't know about the maggots lol. Saddest death ever. He was my crate killer and he died before I even got to crate :/

wow, that's funny in a sad way. That's one reason I don't play hardcore.

One type of pet build you might try would be a psuedo-pet build like this: https://forums.crateentertainment.com/t/1-1-9-6-bloodbound-pseudo-pet-skater-bleed-dervish-cr-sr80-ravager-of-minds-mogdrogen/110838

All those pets scale with player bonuses instead of pet bonuses. It's a gear based build, obviously, since all the pets are coming from the gear or getting their summon limit increased by gear.

But it's a skater build with unkillable pets that give RR:
2 Celestial Guardians
3 Blade Spirits
3 Living Shadows (devotion)
1 Lord Nazaran (Blood Knight set)
1 Deathstalker (relic)
4 Bloodbathed Servants (Blood Knight set)

The builder was getting up to 17 total.

As a skater, probably pretty bad for Hardcore...you're gonna skate yourself into trouble and not enough cooldown reduction to skate out if all your movement skills are on cooldown.
Lol yeah that's an interesting build. I have a vanquisher set fire skater already though. So I probably won't go for that but that's cool. One of the first things I went for when I switched to hardcore was a skater just for faster ugdenbloom and seal farming lol. I love him. Anyway, I got a few chars that need finishing anyway before I start yet another build lol... kinda getting backed up. Need some more chars to die.
Katzh Nov 9, 2022 @ 9:35am 
my skill bar is full of skills and they are all powerfull (exect mobility skill)
BIG E. Nov 9, 2022 @ 1:25pm 
Fire Strike is a skill.
[MOSS]-BurningUp Nov 9, 2022 @ 2:19pm 
Originally posted by tvance52:
Originally posted by DirtyMick:
Ya my lightning retal warder didn't really have to press anything. I would of course still use abilities, but that's just cuz standing around while stuff dies from hitting me is pretty boring. Well, actually I did have to make sure overguard was always up, so yeah, hit that every 5 or so seconds lol.

the very best builds for clearing all content, SR and Crucible at extreme levels, are pretty much all going to be pet builds that use maybe 2 skills to buff/debuff pets or proc devotions. Or Deathknights, some of those builds are almost unkillable and really only use maybe 2 skills unless you really want to proc devotions for the optional super bosses in SR.

Piano builds need really, really good pilots who know their stuff to survive against that stuff. One wrong move and you're one-shot dead. Your panic button skill still on cooldown? Dead.

There are a few fun piano builds, but I honestly don't care for them much as it's just too much micromanagement and in my experience testing them they just aren't as strong in most cases (at level 100). Obviously there are exceptions.

Pet builds are boring though and I couldn't imagine only using 2 skills I mean even a melee oriented Paladin can easily use a build using at least 6 skills.

Example : 1 rune skill from Inquisitor tree, Word of Renewal from Inquisitor tree, Ascension from Oathkeeper tree, Inquisitor Seal, main LMB attack such as Righteous Fervor from Oathkeeper tree, and an RMB attack such as Vire's Might.

I can't figure out anyone could even a build a guy using only 2 skills lol. You would basically be ignoring a lot of good skills that have a cooldown and/or support skills that have no cast time.

Last edited by [MOSS]-BurningUp; Nov 9, 2022 @ 2:41pm
tvance52 Nov 9, 2022 @ 3:56pm 
Originally posted by MOSS-BurningUp:
Pet builds are boring though and I couldn't imagine only using 2 skills I mean even a melee oriented Paladin can easily use a build using at least 6 skills.

Example : 1 rune skill from Inquisitor tree, Word of Renewal from Inquisitor tree, Ascension from Oathkeeper tree, Inquisitor Seal, main LMB attack such as Righteous Fervor from Oathkeeper tree, and an RMB attack such as Vire's Might.

I can't figure out anyone could even a build a guy using only 2 skills lol. You would basically be ignoring a lot of good skills that have a cooldown and/or support skills that have no cast time.

Play however you want. I find pet build interesting and piano builds very boring. Everyone has their preferred method to play, which Grim Dawn can accomodate.

Any decent build will be able to complete the game on all difficulties. It's really only when you're talking about the extreme stuff, the special bosses and high SR or Crucible levels were there are only certain types of things that are going to work. The safest builds to clear that stuff are pretty much all going to be pet builds or deathknights, with a few other elite builds thrown in. Obviously other builds can clear that stuff, too, but you really need to be an extremely good pilot and fast your hotkeys (i see a lot say they need kiting). I'm neither and don't really care to be.

I can't figure out anyone could even a build a guy using only 2 skills lol. You would basically be ignoring a lot of good skills that have a cooldown and/or support skills that have no cast time.

Regarding 2 skill builds: they are going to be builds that use 1 or 2 really strong skills that synergize with all their passives. These build are doing most of the work their their passives. There are massive benefits to this.

For example, most of them have no cooldown time...they are always active. There is zero reaction time, they are instant, whereas no human can be instantaneous. Many of the passive stack on other passives or active skills. Most active skills will need to stack on other active skills, which gets into cooldowns and all kinds of other things. Most passives don't have to worry about that.

Also, passives that can bind devotions are going to trigger far more often in most situations. For example, if you use Volcanic Stride (off Vire's Might) you get multiple attacks per second as the damage is continuous. In the build I posted above, for example, the Living Shadows only proc on Critical Hits but since you are continuous damage with many chances to Crit per second you can spawn them all in one attack. You can't really do that with any active skills.

Another example, those Blade Spirits in the build I posted get 6 attacks continuously. They're going proc Rend (devotion) continuously, an active skill would only have 20% chance but with that many attacks the blade spirits will shred anything due to the RR combined with other things.

Those Bloodbathed Servants also get 2 attacks, so 8 between the 4 of them. Their bleed attacks are going to stack with Rend's RR (from the Blade Spirits) and the RR from Lord Nazaran. And all of them are attacking, on top of the other summons and the RR they are bringing.

Now stack the player attacks on there and there's almost no active skill build that could stack that damage both instantly and over time, plus all the Resistance Reduction. This isn't burst damage but face-melting high damage that maintains itself.

This doesn't mean it is fun for everyone to play, I can certainly understand why people wouldn't like to play that way. There are some great piano builds out there that I've tried. I just can't maintain that level of concentration for very long myself.
< >
Showing 1-15 of 15 comments
Per page: 1530 50

Date Posted: Nov 8, 2022 @ 11:13am
Posts: 15