My allies are attacking my client state?

[White Eagle]

I am playing as Sparta and I have Athens and Macedon as military allies, and we are on very friendly terms with each other. We where at war with Epirus but I conquered both of their provinces and on the final province I decided to subjugate them. I kept a province for me and let them have their other province and they became a client state of mine.

Shouldn't my allies stop attacking my client state? I want to keep Epirus as a client state and groom them to war with me, but my allies are attacking? Doesn't seem right now that I pull the strings, plus the client state is still kind of jerky to me :(

Whats up with that?

[Sgt. Flaw]

From what I understand client states are a bit more independant than they should be...I've gotten peace treaties offers from factions that where at war with my client states...

What would be nice is if you retained control over your client states diplomacy...they are nothing more than a pain in the ass right now.

[Fear2288]

Yeah this is one of my gripes with the game too and really makes creating client states kind of useless.

It would be an easy fix though. They could change it so that as soon as a faction was made into a client state its diplomatic stance (allies, enemies, etc) was wiped clean save for being subject to your faction. In addition they could also bring back the ability to ask a faction to make peace with another. IIRC this ability was in one of the past games but I can't recall which one.

[Ironstar]

Originally posted by Fear2288:

Yeah this is one of my gripes with the game too and really makes creating client states kind of useless.

It would be an easy fix though. They could change it so that as soon as a faction was made into a client state its diplomatic stance (allies, enemies, etc) was wiped clean save for being subject to your faction. In addition they could also bring back the ability to ask a faction to make peace with another. IIRC this ability was in one of the past games but I can't recall which one.

So long as the reset on the client state diplomacy only happens when you subjugate them through war I like that basics of that idea, break ties to former allys and such for that would fit nicely.
If its you (or another faction) negotiateing them to become a client though diplomatic means, then no it would just break the game. Say your moveing onto their lands, aiming for full conquest to build your lands up, then another faction takes them on as a client through diplomatic means, it means your war would end with them, regardless of if you are at war with the new parent state for them or not would end. you would then have to declare war onto them and the new parent state.
Other side of the coin with that is when you move into a new area and take on a weaker nation as a client to strengthen your borders, give support in a greater war with another faction ect. and your relying on them to give you backup aginst a common foe. you would most likely not have that option untill they decided to join the war again. all you have done in that situation by makeing them a client would be to take them out of a war you wanted them to help you fight.

[Fear2288]

Originally posted by Falcata:

Originally posted by Fear2288:

Yeah this is one of my gripes with the game too and really makes creating client states kind of useless.

It would be an easy fix though. They could change it so that as soon as a faction was made into a client state its diplomatic stance (allies, enemies, etc) was wiped clean save for being subject to your faction. In addition they could also bring back the ability to ask a faction to make peace with another. IIRC this ability was in one of the past games but I can't recall which one.

So long as the reset on the client state diplomacy only happens when you subjugate them through war I like that basics of that idea, break ties to former allys and such for that would fit nicely.
If its you (or another faction) negotiateing them to become a client though diplomatic means, then no it would just break the game. Say your moveing onto their lands, aiming for full conquest to build your lands up, then another faction takes them on as a client through diplomatic means, it means your war would end with them, regardless of if you are at war with the new parent state for them or not would end. you would then have to declare war onto them and the new parent state.
Other side of the coin with that is when you move into a new area and take on a weaker nation as a client to strengthen your borders, give support in a greater war with another faction ect. and your relying on them to give you backup aginst a common foe. you would most likely not have that option untill they decided to join the war again. all you have done in that situation by makeing them a client would be to take them out of a war you wanted them to help you fight.

Yeah, I meant if you were at war with a faction and then made them into a client state.

However I feel like if you were to do it diplomatically (i.e. not being at war) the client state should then at least automatically be at peace with any and all allies or other client states you have.

[realist123]

I don't mind two of my client states fighting each other, or one client state and another defensive ally of mine fighting. But OP said military alliance so that is kind-off different. I just see it as tribal infighting that doesn't concern me.

Imo client states is only good later on when you are actually powerful enough to protect them and you are too lazy to conquer regions by force. Early on it is just good for the extra cash, but the political climate will probably not be stable and you can't help defend them.

[Rabidnid]

It takes a while and some effort to get vassal states to friendly status. Also remember to use the war target function to distract them. It took 20 years before the Etruscans were green in my last Roman play through.

[Korburss]

AI logic. You are strong, they are strong, client state is weak. Attack client states and you will not become involved due to the fact they are stronger and worth more as a ally.

[White Eagle]

2 solutions for my original post above
1) Allies drop attacks against my the state I just made my client and diplomatic relations between my client and allies are improved slightly.

or the best solution I think:

2) Allies continued aggesiveness towards my client depends how much or little respect they hold for my faction. If they like me a lot, they will stop hostilities towards my client, if they feel rather neutral towards me I may have to negotiate a cease fire between my allies and my client and if they dont care for me much but we are still allies, they may continue attacking my client state

[Gator]

Diplomacy is broke in general

[Buggus]

Originally posted by Fear2288:

Yeah this is one of my gripes with the game too and really makes creating client states kind of useless.

It would be an easy fix though. They could change it so that as soon as a faction was made into a client state its diplomatic stance (allies, enemies, etc) was wiped clean save for being subject to your faction. In addition they could also bring back the ability to ask a faction to make peace with another. IIRC this ability was in one of the past games but I can't recall which one.

I feel like it should be wiped clean but I think you should suffer diplomatsy penitly for not destroying their faction if they are hated, and their allys should still get a penilty, maybe smaller.