late game macedon army composition

[DrwHem]

i need some help on fitting out a late game macedonian army that will do well against a powerfull egypt and the tribes of northern greece. the unit roster is much deeper than i expected. this is what i currently use:
1 royal peltas general
3 ballista
2 agragonian(spelling) axemen skirmishers
1 slinger or archer
2 thorax pikemen
2 thorax swordmen
4 hoplites
5 citizen cavalry(need to replace these guys badly as they are terrible)

my weakness seems to be exploited by armies that field more or higher quality cavalry and armies with a lot of skirmisher tend to cut up my infantry.

[Jonboy]

No Heros of Ares! Shame.

[tinywars]

Why the need for three Ballista? I always go two Siege weapons nooooooooooo Cavalry as it's pointless in this game,four archer units and the rest a mix of Spear,Pike and Sword Infantry. As long as you've got Smith's in a settlement where you can upgrade armour and Weapon's you'll own all..:)

[Cxbo]

I'd take 3 ballista
Royal Peltast General
5 Javelinmen (they are far better than archers or slingers, just have way lower range...)
4 Thorax Pikemen
3 Hoplites
2 Citizen Cav (use them to flank the enemy in the rear; have them charge into the rear of your enemies)
2 Thorax Swordsmen (keep these in reserve and use them where needed)

[Spec]

3 ballistae? lol that's all you need, have fun steamrolling.

[tinywars]

İlk olarak Waffle Guy tarafından gönderildi:

I'd take 3 ballista
Royal Peltast General
5 Javelinmen (they are far better than archers or slingers, just have way lower range...)
4 Thorax Pikemen
3 Hoplites
2 Citizen Cav (use them to flank the enemy in the rear; have them charge into the rear of your enemies)
2 Thorax Swordsmen (keep these in reserve and use them where needed)

It's not about better it's about effect. Archers with Flame arrows win over any other Missile unit. It's all about balance. By having three Ballista you are wasting a good 100+ men...............

[Sun Tzu]

İlk olarak tinywars tarafından gönderildi:

Why the need for three Ballista? I always go two Siege weapons nooooooooooo Cavalry as it's pointless in this game,four archer units and the rest a mix of Spear,Pike and Sword Infantry. As long as you've got Smith's in a settlement where you can upgrade armour and Weapon's you'll own all..:)

calvary is a necessity in any armies, they need to charge down skirmishers or else those skirmishers will wipe out your infantry. Through calvary is not as good as the ones in medieval 2 where they can fight alone as the main force, stil they are good enough for screening your flanks

[Itharus]

What? Cavalry are fine, you're using them wrong.

[Ape-tier Buffoonery]

Lol Against the AI in campaign mode? 4-6 ballistas (Crazy I know but it's so fun instant routing cav with massed volleys) depending on how well your infantry can hold a line, 1 general that doesn't really matter as it shouldn't be fighting anyways. The rest should be infantry, preferably swords, with 2-4 spears on the flanks to screen cav.

If all goes according to plan the AI will take it's sweet sweet time marching towards you, have all your ballista target their general first, once he's dead start aiming for more elite melee units and cav, you don't need to kill or route them outright, just cause 50% or so casulties, if done correctly by the time the enemy meets your line with their own they'll almost immediately break, in which you proceed to just charge at their archers and watch them run. You take very minimal losses in open battle, and can pound cities into oblivion.

[Frosty]

İlk olarak tinywars tarafından gönderildi:

Why the need for three Ballista? I always go two Siege weapons nooooooooooo Cavalry as it's pointless in this game,four archer units and the rest a mix of Spear,Pike and Sword Infantry. As long as you've got Smith's in a settlement where you can upgrade armour and Weapon's you'll own all..:)

you sir are wrong calvary is not pointless, learn how to use them. and if you play on a harder challenge then normal, then no just having researched better weapons will not "own" all.

[tinywars]

İlk olarak Sun Tzu tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak tinywars tarafından gönderildi:

Why the need for three Ballista? I always go two Siege weapons nooooooooooo Cavalry as it's pointless in this game,four archer units and the rest a mix of Spear,Pike and Sword Infantry. As long as you've got Smith's in a settlement where you can upgrade armour and Weapon's you'll own all..:)

calvary is a necessity in any armies, they need to charge down skirmishers or else those skirmishers will wipe out your infantry. Through calvary is not as good as the ones in medieval 2 where they can fight alone as the main force, stil they are good enough for screening your flanks

Never had an issue with Skirmishers wiping out my infrantry and i'm sorry but i'm sure no pup when i comes to TW.......Calvarly in this era is almost if not utterly pointless. You don't need to charge down missile units if you engage the enemy................................................Learn how to use them? Sorry but i'm a little insulted by this comment,it's not rocket science,point horsey at enemy and charge or hold back horsey until enemy is engaged with you then circle around and attack from behind........How am i doing? Sorry but it seems it's you lot who need to LEARN how to fight with your troops not me as you need to use units to charge down skirmishers or think Cavalry in this theatre of Pike and Spear is in anyway a good unit choice. Having a fully armoured unit with every upgrade OWNS everything cos you have the best Weapons and Armour. How is that not right?

[Frosty]

Just because you have the "best" sword doesnt mean you know how to weild it.

[Genghison]

Ballista are a good thing when playing against AI. Most battles tend to be siege based. Ballista's are my friend (them and slingers)

[Varmint]

İlk olarak Genghison tarafından gönderildi:

Ballista are a good thing when playing against AI. Most battles tend to be siege based. Ballista's are my friend (them and slingers)

Sadly, have to agree here. AI doesn't aggressively enough counter arty on openfield - and certainly doesn't in sieges. A tad ironically, this is what I use cavalry for - counter-arty, distraction - and to chase down routing enemy to ensure they don't have to be fought again.

But as far as the combat goes - have to agree largely with @tinywars. Infantry in Rome2 is damn fast - and comparatively - cavalry too damn slow. For the more numbers with say good morale, fast pressed hoplites - you can extend your flanks to envelope the enemy - in much greater force than the half-sized cav units.
The tendency is to think intuitively about Rome2 Cavalry; that it should behave - well, as cavalry would: rapid flanks - foil skirmishers. But the inability to disengage, the relative slowness compared to spear infantry formations and the plethora of spear units and despite more HP's- nerfs the effectivenss of cav in game too much to warrant more than a few cav units in an all-purpose army.

[Moonster45]

Its all about what you want to do specifically. Against Rome, you want to counter sword infantry than has the best armour in the game so less skirmisher or javs only and would add a few shock calvery. Hellenist armies usually involves in pikes and spears so I would go for lots of Archers, swords and less calv. Usually in these situations you need minimum calv to protect your skirmishers not to attack in the rear. If you have a fast, rushing army then I would go with Javs, however, if your army consist of many pikes where your most likely to defend then mixture of slingers and archers, slingers to take down enemy skirmishers and the archers to take down infantries. My usual setup against Rome would be
4 levy pikes
Gerneral as Shock Calv
4 Thorax Swords
2 cheap archers to specifically target the general army(not for skirmishing match with others,if you do , you will lose)
2 Thesselian Calv
2 Cheapest calv to draw enemy calv out
2 Apis to win the calv and

what you want to do is to rush slowly with likes set up as a spartan shield formation and swords behind the phalanx to protect the rear of the pikes. Theses pikes are cheap and not a factor , basically a meat shield. General is behind the phalanx protected and the two cheap calv is out there drawing the enemy calv and with the apis take out the enemy calv, then the cheap calv turns and looks for skirmishers, this is vital because your pikes are vulnerable due to your lack of skirmishers. when the phalanx is close enough you will have no problem charging from the both sides with you Thes Calv since the Apis calv will hold soak up all the enemy calv so your Thess is free, Thsselian Calv with the stempede is vicious, 100+ charge bonus, aand not to expensive either. During this time your front line of Phalanx should be crumbling against pretty much any decent infantry and skirmishers so you must reinforce with thorax, they will hold for quiet a while and then the Gerneral charges head on in the middle for a knockout. If your Apis is still alive, you have surrounded the enemy 100 percent and hopefully the enemy general has nowhere to go while your cheap archers will take free shots at enemy general and hopefully take him out. This strategy is all about timing.