I don't see why Overkill is considered easy

[Nino_Chaosdrache]

Basically the consens in the forum is that every difficulty below Deadthwish is easy, but I can agree with this. A friend and me played some heists on Overkill for the first time and compared to Very Hard, what we usually play, it was brutal. I guess the main reason for this was the higher spawn rates, but during our first few games we just got crushed by the police and even after we got used to it it was still a rough fight. The only time where the heist went pretty good was in Nightclub, when I used the Piglet with fire grenades and the Grinder perck deck.

Now I don't say that this is a bad thing and I actually expect the game to be hard when playing on such a high difficulty. But after this experience I can't agree that Overkill is an easy diffculty that can be played without any problem like the forums make it look like. I even used Grinder in one heist, because I thought it would be helpful, but it barely did anything to keep me alive.

When you already mastered Deathwish then it's understandable that you think Overkill is easy, but coming from Hard or Very Hard it's not in my opinion. It also made me hope that Overkill as a developer will always think about the not so good players if they release balance patches in the future and don't balance everything around DW.

[Raven]

OVK isn't that much of a step up from VH, play for a bit and it becomes fairly easy. Obviously not a complete walk in the park but if your team is decent it'll be fine, it's only hard if you a bad team.

[Bob the Boomer]

overkill is not at all difficult, even if you dont understand the meta game nuances it is still easy.

I do not play deathwish much so im not used to deathwish.

The jump from very hard to overkill is noticeable yes but it is far from difficult, coming from payday the heist (part 1) i can honestly say overkill difficulty is easy.


Many people who play pd2 with me in random games all agree pd2's overkill mode is far to easy and the jump to deathwish (disparity) is large, but coming from very hard to overkill is tiny.

[Bob the Boomer]

Originally posted by XiaoXiaoMan:

When I first attempted Tabula Rasa, I had my own theory: the game is balanced around playing with no skills and only a suit. It started feeling a lot more like Overkill from PAYDAY: The Heist under those circumstances. But what would I know?

sums it up perfectly, agreed.

[pH]

Originally posted by ☧High PriestSirsucksalot☦:

Hmm, the problem I have with the Overkill and the one or two Deathwish heists I ended up in is that armour seems to be made out of cardboard, which I guess makes it harder, but well, it sorta sucks. :o

Yes, that's because armor needs to be balanced and that is where hiding behind cover and moving as a team is so crucial in Deathwish. I find that at least for now, high armor values created with Armorer Perk deck, ICTV or CTV, Bulletproof skill or a high armor recovery can act as a means to use armor in Deathwish if you choose not to use a dodge build.

[Cheddar]

Originally posted by pH:

Originally posted by ☧High PriestSirsucksalot☦:

Hmm, the problem I have with the Overkill and the one or two Deathwish heists I ended up in is that armour seems to be made out of cardboard, which I guess makes it harder, but well, it sorta sucks. :o

Yes, that's because armor needs to be balanced and that is where hiding behind cover and moving as a team is so crucial in Deathwish. I find that at least for now, high armor values created with Armorer Perk deck, ICTV or CTV, Bulletproof skill or a high armor recovery can act as a means to use armor in Deathwish if you choose not to use a dodge build.

Only buff armor needs is regen counter not reseting from surpressive fire
Edit: I meant ICTV. other armours need a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ revamp.

[0ptimistPrime (the Gray)]

Difficulty seems to increase exponentially. There isn't a big difference between Normal, Hard, and Very Hard aside form what specials you're going to see and the proportions of cop spawns differing. Overkill is a hop in difficulty, from VH. And DW is a jump from OVK.


So OP, if you and your friends primarily play on VH, I'm sure it feels pretty comfortable for you, yes? Sure, you may have some tougher moments here and there, but in general you're confident in your ability to complete a mission? So it is no surprise that Overkill will feel like a challenge, or at the very least get you out of your comfort zone.

People who are used to playing Overkill find it comfortable, and aside from a few rough areas, generally have no trouble completing a heist without needing to restart (or at least not too many times). And Deathwish is difficult to them, or at least uncomfortable.

And players who run DW often will find that difficulty comfortable, even though they'll face tough situations at times.


So considering a large portion of the community play on Overkill or Deathwish, it shouldn't come as a shock to hear them say that Overkil is more or less easy. Is it true? Frankly, it's only a matter of perspective.
If you and your friend(s) wanted to play Overkill, you could. It would take some time to acclimate yourself to the new challenges, but after a while and with enough practice, you'd start to feel Overkill was comfortable/easy as well.

But if you guys are content with playing on Very Hard, that's absolutely fine. There's nothing wrong with that, and I hope you guys have fun during your gaming sessions. That is, afterall, what the game is all about! People may say Overkill is easy, but that's their opinions. And everyone is entitled to their own

Cheers!

[Nino_Chaosdrache]

Originally posted by Stoibs:

Private profile, can't see your playtime.
A lot of us have been playing ever since the first game (Which was about 10x harder than this) and then been playing Payday 2 since the beta in 2013 (Of which we were playing Overkill even with the at-the-time level cap of 30 or 40 or whatever it was)

Yes, my profile is private, but I have played PD:TH for 360 hours and Payday 2 for 370. And oh yes, The Heist is Harder. I once played it online on Overkill without knowing and I was always wondering why I died so much XD

Originally posted by gimmethegepgun:

Once you have weapons capable of dealing with overkill properly (instakilling greens, 3/2/1 shotting tans) there's barely any difference in difficulty by decreasing difficulty. Things die just as easily (instakill) and deal basically the same amounts of damage (greens and tans both have crap for damage, and cops and fbi will match them on lower difficulties). Also the spawn rates aren't that much higher. Overkill only has a few more enemies alive at a time than lower difficulties do, and a higher special cap.
If you have a 32, 42, or 80 damage bullet weapon overkill becomes far easier (becoming easier with each of those damage levels).

I guess it's time to bring out the minigun then XD Joke aside, I know what you mean and I guess part of the problem also was that I wasn't really equipped for Overkill. I'm not a min-maxer and so I used an unmodded CAR-4, a Reinfeld with dragon breath shells, the R 36 and the mentioned Piglet for our attempts. I guess the worst gun was the Rienfeld, because I'm so used to one shotting the police with it XD

[Feotank]

Yea I remember when overkill would push my ♥♥♥♥ in on loud. Now its deathwish that does that and overkill is usually a cakewalk. Although I played the ♥♥♥♥ out of most of the levels on overkill so I am used to the spawns. Deathwish on the other hand, oh god the rape.

[Nino_Chaosdrache]

Originally posted by Optimist Prime (the Gray):

Difficulty seems to increase exponentially. There isn't a big difference between Normal, Hard, and Very Hard aside form what specials you're going to see and the proportions of cop spawns differing. Overkill is a hop in difficulty, from VH. And DW is a jump from OVK.


So OP, if you and your friends primarily play on VH, I'm sure it feels pretty comfortable for you, yes? Sure, you may have some tougher moments here and there, but in general you're confident in your ability to complete a mission? So it is no surprise that Overkill will feel like a challenge, or at the very least get you out of your comfort zone.

People who are used to playing Overkill find it comfortable, and aside from a few rough areas, generally have no trouble completing a heist without needing to restart (or at least not too many times). And Deathwish is difficult to them, or at least uncomfortable.

And players who run DW often will find that difficulty comfortable, even though they'll face tough situations at times.


So considering a large portion of the community play on Overkill or Deathwish, it shouldn't come as a shock to hear them say that Overkil is more or less easy. Is it true? Frankly, it's only a matter of perspective.
If you and your friend(s) wanted to play Overkill, you could. It would take some time to acclimate yourself to the new challenges, but after a while and with enough practice, you'd start to feel Overkill was comfortable/easy as well.

But if you guys are content with playing on Very Hard, that's absolutely fine. There's nothing wrong with that, and I hope you guys have fun during your gaming sessions. That is, afterall, what the game is all about! People may say Overkill is easy, but that's their opinions. And everyone is entitled to their own :B1:

Cheers!

That's actually how I play the game, to have fun and I agree that's just a matter of getting used to it, like in every game. But with the comfort zone it's only partly true. In most heists I feel comfortable when I play offline with bots, with the one or other heist like Election Day 2 Warehouse with the two SWAT vans, Armored Transport: Crossroads or Framing Frame day 3 which are still quite a challenge. When I play with friends it's so and so. We succeed most of the time, but we also get arrested. But playing online is a complete different matter. Most of the time I have no idea if we will win or not and I already got crushed enough times to be a bit pessimistic when playing online. But that's also the danger when you play with completely foreign people.

[the kid]

Well it was the same thing for me when i first went to overkill. But i just kept playing it over and over till i got used to it. Now i can pretty much do any overkill heist with my eyes closed. Its so easy lol. Im busy trying to get more used to dw but its so hard lol

[Páv]

You'll see later... it'll be easy once you'll be good.

[Hex Welsh]

I think people are over thinking this a bit?

If its stealth issues, watch a guide and practise, learn, adapt, perform.
If its loud, whats killing you? - Find a way to kill them better

Been playing a lot with newer players who have no idea how to kill shields because they bring an AR and a Sub

[Mugen]

For me it's how Overkill has mostly green and tan cops which deal less damage than the blue ones or Bronco cops, which are abundant on Normal, Hard and Very Hard.

[Peanits]

Most of the people here play death wish all the time, which makes overkill look like a joke.

But even if you don't player death wish, you'll get used to it eventually. I still play on overkill myself because none of my friends like overkill. They tried it before all the massively OP weapons and perk decks came out and now I can't convince them to play death wish. And I'll never bother with randoms again. Anyway, it's easy once you get used to it.

[Silberfuchs]

I was about to make a post concerning this matter, but Optimist Prime made yet another of his wonderful posts and said pretty much the same I was about to say: being used to a difficulty, feeling comfortable with it, learning curve, additional challenge, etc.

The only thing I have to add is that VH and OK are very similar, which maybe makes it harder for you to play OK than it would be to play DW. After your first failed DW mission you would grow incredibly paranoid concerning cover, enemy fire, etc., and would play completely different, which means you probably wouldn't do that bad. But OK is so similar to VH, it will be difficult for you to let loose of old habits and adjust.

If you want you can add me, I am German, too, and we can play a few ronds together. Nice to see you finally start abandoning solo play, which I think you were doing for a long time now