Why Everyone Hates Goat Simulator

[Grey Star, The Rival Defender]

Hello, it's me, your favorite SA defender and guy who tends to get banned, Grey.

Currently I'm writing to you from police custody of Goat Simulator Day 2 on Mayhem. And I have to say I hate myself and this map, and I'm going to explain why. Maybe Overkill knows, maybe they don't, regardless this is for them to explain the simple reasons why everybody hates this map.

Okay, I can break this down into 4 seperate subjects.

No damage drop off.
Snipers.
Loot stealing.
The Longfellow.

1. Damage drop off - Or the lack of it. In this heist you have short amounts of small cover and long streches inbetween said cover, mostly on Day 1 but visible on Day 2. This means that cops can snipe you across the map in most situations, also meaning that because on MH+ there's no damage drop off that you're taking max damage without much sway or accuracy or even rate of fire being decreased by distance, so everyone not running a full dodge build gets hit, takes full damage, and can't do much other than hide in the small cover. While this is solvable by taking concealable weapons, it still sucks for armor users. I would say this map is almost mandatory dodge builds, which sucks because on OVK armor can work due to damage drop off and the cover being just close enough to prevent armor breaking most of the time.

A map that does this better - Hoxton Breakout Day 1. Yes, it has the exact same problems I listed, with the exception of closer cover making armor better to use, but importantly the sight lines are cut off by the constant twists and turns of the map. Meaning that if you keep moving, you'll break LoS quickly enough to avoid dying left and right.

2. Snipers. Oh boy, I hate them here. Normally, (Hotline Miami, Hoxton Revenge, Counterfeit, and Election Day Day 2 Plan B are the exceptions) they're a fair challenge. You walk into their laser sights, and they have some time before they shoot you, so you just shoot them first. Easy, simple, fair, fun. In this map two reasons makes snipers an issue. One is the SHEER amount of cops you're already trying to fight at distance, compounded by the lack of damage drop off, destroying your armor and health and making you lose focus and thus unable to fight the sniper. Secondly, and this is mostly Day 1, is that some snipers are so far away anything short of a very, very well placed DMR or Sniper Rifle shot can kill them. Low damage rifles, LMGs, and shotguns all have terrible accuracy ratings (40 accuracy 000 buckshot Far Away Aced STILL had drop off severe enough I couldn't hit the sniper from a street away) that prevent them from hitting the sniper, and the distance they have also makes it incredibly hard to see the sniper or their laser sights, meaning it is possible to die without being able to see who shot you.

A map that does this better - Hoxton Breakout again, due to the LoS and relative cop amount reasons I mentioned earlier.

3. Loot stealing. This is a Day 2 thing but, fighting through an army of cops solo with bots, and dumping a few goats in the cage, and then getting downed and having to watch all of the goats get taken to the far edge of the map... I've tried three times now to get the goats in here and I just watched the last of them get taken away. Something is wrong if Farmer Miserable is more effective for loot movement than actually getting it all in one shot.

A map that does this better - I would say the Diamond due to also being a map where loot stealing is a problem, or Bomb: Dockyard, and they have it lessened thanks to it not being filled with cops and downing to prevent one from moving all the loot to the secure zone. In these maps also, the secure zone doesn't have to be defended aside from the usual clearing.

4. The Longfellow. Take points 1 and 2. Now you're inside a vehicale getting shot with no damage drop off, getting one shot by snipers, and the mode of transportation you have is breaking down just like you're getting downed. And it's required to keep it. I really can't explain it more than over time the vehicale breaks down and is hard to be repaired, and thus causes a lot of aggrevation.

A map that does this better - None, actually, Meltdown has the same issues.

5. Added afterwards but it's simple. On Day 2, as far as I know, the bride control room will be randomly tear gased and there's nothing you can do about it. I spent awhile considering this extra hard difficulty but, after futher consideration there's one exact thing that makes this an unfair challenge rather than RNG difficulty, and that is cops can still shut off the bridge movement through the tear gas. And then camp the room. If the cops couldn't enter the room if it was tear gased, it would be okay.

[∴ Snake ∴]

I would also add ♥♥♥♥♥♥ optimization and too many goats to secure.

[Infinite Thwomp Works]

Very few things can be considered a magic bullet, but I geniunely believe that adding falloff would be pretty damn close. I mean, it wouldn't solve 3 and it's only really a start towards solving 2 and 4, but it would certainly help, and help fixing some of the OTHER frustrating loud maps (looking at you, The Bomb heists).

It's clear that Payday 2 was originally intended to have fairly tight, intimate maps, but that was nearly five years ago. The level design philosophy has changed, and it's long since time that some of the game mechanics adapted accordingly.

[agent0125]

I would prefer if the longfellow was bloody bullet proof. I mean it was *apparently* used ny a dictator, ofc he'd stick some bullet proof stuff. Its not like you can cheese it by running everyone over.

And reducing the goats to find maybe would be helpful. At most 10 or even less, not 15 scattered all over the bloody map.

And mayyybe day 1 could use some backup, hell I'd want Vlad's couriers back to act as bullet magnets and some cover fire.

[MingNexus]

The lore of this heist makes no forkin sense at all

[Jet]

When the Goat Simulator heist first came out, I didn’t buy it at first just because the DLC Pack was extremely wacky and my motive to play the game went up and down because of the Blackmarket update. I dislike the heist because
-It’s all about goats
-Day 2 cause some players to crash(the crashes I witnessed always happen to Player 4 for some reason
-Because of the Diffiuclty Rebalance update, all 84 enemies can spawn on the highest difficulty mode


The only thing I like about the Goat Simulator Pack is the mod that replaces all the bags with Goats(I used that mod a few times after Crime Spree was introduced).

[Aleupo]

I think it's one of the best heists tbh. Fun thing is that people don't know that it's actually a real ife scenario, coke gets smuggled in goats and other animals a lot.

[VxWolf]

People hate it because:

• it was a crossover, and one of the dumbest ones at that
  
• The wounds of Crimefest 2015 were still fresh
  
• This was the first thing we got in 2016 (iirc)

[Salem]

Originally posted by VxWolf:

People hate it because:

• it was a crossover, and one of the dumbest ones at that
  
• The wounds of Crimefest 2015 were still fresh
  
• This was the first thing we got in 2016 (iirc)

And the update introduced a game-breaking crash that lasted 2 weeks until Overkill pushed a BAND-AID fix to disable spotting, and that affected nearly all loud games.

Other than that I actually like Goat Sim, it's a pretty unique scavenger hunt. The issue is more how difficulties are balanced than the map itself.

[SpritePony]

My points I'd like to add to the list is the massive amount and rapid-fire spawns that occur on both days with a lot of players not understanding the need to stay in a group and playing safe. They can, and will, overwhelm your crew and kill runs both in day 1 and 2.
Day 2, cops spawn EVERYWHERE around EVERY cage spawn. It's honestly quite ridiculous and causes a lot of frustration when doing certain things on MH+. (Notably all goats at once to GTFO quickly, or Farmer Miserable.)

Don't get me wrong, I like the heist and all. I even became good at running it. It's just these are the main points I see that ruin games.

[Grey Star, The Rival Defender]

I would like to say I was mostly addressing the map design issues, and wasn’t going to bring up it’s crossover status, the timing of this heist, or the lore that actually does make sense.

Although one thing I’m unsure of is whether or not in Day 2 the tear gased control room adds a second challenge to keep the bridge going, or just stupid hard.

[Thermal Lance]

Originally posted by Qrow “Not Family” Branwen:

I would like to say I was mostly addressing the map design issues, and wasn’t going to bring up it’s crossover status, the timing of this heist, or the lore that actually does make sense.

Although one thing I’m unsure of is whether or not in Day 2 the tear gased control room adds a second challenge to keep the bridge going, or just stupid hard.

the tear gas thing is a bit excessive.... with those helicopters and cops pouring in like cockroaches it can be indeed stupid hard.

As for the whole heist, yeah that one is problematic by design... There is cover but when you take into consideration spawn points and snipers nests.... It is kind of a painful map to navigate...

[FutureRegrets]

I like the map, infact I just completed it on OD. Stick to cover and make sure you've got plenty of meds. Stay with your team, and collect exposed goats while the assault is fading. This heist is one of the few where you shouldn't try to rush objectives during the peak of the assault. Unlike most maps, this requires you to plan ahead and ensure you are always in the best possible cover.

But I hate how it's a goatsim crossover, because did anyone actually like goat simulator?

[Grey Star, The Rival Defender]

Originally posted by Lagon78:

I like the map, infact I just completed it on OD. Stick to cover and make sure you've got plenty of meds. Stay with your team, and collect exposed goats while the assault is fading. This heist is one of the few where you shouldn't try to rush objectives during the peak of the assault. Unlike most maps, this requires you to plan ahead and ensure you are always in the best possible cover.

But I hate how it's a goatsim crossover, because did anyone actually like goat simulator?

Wow you missed the point of this thread entirely. Completely. Utterly.

[RusLocalNetwork]

A lot of my friends actually hate the heist because of goats only. This game needs some hard maps with snipers, open areas (I can remember only 2-3 such maps) and target defending, when you need to count your time and look for assault state. Damage falloff might be a problem, but both days still have covers and closed space, they're just not everywhere.
And those snipers.... well yes, they're a problem especially on day 1, when sniper is so far you can't even see him, but it's sort of map feature and it's kinda funny trying to kill him. And btw he covers not all map, so you can get in cover, avoid him or come closer.

[Grey Star, The Rival Defender]

Originally posted by PHE$ Bloody Gad NOT 31:

A lot of my friends actually hate the heist because of goats only. This game needs some hard maps with snipers, open areas (I can remember only 2-3 such maps) and target defending, when you need to count your time and look for assault state. Damage falloff might be a problem, but both days still have covers and closed space, they're just not everywhere.
And those snipers.... well yes, they're a problem especially on day 1, when sniper is so far you can't even see him, but it's sort of map feature and it's kinda funny trying to kill him. And btw he covers not all map, so you can get in cover, avoid him or come closer.

I counted at least 5 simultanoously active snipers. That’s why I consider Day 1 ridiculous. In addition they cover 90% of the map, and getting to one to kill him allows the others to pick you off.