Nerf Heavy Swat's Damage on One Down

[Noo_Billy]

Fact : Heavy Swat can deal 225 damage every shot , any distance.
Basically , Heavy Swat is a Sniper(Tank Ver.) --- Take out armor penetration and decrease 6.25% damage but increase 300% health and increase at least 1000% spwan rate.

What is the problem?

1.It makes only Yakuza(Stealth) , Burglar(Stealth) , Armorer(2s Invincible) , Anarchist(2s Invincible) , Rogue(High Dodge) , Kingpin(High Damage Reduction) are variable on One Down.
Other perks are completely garbage.

2.It makes some maps insanely hard(Goat Sim. , Forest , Lab Rat ) because there are less covers and the combat range is long on those maps.

3.Without damage reduction skills or perks , ICTV ~= Suit because 1 shot of Heavy swat can break your armor.

[VerrucktMedic]

How about we just get rid of the damage and instead make the difficulty hard by mechanics instead of just buffing numbers and removing two of the three downs and then calling it a difficulty.

[Fugu]

In order to make the difficulties both challenging AND fair, overkill needs to also fix all their broken things like immortal converts, GLs, shotguns and dmrs

[uNorthodoX]

Their intended damage was supposed to be 70-ish IIRC (Don't quote me on this, I heard this from another discussion)

Their damage do need a rework, they're the reason converts are hillariously effective on OD

[GlitchFling108]

Nerf Bronco cops pleaae also

[Sovereign Star]

That's the point of "One Down".

[Sterling]

Originally posted by VerrucktMedic:

How about we just get rid of the damage and instead make the difficulty hard by mechanics instead of just buffing numbers and removing two of the three downs and then calling it a difficulty.

How dare you make a reasonable suggestion to make a difficulty rely on actual challenge instead of pumped up numbers?

[Copy & Cat]

Reworking OD was one of the things they mentioned in the starstream, less bloated values, better AI with new mechanics

[Duck]

Originally posted by Angel Terminator:

Reworking OD was one of the things they mentioned in the starstream, less bloated values, better AI with new mechanics

I don't really mind that they throw in some crime spree modifier and/or the medic/minigun dozer in exchange for less spongy/deadly ZEAL

[Hoxi]

Originally posted by uNorthodoXgj:

Their intended damage was supposed to be 70-ish IIRC (Don't quote me on this, I heard this from another discussion)

Their damage do need a rework, they're the reason converts are hillariously effective on OD

75, it's 225 because of the damage multiplier for the m4_npc, which is 3x on One Down. For some reason that one is missing from OVERKILL all the way to DW, and we have most enemies dealing up to 20 damage maximum. It's a mess.

It's funny how can you make everything viable on One Down, while making it less ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ but more punishing by lowering or removing said multiplier (though that's a bandaid fix because a lot of ♥♥♥♥ would still be broken, and not just for One Down) and decreasing the damage grace period for bots and players.

90 damage per shot and 0.1s grace period makes everything usable, while also making dodge less op in comparison to armor, basically making the difficulty more challenging and fair. The best part is that you only need to change 2 values (except for the bots grace period, which currently uses a global value, but I'm pretty sure it's not hard to make it change according to the difficulty).

Yes, I'm aware that enemy health and stuff like that would still be a thing, but this is just how easy making everything usable without taking away the challenge would be. With the amount of things that need fixing/tweaking, we got a long way before getting there.

[grishenko [NOR]]

But why?

Two years ago DW was insanely hard, you would never do any objectives or move during assaults. After all the power creep and nerfs I can now run around DW like an idiot, can stand in the open and tank with a ICTV.

From what I understand OD was introduced to create a difficulty that was difficult again. Sure we would all like smarter AI, but making OD easier I am strongly against - dont make it as trivial as DW!

[Draza]

Originally posted by Sovereign Star:

That's the point of "One Down".

The point of One Down is being very hard, but difficulty isn't only achieved by BS enemy damage values.

[VerrucktMedic]

Originally posted by Sterling:

Originally posted by VerrucktMedic:

How about we just get rid of the damage and instead make the difficulty hard by mechanics instead of just buffing numbers and removing two of the three downs and then calling it a difficulty.

How dare you make a reasonable suggestion to make a difficulty rely on actual challenge instead of pumped up numbers?

My mistake how could I have been so blind? I'm sorry Almir I have disgraced you.

[VerrucktMedic]

Originally posted by Angel Terminator:

Reworking OD was one of the things they mentioned in the starstream, less bloated values, better AI with new mechanics

Can I get a link to this stream? That's assuming it was archived, but still I would like to watch this.

[Hoxi]

Originally posted by grishenko NOR:

But why?

Two years ago DW was insanely hard, you would never do any objectives or move during assaults. After all the power creep and nerfs I can now run around DW like an idiot, can stand in the open and tank with a ICTV.

From what I understand OD was introduced to create a difficulty that was difficult again. Sure we would all like smarter AI, but making OD easier I am strongly against - dont make it as trivial as DW!

I'm pretty sure they never intended for them to deal 225 damage per shot and make lots of perk decks less useful, they already made these enemies have no damage fall off and have pin-point accuracy, increased the enemy spawn limit (very stupid choice as it makes them unresponsive) and made them more common. Plus the one down feature.

Lowering their damage (around 90-110, because of the amount of damage resistance bonuses) but decreasing the damage grace period to 0.1s makes fighting them fair, but you have way less room for error against anything, not just against 225-damage enemies like it is now because they can one or two-shot you. At that point, tanking with pure armor against 3 enemies is not going to be better for you than it is now, and dodge would have to proc more often because you can get hit much more often.

Originally posted by IC-R Draza:

Originally posted by Sovereign Star:

That's the point of "One Down".

The point of One Down is being very hard, but difficulty isn't only achieved by BS enemy damage values.

Which is not hard to partially "fix" in a couple of seconds. But considering SWATs on Normal deal 10 times more damage than other enemies and FBI SWATs and FBI Heavy SWATs deal 20 damage on OVERKILL, Mayhem and Death Wish, we definitely got issues all across the board.

[Copy & Cat]

Originally posted by VerrucktMedic:

Originally posted by Angel Terminator:

Reworking OD was one of the things they mentioned in the starstream, less bloated values, better AI with new mechanics

Can I get a link to this stream? That's assuming it was archived, but still I would like to watch this.

http://steamcommunity.com/games/218620/announcements/detail/1307578531240258162
here's the announcement with the time so you can skip when watching the stream