Anti air weapon need buff, Alot

[Fight For Lewd Your mom]

when we discuss anti-aircraft weapons, we talk about accuracy, high muzzle velocity and extremely high rate of fire, and what we have on planetside, g40 ranger extremely low muzzle velocity, Ammunition is so bad that other than shooting the plane above your head from 100m away, you can't do anything else, talking about the skyguard, really, you guys think use a cannon with a muzzle velocity of 200m/s to do AA job is a good idea? It's almost impossible to hit a plane if they're not very, very close to us and are busy killing something else, and the g30 walker is pretty good, the muzzle velocity of 1000m/s is great, very suitable as a long range anti-aircraft cannon until the dev increased the projectile's spread to ridiculous levels, ridiculous enough that a liberator flew high enough and didn't care that it was being fired at by several g30 walkers, because all incoming bullets missed but the liberator wasn't small. Last talking about lock-on rockets, trash, just one burst of ESF was unable to catch up and self-destructed in the air, even though the shooter had a hard time locking-on them.

[Foxassassin]

AA has been in a bad spot for a long time.

"It's a determent" Okay, so they're either leave and go to a new fight, get one of their ground friends to C4 the helpless AA vehicle, or in cases like Liberators and Galaxies, just out DPS AA vehicles.

Worse is when you get people that sit so far up the elevation on the AA guns cannot raise high enough to hit them.

And yeah. The Skyguard is an absolute joke unless you have a wall of people in tanks, which are then sitting ducks for literally anything else. They can't fight infantry worth a damn, and any other armor will shred them, which means air can just roll back in.

Don't even get me started on the AA Phalanx turrets.

"Just use air to counter air" Well, besides that breaking the Rock-paper-scissors ideology, good luck against a rolling death ball of aircraft because it seems like anyone who flies is buddy-buddy with everyone else. And getting your own deathball of aircraft shouldn't be the only counter.

Lock-on launchers have been terrible for a -long- time, getting decent infantry launchers would help mitigate this but...

Then there's the problem with the Masamune that was never fixed. In the NSO update they broke it. It's a fly-by-wire rocket. They now have drop which was confirmed a bug and their velocities were dropped by a stupid amount which was also a confirmed bug and got semi- fixed. They never got back to their intended projectile values.

I used to use the Masamune as an AA rocket because at least it was reliable. But with an extremely heavy drop and borderline no speed. It's useless outside short ranges.

[Monstruo]

You need more skill and experience with it, right now it is perfectly balanced.

if you don't believe me, try a couple of hours an ESF and you will see that the average time of life is 1-3 min, everything can see you in the sky and everything can hurt you, Skyguard and AA turrets can hit at 700m and everything that flies below 300m is easily killed.

[Wilgryf]

Originally posted by Foxassassin:

AA has been in a bad spot for a long time.

"It's a determent" Okay, so they're either leave and go to a new fight, get one of their ground friends to C4 the helpless AA vehicle, or in cases like Liberators and Galaxies, just out DPS AA vehicles.

Worse is when you get people that sit so far up the elevation on the AA guns cannot raise high enough to hit them.

And yeah. The Skyguard is an absolute joke unless you have a wall of people in tanks, which are then sitting ducks for literally anything else. They can't fight infantry worth a damn, and any other armor will shred them, which means air can just roll back in.

Don't even get me started on the AA Phalanx turrets.

"Just use air to counter air" Well, besides that breaking the Rock-paper-scissors ideology, good luck against a rolling death ball of aircraft because it seems like anyone who flies is buddy-buddy with everyone else. And getting your own deathball of aircraft shouldn't be the only counter.

Lock-on launchers have been terrible for a -long- time, getting decent infantry launchers would help mitigate this but...

Then there's the problem with the Masamune that was never fixed. In the NSO update they broke it. It's a fly-by-wire rocket. They now have drop which was confirmed a bug and their velocities were dropped by a stupid amount which was also a confirmed bug and got semi- fixed. They never got back to their intended projectile values.

I used to use the Masamune as an AA rocket because at least it was reliable. But with an extremely heavy drop and borderline no speed. It's useless outside short ranges.

Max AA is close to being usable but still weak af

[Cora]

only AA i think is under powered right now in comparison to "balanced" not "realistic" gameplay are the construction AA turrets. they were made really weak back when they functioned with AI modules ...but when manually controlled, retained a greater damage profile... however, after the fortification update, the dev that chose which profile to use gave the stats from the AI setting to the now Default manual only damage tier making it hit so meekly... you'd need three players occupying three separate turrets and attacking the same target to "almost" match the damage of a Skyguard which needs 3 skyguards to kill a liberator on his attack run. so you'd need nine... NINE construction turret AA to kill a lib in the TTK of his attack run.

a lot of people get Hyper upset about mistakes by the devs and demanding that human being lose his job over a couple lines of code... that is stupid. the devs have a very solid game. its not realistic... but right now and for the most part, it's balanced on a knife's edge... with only overlooked things like this being glaringly obvious.

i challenge players to seek solutions... not retribution. after all this is a game. you dont DESERVE to have it. but they dont deserve to lose their job over something so minor.

edit: another overlooked thing was that aquatic weapons cant fit NV & HV sights. this leaves no free2play alternative to the infravision implant when fighting underwater. i wish more players would make a stink about this as i feel likle i am shooting blind mice with a shotgun with my infravision implant vs their complete blindness.

[Clickshe]

I honestly would welcome a dedicated AA vehicle both actually AA gun vehicle and long range missile AA vehicle which is relatively fast. Something between a Harasser and Lightning in terms of movement speed.

[Chronocide]

Higher arch of fire for the armor penetration rounds on the lightning would help.

It's rather annoying, having to find a hill to aim up enough to shoot down the mosquitoes and such (seriously, this can be done and slays them quickly if they are arrogant enough to hold still...).

Anti-vehicle turrets too, but only if the flyer goes low enough since you can't use the hill to aim higher.

Would be nice to have arch of fire being a upgrade of some sort for every weapon, rather than only AA weapons being able to aim up.

Stealth armor on the lightning helps a lot on the AA end. Best if you can shoot them while they are engaged with something else.

[Clickshe]

Originally posted by Chronocide:

Higher arch of fire for the armor penetration rounds on the lightning would help.

It's rather annoying, having to find a hill to aim up enough to shoot down the mosquitoes and such (seriously, this can be done and slays them quickly if they are arrogant enough to hold still...).

Anti-vehicle turrets too, but only if the flyer goes low enough since you can't use the hill to aim higher.

Would be nice to have arch of fire being a upgrade of some sort for every weapon, rather than only AA weapons being able to aim up.

Stealth armor on the lightning helps a lot on the AA end. Best if you can shoot them while they are engaged with something else.

These are not, will not and won't EVER be enough my guy. Air power is WAY too dominating at this point and most convenient for travel too. There is a good reason modern military around the world have actually some good stuff Anti Air. BECAUSE IT IS THAT Fing POWERFUL!

So basically there is two options. Something that either is able to say F you for being in the air or the air power is completely removed from the game.

[Eightball]

AA used to be quite good, even the Skyguard was viable. For example the AA turrets of bases were things to be feared and as such any team that hoped for air support in the attack prioritized taking them down.

Back when AA was good (manpad, vehicular and turret) it actually took more teamwork to meet a foe on the field than it does now. Infantry took out the AA which allowed friendly air to deal with enemy armor which then allowed friendly armor to deal with enemy infantry.

But then AA was nerfed to the ground in the name of 'balance' which really did nothing more than promote more lone wolfing and less team play since threats became essentially less asymmetric.

Yeah symmetry...

[Chronocide]

Originally posted by Clickshe:

Originally posted by Chronocide:

Higher arch of fire for the armor penetration rounds on the lightning would help.

It's rather annoying, having to find a hill to aim up enough to shoot down the mosquitoes and such (seriously, this can be done and slays them quickly if they are arrogant enough to hold still...).

Anti-vehicle turrets too, but only if the flyer goes low enough since you can't use the hill to aim higher.

Would be nice to have arch of fire being a upgrade of some sort for every weapon, rather than only AA weapons being able to aim up.

Stealth armor on the lightning helps a lot on the AA end. Best if you can shoot them while they are engaged with something else.

These are not, will not and won't EVER be enough my guy. Air power is WAY too dominating at this point and most convenient for travel too. There is a good reason modern military around the world have actually some good stuff Anti Air. BECAUSE IT IS THAT Fing POWERFUL!

Nah, not enough. But it would be better they make lots of little fixes in lots of little areas, rather than trying to fix them with one or two heavy handed strikes.

I think (non-MAX) infantry need more AA options.

Vehicles too, but less so.

Would Really like if they could think outside the box to more than just bullets or missiles...

[Clickshe]

Originally posted by Chronocide:

Originally posted by Clickshe:

These are not, will not and won't EVER be enough my guy. Air power is WAY too dominating at this point and most convenient for travel too. There is a good reason modern military around the world have actually some good stuff Anti Air. BECAUSE IT IS THAT Fing POWERFUL!

Nah, not enough. But it would be better they make lots of little fixes in lots of little areas, rather than trying to fix them with one or two heavy handed strikes.

I think (non-MAX) infantry need more AA options.

Vehicles too, but less so.

Would Really like if they could think outside the box to more than just bullets or missiles...

Well... We probably could go DEW direction but, I would imagine they would start whining a lot. (Directed Energy Weapons.) Although I would imagine it is the only option soon.

[Chronocide]

Originally posted by Clickshe:

Originally posted by Chronocide:

Nah, not enough. But it would be better they make lots of little fixes in lots of little areas, rather than trying to fix them with one or two heavy handed strikes.

I think (non-MAX) infantry need more AA options.

Vehicles too, but less so.

Would Really like if they could think outside the box to more than just bullets or missiles...

Well... We probably could go DEW direction but, I would imagine they would start whining a lot. (Directed Energy Weapons.) Although I would imagine it is the only option soon.

Air mines, perhaps some infantry deploy-able bomb balloons, perhaps?

Or what about some sort of giant spider web type thing....maybe that one is too silly, just trying to think of what would counter flyers that isn't just another flyer.

What about weather manipulation? Might be too large scale to compute.

Alternatively, if aircraft required fuel, that would sure limit them. If they just had to land every so often...

Oh, what about a ranged hacking device for aircraft? Maybe not total control, and the hacker would probably be very vulnerable during...

[Clickshe]

Originally posted by Chronocide:

Originally posted by Clickshe:

Well... We probably could go DEW direction but, I would imagine they would start whining a lot. (Directed Energy Weapons.) Although I would imagine it is the only option soon.

Air mines, perhaps some infantry deploy-able bomb balloons, perhaps?

Or what about some sort of giant spider web type thing....maybe that one is too silly, just trying to think of what would counter flyers that isn't just another flyer.

What about weather manipulation? Might be too large scale to compute.

Alternatively, if aircraft required fuel, that would sure limit them. If they just had to land every so often...

Oh, what about a ranged hacking device for aircraft? Maybe not total control, and the hacker would probably be very vulnerable during...

Air mines wouldn't work. The players would easily avoid them and considering the skill I see. They would only be considered just nothing.

Too silly idea, yeah.

That would be too tough to actually code and honestly it would hardly make a difference.

If air craft would require fuel it would seriously hamper them but, the player base would start being a B real hard about it.

They would complain a lot about this and extremely difficult to implement.

[Chronocide]

Hmmm...

Engineer:
AA turret option. Either manned version or automated turret. Doesn't have to be amazing, just something to harrass flyers as a supplemental function.

Light Assault:
Was watching the original trailer. Light assault being able to move fast and high enough to get on top of a galaxy...that would sure change things. Even if only to drop C4.

Infiltrator:
Some sort of gun that lauches a more permanent detector for just that target vehicle. Like a detecting beacon that affixes itself to the outside of the aircraft and must be shot off to remove. Perhaps has to lock on to deploy. Hmm...perhaps too powerful.

Heavy Assault:
Single NC-10 burster for heavy weapon.

Medic:
...no idea

MAX:
Compared to the other infantry, these guys need it less.

[Clickshe]

Originally posted by Chronocide:

Hmmm...

Engineer:
AA turret option. Either manned version or automated turret. Doesn't have to be amazing, just something to harrass flyers as a supplemental function.

Light Assault:
Was watching the original trailer. Light assault being able to move fast and high enough to get on top of a galaxy...that would sure change things. Even if only to drop C4.

Infiltrator:
Some sort of gun that lauches a more permanent detector for just that target vehicle. Like a detecting beacon that affixes itself to the outside of the aircraft and must be shot off to remove. Perhaps has to lock on to deploy. Hmm...perhaps too powerful.

Heavy Assault:
Single NC-10 burster for heavy weapon.

Medic:
...no idea

MAX:
Compared to the other infantry, these guys need it less.

Hmm... Solid ideas. I wouldn't bother increasing the task load on battle medics though.

Engineer. manned? No. Automated? I would support the idea.

Light Assault. They probably would get shot out of the sky before they could do anything to air craft, besides a one volley of rocket launcher + they would become air road kill.

Heavy assault, I can only give a big maybe.

I still stand by my idea of either all four get a specialized Anti Air vehicle or air power should mostly be disabled until air and anti air interactions have been brought to equal level. Because air power will continue being absolutely over powered until solutions are brought on to the table. Unless the pilots of Reavers, Mosquitoes, Scythes, Dervishes and Valkyries, are willing to come together to discuss proper balancing of these air craft or OK specialized anti air vehicle, I am not going to hear it from you.

It is so unfun to fight against air superiority.

Currently, air power is way too dominant. I do admit that it is odd that I left out galaxy but, what I have been seeing is, that it is seriously under utilized and should be utilized a whole lot more considering the fact that it honestly isn't that bad and it is suffering from the same problem of air superiority fighting air craft just as much or if not more.

[Wilgryf]

I have few ideas
Infantry:
HA:
- dumbfired short range (detonation after set range) flak rocket with high projectile velocity with long draw time (long
animation before being able to fire when switching to this weapon) intended as anti ESF/Valk weapon
- laser guided but barely maneouvrable, very long range HE rocket that arms after flying some distance and start at very slow projectile speed but accelerates over few seconds to veery high speed with more limited ammo as anti lib/galaxy weapon, can be shot down
- increase damage of existing AA homing rocket launcher to oneshot or if more hp for esf is equipped set on fire said esf but increase lock on time (force them to do bombing runs instead of cosplaying as assault helicopters)

Infil
- I proposed some time ago for infil to get some varied recon tools INSTEAD of cloak, one of them was laser targed designator which would constantly spot painted target, and give are allies info about them as if they had respective implants (distance from target, target health)
and decrease lock on time for that target a bit

Engiee
- You can already damage esf severly with anti-material rifle/aa turret if they try cosplaying as assault helicopters but some sort of automatic short range flash turret to blind the pilot if they come really close (could interfere with steering a bit)

Max
- I think they are more or less fine, slightly bigger magazine or accuracy maybe

Vechicles:

Skyguard
- leave as is except being able to deploy lightning with it to vastly reduce spread but with turret turning restriction (90 degrees to each side and up)

Phalanx
- make it flak, and more damage or longer time till overheat

I'm not sure about ranger, walker or other small aa vehicle turrets beacause I didn't play them a lot