What's with some Persona "fans" seething about optional mods?

[FinnishPoner]

Some guy made a mod that changes Yukari's body to make her "look more corpulent, more stuffed where the eyes can't escape" and the "fans" got so angry about it that they got Nexus and Gamebanana to take it down from their sites.

It's still on LoversLab but no idea if it stays up there either when you remember their history of taking down mods like Fire Emblem Engage mod that fixed it's localization.

I'm truly confused why would anyone get so angry about optional mods that you're not obligated to look at or download? Why shouldn't people be allowed to create any kinds of mods they wan't with a game they bought with their own money and share it with other people who may also enjoy them? Why are you purposely searching for mods that you clearly hate and then get mad when you see them and harass the creators and anyone who uses them? What's the point?

This mod didn't even remove nor changed her clothes, probably one of the most tamest mods i have ever seen and it still somehow made people angry. Do Persona "fans" even know that the games have a lot more wilder and lewdier outfits that Atlus themselves put in there?

Also, the fact that mod sites also remove mods that they don't like, find offensive or under pressure is highly concerning for the future of freedom of speech and creativity in video games.

We are at the point of Games Code Authority were mods are being banned for simply making a female character slightly more attractive but people will still insist nothing is happening, wokeness didn't affect gaming, Sarkeesian had no influence whatsoever etc.

It's getting really ridiculous, what's the point of a modding site if everything some random nobodies don't like gets deleted? The argument that "it's their site, they can allow whatever mods they wan't to on their sites" doesn't work either when it's clear that there's pressure being put on them and someone banning anything they personally don't like.

And again, this mod was one of the most tamest mods ever. They have a lot and i mean, a lot more messed up mods on their sites.

[Arisato]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Viper:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Yürei:

Uhhhh, I'm going to assume you haven't played Persona 3 before.

and when do you attack humans.

We beat the ♥♥♥♥ out of Takaya and Jin. Twice.

[Viper]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Yürei:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Viper:

and when do you attack humans. The only fighting is in the dungeon levels.

Like I said, I'm assuming you haven't played Persona 3 before. I won't spoil it for you.

Honestly, I'm surprised you said that if you played P4 or P5 too.

by all means tell me. II assume you don't know of a case if not.

[Lynfinity]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Viper:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Lynfinity:

*Takaya shooting an innocent civilian left the chat*

seriously thats an evil boss and his actions and a cutscene..lol That is not you doing anything at all.

Who said it has to come from you and your team? You claimed there's no "human-to-human" violence whatsoever, I told you the first example that came to my mind, thus immediately proving your statement wrong.

[Viper]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Lynfinity:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Viper:

seriously thats an evil boss and his actions and a cutscene..lol That is not you doing anything at all.

Who said it has to come from you and your team? You claimed there's no "human-to-human" violence whatsoever, I told you the first example that came to my mind, thus immediately proving your statement wrong.

Sorry but thats just a story thing and does not count in any way whatsoever. I assumed you knew w hat I meant when where talking about YOU the protagonist participating in violence against humans but I guess not. Would have thought it was obvious. Anyway that is completely off the topic of this thread.

[Yürei]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Arisato:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Viper:

and when do you attack humans.

We beat the ♥♥♥♥ out of Takaya and Jin. Twice.

To add to this.

P4 We fight Adachi
P5 We fight Akechi
P5R We fight Marui and later beat up each other with our fist

So I'm not sure how anyone could say that if they played any of the other modern Persona games.

[Wiegs]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Viper:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Lynfinity:

It's 16. The age of consent in Japan is 16. And a cherry on top is that it was 13 until just recently - the government raised the age of consent from 13 to 16 in June or July of 2023.

Thats not the case of the United States. This game is not just sold in Japan.

It's a japanese game that is set in Japan, why should they care about the laws of a country on the other side of the globe ? You can pack up your american self-centered views and go back to complaining on twitter, here is really not the place to push that...

[Splinter of Chaos]

The age of consent in Tokyo is 18. Does that mean Tokyo is American since only Americans think you shouldn't sexualize characters under that age? The age of consent in Italy is 14. What does the age of consent have to do with this discussion? Since when did legality become the primary decider of what we think, believe, or feel?

[Lynfinity]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Splinter of Chaos:

Since when did legality become the primary decider of what we think, believe, or feel?

So how do you guys feel about Atlus, then? How do you feel about their choice for one of Yukari's costumes, which is definitely leaning far more towards ♥♥♥ appeal compared to the mod in question?

[Dank Sidious]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Wiegs:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Viper:

Thats not the case of the United States. This game is not just sold in Japan.

It's a japanese game that is set in Japan, why should they care about the laws of a country on the other side of the globe ? You can pack up your american self-centered views and go back to complaining on twitter, here is really not the place to push that...

The whole argument on Japan's Age of consent was such a gross misrepresentation of reality and always used completely incorrectly in argumentation as some weird gotcha.

While the nationwide age of consent was 13 every municipality had local laws that set it higher than that. There was really no place in Japan where you could actually go legally porking 13 years olds. That was complete BS perpetuated by people who didn't care enough to research further than the first link they found on google.

[Tracido]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Viper:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Tracido:

I will say this though, some self righteous asshats worrying about pixels in personal mods are as worthless as humans come on this planet, considering the issues more important.

Such a completely dumb comment. Yea there worse than serial murderers aren't they. See where your priorities lie.

Nowhere near as sick and worthless as yours. Are you hunting Epstein's client list? Otherwise ♥♥♥♥ off with your fake righteousness

[Queen Nothing]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Lynfinity:

So how do you guys feel about Atlus, then? How do you feel about their choice for one of Yukari's costumes, which is definitely leaning far more towards ♥♥♥ appeal compared to the mod in question?

Not a guy, but whether it's a mod or the developers, sexualizing the teenage cast is not okay, especially in Persona.

Persona goes out of its way to ground itself in the familiar before developing its narratives about sociology, psychology, philosophy, relationships ... in short, Persona is deeply thematic. It has things to say about Life (and Death), and is willing to take the player on a 3-digit-hour journey to land its big points. When you're making a global product, and your narrative is intentionally literary and gets into realistic, difficult themes ... you do take on responsibilities because your creative choices will naturally be examined for what they say.

So the same game with a massive thematic story that puts its entire impact on what it says about Life, Death, and Sacrifice ... loses some of its sincerity when it enables the player to dress the teen female cast in fetishwear. If Atlus' creative team is more interested in titillating a disturbed player than protecting the credibility of the characters and narrative, that doesn't speak well of how seriously you should take the rest of the experience. Atlus does their own damage to the product by including/enabling sexualization of the cast.

[Yürei]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Queen Nothing:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Lynfinity:

So how do you guys feel about Atlus, then? How do you feel about their choice for one of Yukari's costumes, which is definitely leaning far more towards ♥♥♥ appeal compared to the mod in question?

Not a guy, but whether it's a mod or the developers, sexualizing the teenage cast is not okay, especially in Persona.

Persona goes out of its way to ground itself in the familiar before developing its narratives about sociology, psychology, philosophy, relationships ... in short, Persona is deeply thematic. It has things to say about Life (and Death), and is willing to take the player on a 3-digit-hour journey to land its big points. When you're making a global product, and your narrative is intentionally literary and gets into realistic, difficult themes ... you do take on responsibilities because your creative choices will naturally be examined for what they say.

So the same game with a massive thematic story that puts its entire impact on what it says about Life, Death, and Sacrifice ... loses some of its sincerity when it enables the player to dress the teen female cast in fetishwear. If Atlus' creative team is more interested in titillating a disturbed player than protecting the credibility of the characters and narrative, that doesn't speak well of how seriously you should take the rest of the experience. Atlus does their own damage to the product by including/enabling sexualization of the cast.

Well I have to ask then. If this affects you this much, why did you support Persona 3 Portable by buying it? It contains exactly what you're against. Also, I find it quite funny that mention the female side, but completely ignore the male side with its swimwear and tuxedo outfits (aka butler outfits which is definitely a ♥♥♥♥♥♥ to some).

[Clotho]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Queen Nothing:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Lynfinity:

So how do you guys feel about Atlus, then? How do you feel about their choice for one of Yukari's costumes, which is definitely leaning far more towards ♥♥♥ appeal compared to the mod in question?

Not a guy, but whether it's a mod or the developers, sexualizing the teenage cast is not okay, especially in Persona.

Persona goes out of its way to ground itself in the familiar before developing its narratives about sociology, psychology, philosophy, relationships ... in short, Persona is deeply thematic. It has things to say about Life (and Death), and is willing to take the player on a 3-digit-hour journey to land its big points. When you're making a global product, and your narrative is intentionally literary and gets into realistic, difficult themes ... you do take on responsibilities because your creative choices will naturally be examined for what they say.

So the same game with a massive thematic story that puts its entire impact on what it says about Life, Death, and Sacrifice ... loses some of its sincerity when it enables the player to dress the teen female cast in fetishwear. If Atlus' creative team is more interested in titillating a disturbed player than protecting the credibility of the characters and narrative, that doesn't speak well of how seriously you should take the rest of the experience. Atlus does their own damage to the product by including/enabling sexualization of the cast.

its a f**** video game, nerd. Devs can do whatever they want.

[Lynfinity]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Queen Nothing:

-snip-

Sooo, is it only a problem if they are "sexualizing teen cast"? Would the game not "lose some of its sincerity" if they were older?

Does NieR: Automata loses some of its sincerity by allowing you to run around with 2B's ♥♥♥♥♥ cheeks/9S without pants/A2 with exposed midriff (also knowing she practically has no clothes on anyway)?

Does NieR: Replicant loses some of its sincerity by just having Kaine in general?

Where exactly is your stance in this?

[Splinter of Chaos]

Diposting pertama kali oleh Lynfinity:

Diposting pertama kali oleh Splinter of Chaos:

Since when did legality become the primary decider of what we think, believe, or feel?

So how do you guys feel about Atlus, then? How do you feel about their choice for one of Yukari's costumes, which is definitely leaning far more towards ♥♥♥ appeal compared to the mod in question?

Meh? I don't really care about it. It neither excites me nor does it send me into a rage to yell at people on twitter for being wrong on the internet. I don't see anything wrong with the mod, either. I don't think sexualizing Yukari will cause harm to real-world people--most studies on ♥♥♥ and violence show a negative correlation, if any.

But how I feel about it is totally irrelevant. I can understand why gamebannana didn't want the mod. I can understand why some wanted it. I can understand why some people are made uncomfortable, both by the mod and the in-game content. Everyone has their own way.

It's just if we were to base what's okay or not based on Japanese consent and pornography laws, you'd have to think it's morally repulsive to be able to see your significant other's genitalia. Legal arguments are a poor substitute for independent thinking.

Diposting pertama kali oleh Queen Nothing:

So the same game with a massive thematic story that puts its entire impact on what it says about Life, Death, and Sacrifice ... loses some of its sincerity when it enables the player to dress the teen female cast in fetishwear.

Looking at it this way, I feel like more the issue here, for me, is the tonal disconnect. I remember playing an RPG a while back that let me put bunny masks on all the characters--and they looked silly and so of coarse I did--but then in cut scenes a character would be saying something really dramatic while their face was covered in a silly mask. Moment that were supposed to be traumatic were instead hilarious.

I feel like next to the themes of life, death, and sacrifice, ♥♥♥ relates to all of them quite well, but Persona doesn't really discuss ♥♥♥ itself and I think I agree that this costume (and some of the other sets of costumes), feel tonally disconnected.

But at the same time, I do feel like that's the point of extra costumes in a game--to provide something tonally different for mild amusement. Just don't have them wear goofy masks in cutscenes, I think.