Why carthage is so weak?

[Kael]

Yea - i simply understand it. Carthage gets beaten all the time and when i play it myself its cancer. You get like in war with 6 nations in the first 3 rounds. If you decline it your satellite states get beaten OR will become so strong that they can beat you.

Also i dont undertsand why you can just build T0 units while EVERY OTHER EMPIRE in the whole entire map can build T1 units.

[Armchair Civilian]

They're one of my favoutite factions to play, but i do think CA shafted them even more in R2 than R1.
Between so much Carthaginian territory being held by "client states", and Sicily being ahistorically subsumed into Magna Graecia, the trickinesses of playing a faction naturally dependent on mercenaries are exacerbated to the point where i feel like punching myself in the face for light relief ever turn at the start.

Carthage *become* fun to play, but the first few turns are intense.

[Kael]

that not even my main problem. the problem is:
its a trade nation but you cant trade with anybody. Everyone except your client states hates you and you are instantly in a war against 5 factions. So you dont even have enough money to have 3 armies to hold your territory.

[Armchair Civilian]

Trade is screwed in R2; there's no concept of internal trade anymore, and your best bet is just to steamroll the map to get all the special resources, with identikit settlements :(
It's pretty much a case of lifting yourself off the ground by tugging on your bootlaces until you can knee someone in the groin.

[bbolto]

Carthage's starting trade is bad because they don't have any trading resources. So yes finances are a real problem. Capture a trading resource and things start to open up pretty quick.

Massilia is usually open to trading fairly early, and they make an excellent ally if you can get that going (in the early game, Massilia performs very well, and if they join your war against Rome you have a very strong northern front without having to bring Hannibal and his elephants that way )

[Kael]

I mean - istarted the game now 8 times. i always get in war with over 5 Factions all the time. Even my sattelite states cant deal with them.
Most time i get steamrolled because of my weak units, mercenaries cost to much.

Yea "Hiring" cost are lower but the main problem are the upkeep cost.

In my actual Game New-Carthage got totally beaten and i cant support more than 1 armys. I have to delete every other. And the enemy always got 3+ Armys i have to deal with.

No chance to play this faction (i try now over 6 hours and always get deleted after 10 rounds)

I dont know how to deal with this. Really - i cant expand and i cant hold ground. my actual Match looks like this:

Rome attacks Karalis
Cessetaner overrun my Spain areas
Getules overrun New-Carthage with 3 full stack armys while i can just support 1.

I just have 5 provinces left mostly because i can hold the sea...

I have an income of +900 each round.

Romans all over the place
Getules all over north africa and i dont really cant stand my ground because of my T0 Units (i can just build Lybian Hoplyts, Carthage Hoplits, Spear-Throwers and...

oh nice.. .Syrakus declares also war on me....


Small Update:
2 Full Stacks of Cessetaner landed on my main city.
My only Army i can support are in north africa, fighting 2 Getule Armys, Romans took over Sizilia and attacking karalis

WHAT THE ♥♥♥♥!=?!?!?!?!?!

are there any mods out there to make carthage a bit stronger? this is the 9th try i play carthage and i get deleted everytime

[Armchair Civilian]

i'd got pretty much bored of R2 by the time Wrath of Sparta appeared, so idk if they've made it even nastier since; but i remember going straight for Corduba with a load of mercenaries, and ditching my client states so's i could attack them down the line, rather than getting dragged straight into wars.
Also narrowly fending off assaults with the help of boats while i got a semblance of an army together to take out Syracuse... i'm afraid i'd rather play R1 with EB than go back to R2 to remind myself exactly how to do it.

[Kael]

Its totally worse. THis is now my 9th try to play carthage. I cant see any ground.

Espeically when the satellite states getting beaten down. I also tryed a round when i decline ally-duties but then i lack money.

i think this faction is unplayable atm

after i saw rome with 8 stacks, 4 of them going to attack me - i make now my last try with carthage...
i loved this faction in Rome1. I dont know why its now so ♥♥♥♥

Edit:
Tried now the 10th.
Now i focused on Sea-Army... Yea...what could i say... got totally devastated :)

[A Generic Goblin]

The problem with Carthage isn't its roster, its actually quite good, but its geographical position. It has a very spread out position, which really screws it over, and all its settlements are rather undeveloped and easy to overrun if the AI wasn't completely incompetent. Its neighbors are very powerful as well, especially Rome, and even the Iberian factions are stronger than it due to their excellent early swords and the weakness of Carthage's early tier units. Very few swords, and even less that have good armor. Lastly, it shares provinences with members of opposing cultures, which can make PO a major problem as the culture spreads.

The easiest solution, imo, is to secure Africa first, even if it means taking out your client state Libya.

[rincewind]

In my current Carthage game I got lucky and Rome got stuck in an all war against Siracuse, the Ligurs, the Etruscan Leage and some other dudes.
I used the time to get into war against the ones attacking my client states. I secured all the way to Egypt first, making more client states in the way.
And then I turned to Iberia, where the other Carthage was obliterated. But gave me the time to defend my only city there and reconquest all with my now veteran armies.
I got several trade agreements running and I'm quite confortable with the funding.

But, so far this is my only successful campaign with Carthage. Usually things can go south really fast with them.

[MANWHATADONGA]

!. Ditch your client states.2 .Prepare to turtle.

[Alwyn]

My strategy is simlar as MANWHATDONGA's - ditch your client states - but with rapid expansion into Egypt.

As others have said, Carthage's regions are spread out, so it's easy to get stuck in a defensive war of attrition. To avoid this, I put virtually no resources into defending anything north or west of the city of Carthage. (I had one small army to hold the city of Carthage and to help Libya re-take lost regions). Almost all of my military strength went east to conquer Egypt, which was engaged in a big war with the Seleucids, allowing me to expand rapdily.

From Egypt, I went south to capture Blemmyes and the rich regions of Axum and Meroe. (This would be harder now, since I did this before the Desert Kingdoms DLC added the Kingdom of Kush to that area, but it should be possible). Trade and non-aggression deals with the Seleucids secured my eastern border. Egypt and Aethoptia became my economic centre.

This strategy worked. (Admittedly, I was only playing on Normal- maybe you're on a much higher difficulty level - but I used A More Aggressive AI mod, which makes AI factions ore likely to declare war on nations they don't like, and more likely to attack countries they're at war with.) I assumed that I was going to lose everything north or west of the city of Carthage, and I did.

This campaign - which is still going on, and is a lot of fun - is explained in more detail here: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?766513-New-Town-(Carthage-AAR)-updated-July-1-2018

You mentioned being unable to build T1 units, are you building and upgrading a barracks in each province?

Mercenaries are great but can be very expensive, especially in the early game. I relied mainly on Carthage's own units - their hoplites and cavalry are decent and their javelin-men can be surprisingly useful. In the early game, I mainly used cheap mercenaries such as Egyptian and Sabean archers.

[Feddy von Wigglestein]

There are mods that enable you to control all the territory that your client states do. It would actually be more historically accurate to do so - there were no seperate Mauretania and Libya client states in reality. They're simply there to balance Carthage because otherwise they'd probably steamroll everybody every single playthrough. Same thing with the Seleucid Empire, imagine all of that friggin territory, or most of it, under control by the player from the beginning. If you're having trouble getting anything going with Carthage and really want to get to try them out, try one of those mods. I can admit I did. Carthage's start is IMO on the same level as Epirus - another faction I've never been able to get going off the ground with vanilla starts.

[Welsh Dragon]

I'd suggest taking a look at Alwyn's AAR "New Town" over on Total War Centre.

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?766513-New-Town-(Carthage-AAR)-updated-July-1-2018

Not only is it a great story, but it also shows off some tactics you can try when playing Carthage, including sometimes having to make difficult decisions about what you're willing to sacrifice to keep you in the game.

All the Best,

Welsh Dragon.

[CelicniOploditelj]

Originally posted by Welsh Dragon:

I'd suggest taking a look at Alwyn's AAR "New Town" over on Total War Centre.

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?766513-New-Town-(Carthage-AAR)-updated-July-1-2018

Not only is it a great story, but it also shows off some tactics you can try when playing Carthage, including sometimes having to make difficult decisions about what you're willing to sacrifice to keep you in the game.

All the Best,

Welsh Dragon.

I think that was already mentioned in another post on this subject.

Originally posted by Alwyn:

My strategy is simlar as MANWHATDONGA's - ditch your client states - but with rapid expansion into Egypt.

This campaign - which is still going on, and is a lot of fun - is explained in more detail here: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?766513-New-Town-(Carthage-AAR)-updated-July-1-2018

.

I read it, didn't know such stories exists, it was awesome, where could i read more of these?

[Welsh Dragon]

Originally posted by CelicniOploditelj:

Originally posted by Welsh Dragon:

I'd suggest taking a look at Alwyn's AAR "New Town" over on Total War Centre.

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?766513-New-Town-(Carthage-AAR)-updated-July-1-2018

Not only is it a great story, but it also shows off some tactics you can try when playing Carthage, including sometimes having to make difficult decisions about what you're willing to sacrifice to keep you in the game.

All the Best,

Welsh Dragon.

I think that was already mentioned in another post on this subject.

So it is. Sorry, I missed Alwyn's post.

Originally posted by CelicniOploditelj:

Originally posted by Alwyn:

My strategy is simlar as MANWHATDONGA's - ditch your client states - but with rapid expansion into Egypt.

This campaign - which is still going on, and is a lot of fun - is explained in more detail here: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?766513-New-Town-(Carthage-AAR)-updated-July-1-2018

.

I read it, didn't know such stories exists, it was awesome, where could i read more of these?

Total War has a long history of AARs, and there's all sorts of types, from narratives, to history books, to play-by-plays.

Total War Centre has a fairly large writing community (which also tends to avoid much of the tension that TWC has a reputation for.) : http://www.twcenter.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?1353-The-Writers-Study

You'll also find my own contribution to AARs on there. "Toutatis Favours The Brave" which is telling the story of Boduognatus of the Nervii's efforts to unite Gaul against the Romans. http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?755802-“Toutatis-Favours-The-Brave”-(A-Nervii-CiG-AAR)-Updated-13th-May-2018

Over on Reddit you can find some, most noticeably Malcolio's "It's As Easy As ABC" where he is conquering the regions of Empire: Total War in Alphabetical Order and writing about it. https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/8w28j2/its_as_easy_as_abc_an_etw_aar_chapter_26_black/

There are other sites, from AAR specific sites to general writing sites where people post their work including AARs.

AARs are fun to read, and if you find yourself inspired why not have a go yourself?

All the Best,

Welsh Dragon