[SUGGESTION] Change the Wipe System

[D.A.R.K.]

So... It seems each season everything will be force wiped. This means you are playing right now, progressing through the campaign, doing side quests, leveling up your character, unlocking things, and then, suddenly, everything is gone like a deleted character.

This system suck and it will be the end of this game. What you are doing is forcing the player replay the whole game every single season, which is stupid and waste a time. From every single little thing you can do bad on your game, the literal worst thing is wasting player's time.

I understand, you want to do something similar as Rust that you wipe the world, but there's a huge difference between Rust and Once Human that isn't worth going on about right now, but I'm gonna put my list of suggestions how to fix this issue:

01. DON'T DO THIS ON PvE SERVERS:
You made a great system of separating PvP players from PvE players, which is awesome, but doing that in PvE is the same as inviting your players to not play the game again simply because PLAYERS DON'T LIKE TO WASTE TIME, stopping forcing system that forces the player to delete the character and start over, this is NOT how you make replayability, and this is DEFINITELY how you kill your game.

02. PERMANENT CHARACTERS AND SEASONAL CHARACTERS:
Like literally any other game that has this seasonal system, add the permanent character and the seasonal character system. How this work? Simple: Every time a season ends, the seasonal character turns into the permanent character and players can play with forever without losing progress. Permanent characters can't play on season events but they aren't deleted after the end of the season.

03. DO NOT TRY TO REINVENT THE WHEEL:
Multiple games already dealt with this situation before, an alive world that players can modify, create base, and seasonal events. Those games and companies already found the solution for this that players are ok with, solutions that are acceptable. Do not try to reinvent the wheel when it's already ready, copy their method and implement in your game without trying to do something new that will destroy this game.



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Edit 1:
For sake of explaining one-by-one for those who don't know:

https://www.reddit.com/r/OnceHumanOfficial/comments/18y7prk/seasonal_wipe/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWXfKH904ks&ab_channel=KingGothalionFanChannel

https://www.oncehuman.game/devBlog/20240325/37623_1144892.html

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Edit 2:
Ok... Important information... I went to the Once Human's Discord to show this thread to the developers and relative, I receive as reply those two images:

https://i.ibb.co/pbPgzsV/Once-Human-Wipe-System-01.png

https://i.ibb.co/DgCKqRd/Once-Human-Wipe-System-02.png

[D.A.R.K.]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Shahrizai:

Opprinnelig skrevet av D.A.R.K.:

and then, suddenly, everything is gone like a deleted character.

Nope... I didnt need to read the rest of your post when you are basing it on entirely wrong information.

Character level, map exploration and harvested resources (kinda) is wiped. Everything else stays. Weapon blueprints, house building blueprints, gear mods, cosmetics unlocked, starchrom, that butterfly currency... basically everything else IS carried over between seasons. Even the harvested materials through the season is "kept". I say "kept" because it goes to Eternaland as a building currency there.

So there you have it, you are sorely mistaken in your assessment that it's "like a deleted character" as its very, very, very far from the truth.

I can go even further, think about Warframe... Every six weeks your Tenno will be 0, you'll have to re-farm all 5 Tenno Schools. All planet nodes will be locked, meaning you'll lose access to Hydron, Index, daily mission, weekly mission, very single event that requires nodes unlocked... You'll lose access to Steel Path. This is what this game is doing, if this is fine for you, then have fun, it isn't fine for me.

[Spud32]

Opprinnelig skrevet av D.A.R.K.:

Opprinnelig skrevet av Spud32:

There is certainly some validity in your argument. However we still don't know the full details of what the new season will be like. It may have new story content, intro and lead up. Maybe a couple of new characters or variances that are best explained from the start that makes more sense in a wipe system than in a permanent one. We do not know the full vision of the dev team and will only know when it comes to fruition. All we know is that the wipe system in it's currently proposed format will not hinder your progression in any meaningful way. Whether wipes are necessary at all will only be known after the first one.

But that's the point, they aren't. Wipes aren't necessary. Even with new content you don't need to, multiple games already shown that. Even adding new POIs you don't need to wipe, there's no purpose in wiping, at all.

I know what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna play the game on release until the first wipe. If the wipe bothers me for some reason, I'll simply delete the game and stop playing. I'm a guy who likes to see 100% done, I like to see that I already explored a part of the map and complete everything there... Wiping the map progression, to me, is stupid because everything you do is lost for the sake of "but you don't need to do it again, you can ignore", to me this is utterly stupid.

Why to wipe the map if the intention is to players NOT do the beginning of the map again? If you don't want them to repeat this process, just let everything unlocked, it's really simple.

So far in the what is currently a mismatched bodge of a story, the world is unstable and will be destroyed. Yes the story as it stands is not great but has been in a state of rework for quite a while. The entire story will have been rewritten around this wipe mechanic, they are not going to change this again. Whether or not this is a good thing remains to be seen. I am neither for or against it. This is not other games, it is trying to be its own game. Did they get it right or wrong I have no idea, you have already made up your mind without knowing the full picture, you may be right but you could also be wrong. My point is that you cannot know at this point yet you believe that you already do. Why not just wait and see how it goes? Then if you are right or feel it is necessary voice your opinion based on fact rather than hypothesis?

[D.A.R.K.]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Spud32:

Opprinnelig skrevet av D.A.R.K.:

But that's the point, they aren't. Wipes aren't necessary. Even with new content you don't need to, multiple games already shown that. Even adding new POIs you don't need to wipe, there's no purpose in wiping, at all.

I know what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna play the game on release until the first wipe. If the wipe bothers me for some reason, I'll simply delete the game and stop playing. I'm a guy who likes to see 100% done, I like to see that I already explored a part of the map and complete everything there... Wiping the map progression, to me, is stupid because everything you do is lost for the sake of "but you don't need to do it again, you can ignore", to me this is utterly stupid.

Why to wipe the map if the intention is to players NOT do the beginning of the map again? If you don't want them to repeat this process, just let everything unlocked, it's really simple.

So far in the what is currently a mismatched bodge of a story, the world is unstable and will be destroyed. Yes the story as it stands is not great but has been in a state of rework for quite a while. The entire story will have been rewritten around this wipe mechanic, they are not going to change this again. Whether or not this is a good thing remains to be seen. I am neither for or against it. This is not other games, it is trying to be its own game. Did they get it right or wrong I have no idea, you have already made up your mind without knowing the full picture, you may be right but you could also be wrong. My point is that you cannot know at this point yet you believe that you already do. Why not just wait and see how it goes? Then if you are right or feel it is necessary voice your opinion based on fact rather than hypothesis?

Because of shared experience. Multiple other game developers already had to deal with this situation, learned from prior developers, and dealt with this with ease. What Once Human's developers are doing is to ignore previous experiences to make the same mistake over and over again.

Do you know how humanity evolved to be what it is today? By sharing experiences on how to deal with things. For example, how did we get a COVID vaccine so fast, when prior disease we couldn't? Because multiple countries were trying to make their own vaccine, facing difficulties that other countries already dealt with, and then shared the experience so they didn't have to spend millions on resources to deal with.

Do you know Wakanda from Marvel? The biggest lie is to say they are more advanced than any other country because, being isolated will make them deal with this mistakes that shared information already dealt with it, this is literally how you devolve humanity, by isolating yourself to deal with problems that was already dealt with. It's like having to spend resources on a cure for black plague when other countries already eradicated the disease.

SO... What Once Human's developers are doing? Ignoring completely all other games that had to deal with wiping, and balance, and how to make things good. This will make them repeat the same mistakes over and over again...

My problem with that is there are games releasing like water every single day, every single game developer is fighting over players, NOT BECAUSE OF SAME GENRE but because of TIME. The majority of players can't play 20 hours a day, so, even if John Doe plays only 2 or 3 hours a day, he needs to pick which game he'll play, or a race game or a FPS, completely different genre, but competing genre because of time.

My problem with that is... Six weeks after release people leave the game because if this wiping system, now the player base is ♥♥♥♥ similar to New World, and the developer see that the game failed miserably and decided to end it... So I game that I liked was canceled because the stupid developers didn't do a simple homework to know how to deal with wipes, something that is already established how to do.

Do you get it, now? The whole problem here is people leaving the game because they didn't like the wipe system... SO... Instead of waiting the ♥♥♥♥ hit the fan, how about cleaning up the ♥♥♥♥ before that? That's my point.

[D.A.R.K.]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Spud32:

So far in the what is currently a mismatched bodge of a story, the world is unstable and will be destroyed. Yes the story as it stands is not great but has been in a state of rework for quite a while. The entire story will have been rewritten around this wipe mechanic, they are not going to change this again. Whether or not this is a good thing remains to be seen. I am neither for or against it. This is not other games, it is trying to be its own game. Did they get it right or wrong I have no idea, you have already made up your mind without knowing the full picture, you may be right but you could also be wrong. My point is that you cannot know at this point yet you believe that you already do. Why not just wait and see how it goes? Then if you are right or feel it is necessary voice your opinion based on fact rather than hypothesis?

This is my prediction for the future of this game:
Wipe will come, players will leave, game will die.

[Spud32]

Opprinnelig skrevet av D.A.R.K.:

Do you know how humanity evolved to be what it is today? By sharing experiences on how to deal with things. For example, how did we get a COVID vaccine so fast, when prior disease we couldn't? Because multiple countries were trying to make their own vaccine, facing difficulties that other countries already dealt with, and then shared the experience so they didn't have to spend millions on resources to deal with.

Did you know that we record history in order to learn from it and avoid making the same mistakes over and over again, so why do we keep doing it and making the same mistakes over and over again? Because we believe that it can be done better. Yes it very frequently fails, and then that means everyone says things like 'this has been tried 100 times before and failed every time so why bother'. Then occasionally somebody tries the same thing and gets it right. This could be in the form of a new vaccine, inventing the blue LED, a new genre of computer games etc. The point is just because something has been done before doesn't mean it will fail, it gives it a pretty high likelihood but not certainty. You are already certain and I am done banging my head against a brick wall. Anyway I hope you enjoy the game for however long you play.

[Spud32]

Opprinnelig skrevet av D.A.R.K.:

Opprinnelig skrevet av Spud32:

So far in the what is currently a mismatched bodge of a story, the world is unstable and will be destroyed. Yes the story as it stands is not great but has been in a state of rework for quite a while. The entire story will have been rewritten around this wipe mechanic, they are not going to change this again. Whether or not this is a good thing remains to be seen. I am neither for or against it. This is not other games, it is trying to be its own game. Did they get it right or wrong I have no idea, you have already made up your mind without knowing the full picture, you may be right but you could also be wrong. My point is that you cannot know at this point yet you believe that you already do. Why not just wait and see how it goes? Then if you are right or feel it is necessary voice your opinion based on fact rather than hypothesis?

This is my prediction for the future of this game:
Wipe will come, players will leave, game will die.

That is in my opinion the most likely outcome based on what I have currently seen,it doesn't mean either of us is right though.

[D.A.R.K.]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Spud32:

Opprinnelig skrevet av D.A.R.K.:

Do you know how humanity evolved to be what it is today? By sharing experiences on how to deal with things. For example, how did we get a COVID vaccine so fast, when prior disease we couldn't? Because multiple countries were trying to make their own vaccine, facing difficulties that other countries already dealt with, and then shared the experience so they didn't have to spend millions on resources to deal with.

Did you know that we record history in order to learn from it and avoid making the same mistakes over and over again, so why do we keep doing it and making the same mistakes over and over again? Because we believe that it can be done better. Yes it very frequently fails, and then that means everyone says things like 'this has been tried 100 times before and failed every time so why bother'. Then occasionally somebody tries the same thing and gets it right. This could be in the form of a new vaccine, inventing the blue LED, a new genre of computer games etc. The point is just because something has been done before doesn't mean it will fail, it gives it a pretty high likelihood but not certainty. You are already certain and I am done banging my head against a brick wall. Anyway I hope you enjoy the game for however long you play.

No, people don't do that. They don't keep failing when there's already an answer.
What you said is the literal definition of insanity.

[D.A.R.K.]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Spud32:

Opprinnelig skrevet av D.A.R.K.:

This is my prediction for the future of this game:
Wipe will come, players will leave, game will die.

That is in my opinion the most likely outcome based on what I have currently seen,it doesn't mean either of us is right though.

No, it doesn't, but if the developers can avoid the chance, why to take an unnecessary risk?

The natural human behavior is, once you lose the trust, you lose it forever, there's no return. This happens all the time, you make something so bad that, even if you fix it, people won't trust and won't even try. What we are talking about here is that the developers can change the wipe system NOW, before releasing the game, copying the system that everyone already knows and loves making sure it won't be a problem, OR they can keep going on with this BS system and have a chance to fail miserably.

In your opinion, what would you do? Taking an unnecessary risk for no purpose, because of whatever the reason, or make sure you won't fail because of this specific problem?

[Noodie5]

this is not how it works. Have you never played a game with a season model? Youre current character remains, but to play seasonal content youll make a new charactrer. They wont "delete all of your pgoress"

[D.A.R.K.]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Noodie5:

this is not how it works. Have you never played a game with a season model? Youre current character remains, but to play seasonal content youll make a new charactrer. They wont "delete all of your pgoress"

Wrong.

Read both imagens, your character will be reset, together with the map progression. They'll save everything your character acquire during the game play (it doesn't matter if you are playing season or no). This means that every 6 weeks you'll be forced to create a new character to play the next season, because the previous character won't exist.

Read again.

[Shahrizai]

Opprinnelig skrevet av D.A.R.K.:

Opprinnelig skrevet av Shahrizai:

Character level, map exploration and harvested resources (kinda) is wiped. Everything else stays. Weapon blueprints, house building blueprints, gear mods, cosmetics unlocked, starchrom, that butterfly currency... basically everything else IS carried over between seasons. Even the harvested materials through the season is "kept". I say "kept" because it goes to Eternaland as a building currency there.

Your character will be wiped. Your map exploration will be wiped. You'll start as a new character, in a new world, with everything that previous characters left behind. This IS deleting your character so you start over.

Where am I wrong?

Well, ok, yes, you are correct, you will play from level 1, just like a seasonal character in Diablo or Path of Exile. Its the same concept. You are right about that.

But in Once Human, characters cannot be deleted, so if you ACTUALLY deleted your character, you would also lose the starchrom, the mods and everything else I mentioned above. Map exploration takes a day. Levelling up is timegated with the phases and you have way more time than needed. The hardcore players are done with everything in two days and then have nothing to do for the rest of the phase. So your level wipe really doesn't matter.

What really matters for your "progression", is everything that is kept between the seasons. Mods can only be farmed with controllers, legendary blueprints can only be obtained with Starchrom. These are the things that matters. Your harvested iron and wood logs and character level is completely irrelevant.

In other words, you are only complaining about irrelevant stuff. Do you see?
So... yes, I see what you mean, its like a deleted character. Fine, I will give you that if you compare it to other games. But Once Human is Once Human. Its not Diablo. All that matters for your account is carried over between seasons. So just play the game and have fun :)

[D.A.R.K.]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Shahrizai:

Well, ok, yes, you are correct, you will play from level 1, just like a seasonal character in Diablo or Path of Exile. Its the same concept. You are right about that.

Here's the problem... It isn't the same concept because it isn't ONLY your seasonal character, it's all characters, because there's no permanent characters. That's the simple solution that literally every single game uses, instead of wiping your character and map progression, they change the character from seasonal character to permanent character. The difference is that we don't lose our character progression neither our map progression.

Opprinnelig skrevet av Shahrizai:

But in Once Human, characters cannot be deleted, so if you ACTUALLY deleted your character, you would also lose the starchrom, the mods and everything else I mentioned above.

I only played Beta 3, I don't know much about the game. From what I know, everything but your character level, skill tree, and map progression stays, things that you got that could be shared between characters and account-bind stays, so I expected that mods would also stay. I don't know what is Starchrom, by the way. When I say "deleted" I starting over, like a new character, because this is what it is, resetting your character and the map progression IS starting from 0, which means you are creating a new character.

[D.A.R.K.]

I told this BS system would be the end of the game, now eat it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKXu63iOlAA&ab_channel=Cohh

[D.A.R.K.]

Please, devs, you'll still have time to change this wipe system.

[Jagdkommando]

Opprinnelig skrevet av E.:

This system was added because of the lack of content in the game, from multiple people I have heard the content can be cleared in very little time, so they likely added this to cover that up.

So the problem for them then becomes what do they do if they add none wipe servers?

To me they would make more money and players if they just have none wipe serves people will come back to do the seasonal content knowing their stuff is still there

So instead of adding content, devs prefer not to work and earn money with this sh.itty resets??? And some players just justify this behavior???