Faster weapon swapping

[[Cash.net]Gorimaccha]

The default swapping speed is kinda too slow... I've seen some FPS games that have skills which make weapon spwapping faster, but none of them had default swapping speed as slow as the one in PAYDAY2. So I feel the last buff from the rouge deck will be fine even if the default speed is buffed by 30%. What do you think?

[Bindal]

No. There is no need. If you want to switch guns faster, there is a skill for the Mastermind that affects pistols and the already mentioned Rogue Perk. Use them.
No need to buff every gun in the entire game just because you don't want to pick either of the two options.

[Pecomare]

I agree with Bindal, no need to switch faster.
One thing i would like about switch is being able to cancel the switch, like in most CoDs (seems to be mostly used by all those xXx360noscopexXx players). This way, you don't have to wait for the full switch to go back to your weapon.

[Mr Ilax]

Think ahead and keep your guns full.
Or if the "slow" speed is meshing with your play style, adjust something to take advantage of the swap speed Skills/perk.

[[Cash.net]Gorimaccha]

I've never seen people who use that skill while having heavy armors on them. They both just help dodge players... I believe this change would encourage people to use other decks and armors more.
Well, I don't think this should be applied for all guns. I feel guns like LMGs, minigun, and sniper rifles better keep the current speed, but what about SMGs and secondary shotguns? Giving faster swap speed at no cost might be too much, but at least changing equilibrium basic to support all secondaries or something like it would be acceptable.

[Bindal]

No, it wouldn't.
Again, there is no need to pointlessly buff weapons at all just because you're bad at switching weapons properly.

And as you said - there are basically no people that use the Rogue Deck for the faster weapon swap exclusively. So, HOW would that encourage them to "try other decks", when that's already what they're doing - using other decks?

[[Cash.net]♣Durandil♣]

Well an option for switching to your signature tree weapon wouldn't be missed honestly, I mean why does MM has it and not the others? It's kinda ridiculous to have, say, a skill like Overkill aced in Enforcer and losing at least half of the bonus damage because you have to use a weapon switch that actually takes ages.
And the good days of when I could just go and pick that Ghost skill tree tier bonus with faster weapon switching. I got used to slow switch, but a slight boost for light weapons + a skill for signature weapons somewhere in the trees wouldn't be hated honestly.

[Mr Ilax]

Originally posted by Cash.net♣Durandil=CU=:

Well an option for switching to your signature tree weapon wouldn't be missed honestly, I mean why does MM has it and not the others? It's kinda ridiculous to have, say, a skill like Overkill aced in Enforcer and losing at least half of the bonus damage because you have to use a weapon switch that actually takes ages.
And the good days of when I could just go and pick that Ghost skill tree tier bonus with faster weapon switching. I got used to slow switch, but a slight boost for light weapons + a skill for signature weapons somewhere in the trees wouldn't be hated honestly.

To keep things diverse. If every tree had switch speed for signature weapon, everyone would have it and it would make it pointless. That was why the perk decks got creates. The majority of people were getting the headshot skill, Ghost movement and switch speed. Headshot was made universal and OK decided that switch skill was something that was to be limited. I agree. I don't think there should be universal traits. Skill trees and perk decks should have unique abilities/bonuses.

Would I hate switch speed being implemented for more builds? No. But I strongly disagree.

I don't agree on many of the identical abilities shared between Decks/trees.

[Empress Misery]

Originally posted by Gorimaccha:

I've never seen people who use that skill while having heavy armors on them. They both just help dodge players... I believe this change would encourage people to use other decks and armors more.

I know of an armor player who runs rogue for faster weapon swap. He plays on DW loud and does fine.

[[Cash.net]Gorimaccha]

Originally posted by Empress Misery:

Originally posted by Gorimaccha:

I've never seen people who use that skill while having heavy armors on them. They both just help dodge players... I believe this change would encourage people to use other decks and armors more.

I know of an armor player who runs rogue for faster weapon swap. He plays on DW loud and does fine.

I mean armor players with a pistol and equilibum basic, not the rouge deck.

Well, I don't care about this so much except for DW heists. I believe that headshot damage buff was given to all perk deck mainly because of DW heists. You know, most DW lobbies are filled with dodge players, and it means majority of people can't survive it without the rouge deck. I often use ICTV for DW heists, but I can understand that. People with dodge builds can kill dozers quickly by using explosives then switching to their primary or seconedary to finish them. Can you do the same thing if you're in ICTV without the rouge deck? It wouldn't be so hard if you see just one dozer nearby, but you're most likely not gonna make it if there are multiple dozers, some shields and a few normals. Of course you can kill them one by one, but it sure takes much longer than dodge players. My suggestion just helps player without certain bonuses do what they can do with dodge builds. This would result in increase of armor players since people can gain options to use other decks to use armors more effectively. I really don't understand why you hate this idea so much...

[leilmyxwz]

Originally posted by Bindal:

No, it wouldn't.
Again, there is no need to pointlessly buff weapons at all just because you're bad at switching weapons properly.

And as you said - there are basically no people that use the Rogue Deck for the faster weapon swap exclusively. So, HOW would that encourage them to "try other decks", when that's already what they're doing - using other decks?

I would still prefer rogue even with heavy armor. If 1 black dozer is standing in front of you, how much time you have to switch to HE before he 1 shot kills you? Plus, with current nerf to HE dmg on dozer, a dozer in DW can tank 4 locomotive shots even his mask is off. Even if you managed to stun him and take off his visor with 1014, how much time is left to you to place your consecutive shots after the slow swapping motion and before the dozer is ready to f**k u again?

[Mr Ilax]

Originally posted by leilmyxwz:

Originally posted by Bindal:

No, it wouldn't.
Again, there is no need to pointlessly buff weapons at all just because you're bad at switching weapons properly.

And as you said - there are basically no people that use the Rogue Deck for the faster weapon swap exclusively. So, HOW would that encourage them to "try other decks", when that's already what they're doing - using other decks?

I would still prefer rogue even with heavy armor. If 1 black dozer is standing in front of you, how much time you have to switch to HE before he 1 shot kills you? Plus, with current nerf to HE dmg on dozer, a dozer in DW can tank 4 locomotive shots even his mask is off. Even if you managed to stun him and take off his visor with 1014, how much time is left to you to place your consecutive shots after the slow swapping motion and before the dozer is ready to f**k u again?

That is the teamwork part of a Coop game.

[0ptimistPrime (the Gray)]

1) I'm okay with getting another Perk Deck that features faster weapon swap and is more geared toward non-suit builds.

2) I'm not okay with a blanket buff to swap speed across the board. Screw that noise. If you want to swap faster, spec for it.

[Wayz]

I think that there should be other options than rogue and it should be in skills, Not as fast as rogue and it should not stack with rogue. If was down to me i would replace the fire rate on the aced smg skill with a 20% swap as most smg's ammo pool is ♥♥♥♥ anyway.
I use the pistol swap speed as well with a sniper build but to be honest the swap speed i cannot play without so apart from my crook mmtech sniper or my multi rogue builds i never touch the other decks as swap is too damn slow.

That's just my opinion though.

[eezstreet]

Okay, but let's put this on its head for a second.
Why would it be okay for an armored player to switch weapons as fast as a suit player? Armor makes you slower and more bulky. Weapon switch speed could be seen as a consequence of this.
I wouldn't have a problem with them expanding on perk decks (make all existing decks have twice as many cards? heck yeah) and adding switch speed as a universal card, but just playing devil's advocate for a moment.

[[Cash.net]Gorimaccha]

Originally posted by eezstreet:

Okay, but let's put this on its head for a second.
Why would it be okay for an armored player to switch weapons as fast as a suit player? Armor makes you slower and more bulky. Weapon switch speed could be seen as a consequence of this.
I wouldn't have a problem with them expanding on perk decks (make all existing decks have twice as many cards? heck yeah) and adding switch speed as a universal card, but just playing devil's advocate for a moment.

I just said 30%...
100/130=approximately 77%
100/180=approximately 55% <- This is the time with the current rouge deck
Dodge players still have singnificantly faster speed.